TEAMVMG-does your son race h16spin and did he win the SL16 2007 Youth Gold cup?
Matt-I'm sorry about pushing you guys on the issue but the youth interest in the Youth Multihull Champs has increased and I was hoping that some regional youth spin racing could start.Anyway my dog is ageing out this year.

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Anyway my dog is ageing out this year

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rather than just talk about it, and talking is what people have been doing for at least 20 years. The "kids" when the talking started are now 35 years old.

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How many cat sailors are there with kids in the junior ranks?

It looks like that for 35 years.... It has never hit a critical mass in any region/division.

What is your best guess for 2008 ..... 100 kids... 200 kids...

Hmm....

Mark -- add a zero to your numbers.

In Area L (the Pacific NW) we have identified 40 kids we are going to target. Now all of them may not go for it, and still others might join that we haven't yet identified.

But if there are 40 in the Pacific NW, there has to be 1,000-2,000 nationwide. Not a bad start...cuz it is only a start!! We're gonna keep building this thing!

Once we have a bonafide youth program up and running, I wonder what the numbers will look like!!!

The (adult) spin debate is best left for another discussion, I think. Yes, the rules can be changed. But, we (the MEMBERSHIP) voted on this a few years ago, it didn't pass.

The volunteers that "run" the class don't have as much power as you think. TEAMVMG (and anyone else thinking about this), as one of those volunteers, I implore you not to insult us and expect to be taken seriously.

I'd love to see a circuit of youth events across the country flying chutes off H16s. We are many, many years (programs) away from anything like that. I truly believe we can get there, but we need to start with what is commonly available now and build up to that.

My son is about 15 months old. I hope that by the time he's ready for an Opti, we have built an alternative cat program. I'm interested in positive discussions with anyone willing to help.

Mike

Hi Peter

While I hope you are right.... You have a very community based access program which is focused on cat sailing as a lifetime activity.... You report on 6 or so kids who are into racing. (Kudos to your region's commitment and success!)

You are one of three programs that people have voluntereed info on.... not exactly a wide foundation of junior cat sailing in the country.

When I look at the regatta scene.... I am guessing 10 or 12 kids who are regularly sailing with parents or friends of parents in areas like Area C, (Hobie Div 11.... might have 25 different kids at events on 16's and 18's over the year.)

Hobie NA keeps track of kids participation at nationals... but doesn't deal with the grass roots stuff at the division and fleet levels. So... it's hard to get a number on the number and ages of kids in the various fleets.

If the average age of a cat sailor is close to 45 or 50...
We might not have all that many of our own kids.... much less kids who get hooked sailing.

What I am coming to understand is that I may be overestimating the number of junior racers and interest out there. (certainly no interest in an east coast CISA program)

We lost the only stand alone jr cat regatta on the chesapeake this year...to my dismay... the interest in replacing the event has been underwhelming. Div 11 did not schedule any jr only races this year. They have opted for a grant program to get individual kids to worlds and national events and that is the program.

I am really surprised that more regions don't have any catsailor forum members who step and say.... "OH... we do XXX for our junior sailors, we have YY who are at fleet events over the year and this is our program."

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What I am coming to understand is that I may be overestimating the number of junior racers and interest out there.

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Yep, I think we all overestimate -- at least in the United States. Most of the cat racing activity is in the eastern half of the United States, and that is with a relatively small number of active adult racers spread over a huge area. So why would we think there would be enough junior cat sailors? An affinity for catamaran sailing (or ANY sailing) is not genetic.

It all goes back to the way it has always been done through US Sailing, with sailing/racing youth camps at the yacht clubs and the fleet racing done on a regional basis through the Regional Sailing Associations, with ladder step regattas leading to national championships.

You guys are trying to re-invent the wheel, and it isn't going to work. The yacht clubs don't want to bring in catamarans as another fleet, because it will take kids from their existing fleet racing programs. And catamaran sailors just aren't organized enough -- and never will be, I hope.

Cripe, look at the two clubs Rick and I belong to. We have developed a fleet of 10 Waves at Put-in-Bay Yacht Club. We race twice a week and it is the ONLY racing program going on at that club. The Junior Sailing Program there, which goes on for about six weeks in early summer prior to Junior Bay Week, uses 420's and Lasers and maybe a couple of Flying Juniors (or whatever it is).

Why do they use those boats? Because those are the boats that are raced by the juniors in all the clubs in the RSA, and the elite racing crews travel to events within the region, with financial sponsorship from the club, I am sure.

Right after Junior Bay week in late July, all the junior boats are packed away in the barn except for a couple for the "elite" racing teams to use when they travel to events within the RSA. Do any of the other kids who participated in the sailing camp in early summer complain and ask why they can't continue using the boats and racing for the rest of the summer? NO! They really don't care. The sailing camp apparently is something their parents make them do.

At our club in Key Largo, we have developed a fleet of 12 Waves and we race there twice a week, as well. Again, the Waves are the ONLY active racing fleet at the club. The club has an ongoing junior sailing/racng program, and the club recently purchased four used 420's from another facility. Why? Because those are the boats that are used in the regional high school and club racing.

We have invited the junior sailors to come out and race with us in our series races Wednesday and Sunday, but they never do. Again, the kids really don't care about it.

Chip and Barb Short have this great program for kids in Islamorada (just south of Key Largo), and they are having great success in getting kids excited about sailing. But most of the kids are VERY adamant that they want nothing to do with racing. They just want to go out and sail and have fun and practice capsizing and righting and stuff like that. But at least in the process they ARE learning how to sail and are having fun at it. And, even better, they are learning on catamarans!!

So maybe that is what it is really all about when we are dealing with young kids and young teens. At least they are learning to love being on the water in sailboats. And that's kind of how it was for me when I was a kid -- and kind of how it still is, and maybe why I still feel like a kid.

"My son is about 15 months old. I hope that by the time he's ready for an Opti, we have built an alternative cat program. I'm interested in positive discussions with anyone willing to help."


Optis! BLEH! We don't need no stinkin' prams for our catsailing kids!

If they are old enough and big enough to sail an Opti they can sail on Waves, 2 together. They start out learning how to work together as crew.

We've successfully been throwing 7-8 year olds on Hobie Waves for coming up on 3 years now. Once they've been on the Waves they turn their noses up at Optis and Sunfish.

There's 4 "commands" they need to know for you to coach them: push, pull, in, out. Push and pull is for the tiller and in and out is for the sheet.

Don't waste time talking on shore. Show them what you mean by push, pull, in and out. Then push them off. Some will instinctively figure things out on their own within minutes. The rest you spend your time going from boat to boat using the 4 simple commands they learned on shore.

"TEAMVMG-does your son race h16spin and did he win the SL16 2007 Youth Gold cup?"

yes - both my boys are active, we also won round texel youth and Dragoon europeans in 2007 - a good year for the team [I won Nothing!]

I shall dip out of this debate as I am up winding the good guys up........