Hydroptere's advantage

I was pondering the outright sailing speed record that Hydroptere currently holds. I am not sure how Hydroptere's speed is calculated, but for all the other crafts (windsurfers, kiteboards, sailrocket, etc) that have attemted, they (I think) have been sailing a measured course between two fixed points and are at the mercy of whatever wind and wave conditions may exist while on the course. If Hydroptere's speed is calculated at any random set of points, this would give them a HUGE advantage. Am I right in my thinking?

I'm no expert on how they certify sailing speed records but I think you are talking about a "Certified record" which I believe would require the fixed distance you are talking about. No doubt all of the above (sailboards, kites, Hydroptere, etc.) would all have a momentarily faster speed when conditions were perfect, somewhere inside the length of the course, but the average speed over the total course is what is being used for the certified records.

Yes, the fixed distance is required, but with Hydroptere, was that fixed distance between two fixed points (as used with sailboards etc.) or random points that make up that distance whenver the boat is at peak performance?

What really annoys the kite and windsurfers is that Hydroptere (and Sailrocket) are allowed to practically do their record attempts anywhere and anytime they please while "they" are basically restricted to one or two events a year organised by the WRSSC.
Even though the new handheld GPSs are extremely accurate (doppler speed measurements).

The rules can be found here:

http://www.sailspeedrecords.com/ind...amp;view=article&id=88&Itemid=28

One item of note for the 500metre course:
"The course may be defined by posts and transits ashore (Transits shall not converge), or by WSSRC approved GPS survey equipment."

Cheshirecatman

Also of note:

"Calculation

For all courses offshore and the course of distance run in 24 hours, coordinates shall be in latitude and longitude using the WGS84 datum, and distances will be calculated as the great circle on a sphere on which 1 minute of latitude = 1 nautical mile.

For the calculation of distances on the courses of half a kilometre and one nautical mile, GPS coordinates supplied to the WSSRC shall be in latitude and longitude using the WGS84 datum. The WSSRC will calculate the distance as the length of a geodesic on the WGS84 ellipsoid using the Vincenty method."

All love to all boat types and all, but isn't doing record runs in a man made trench dug at the perfect angle to the wind with high berms to prevent chop on a boat that won't float a human at rest, or sailing one way up a course and getting towed back to the other end all the advantage one needs?

I'm guessing the problem is with the other crafts (windsurfers, kiteboards, sailrocket, etc): They don't have enough space and no power to sustain the necessary GPS survey equipment that the WSSRC requires, the most important point being an antenna in a fixed position on the craft.

Answer - No!
I think you have missed something somewhere. L'hydroptere is a 'proper' boat and set its new records in Hyeres harbour. What does that tell you about the percieved advantage of trench specials? L'hydroptere is both awesome at speed and incredibly graceful as it accelerates and lifts onto its foils.
It caused quite a stir when it tacked behind me whilst I was racing in the Raid d'houat one year. Ever had that 'where the ... did that come from' feeling?

http://www.hydroptere.com/_en/

Cheshirecatman

maybe an advantage - but it's a real boat that can do it's amazing things in real water.

It carries a special GPS system that (I forget the details) has some redundancy...I think two or three separate systems that have to agree within a given percentage to be ratified.

The windsurfer / sailboard guys and gals can most certainly make their test runs whenever they wish - as long as they can afford to have an official present for each attempt. I do believe Hydroptere (and other speed craft making runs) pay to have an official present to ratify the results.

I like the fact that Hydroptere holds the record. It's about time an actual boat did. I think though that the ability to set a record over the particular 500 meters that the boat was going the fastest gives it an unfair advantage over those who must set the record between "this buoy and that buoy". If I were trying for the record on a windsurfer, I'd be a bit miffed over that advantage.

"What really annoys the kite and windsurfers is that Hydroptere ..."
This goes the other way as well the kite and windsurfers most often sail in water that often only inches deep.
I don't think that Hydroptere would brake any records on a tidal flat when the tide is in and the water is 12' deep. Did it go un-noticed that their record was set in conditions that included 5' waves.

Sailrocket and Macquarie Innovation have been carrying GPS gear for a while now, mostly to validate the timing post data. It is fairly high end survey gear that I believe uses differential GPS to achieve high accuracy.

My understanding is that L'Hydroptere is benefitting from the validation process Macquarie Innovation went through with the WSSRC to be able to use that gear. Previously you had to use a timing system between two fixed points. Moving those fixed points, then getting your new speed track validated by WSSRC, to the suit the best angle to the wind would be a nightmare without being able to use DGPS. Hence it would've been very difficult for l'hydroptere to hold its current record without DGPS data.

As with most things, there are pros and cons to the different solutions. I happen to think that Macquarie Innovation will probably put together another record breaking run before it is put out to pasture, just a matter of time.

And SailRocket hits the water tomorrow. Paul has BIG brass ones.

http://www.sailrocket.com/blogs

Last year kite and windsurfers entered an agreement with the WSSRC that official records can no longer be sailed in inch deep waters but must be +/-50cm.
Kitesurfers have in the past used so called liquid-ice conditions (2" deep).

But what is the definition of a "proper boat" anyway?
Is Hydroptere a proper boat? IMHO it is a sailing hydrofoil.

It's certainly more of a boat than any board craft. We just need to class these types of craft. It's no different than land speed records. There are many different classes that hold records. We are looking at the same thing. The fastest board, foiler,etc. Ultimately there is the fastest of all. It doesn't matter what kind of craft it is, it's the fastest.

The plan I read about (can not find it now) is that the current model (of Hydroptere) is prototype for a 100 footer that will be used in a "Jules Verne Trophy" attempt some time in the future.

I'm interested in where the money comes from and why sailing seems to be such a good advertising investment in France (and the rest of Europe).