If you are the owner of a Nacra 20 could you please PM me your Name, Email and best contact number. I'm trying to put together a database of owners to develop an owner's association.
Thanks
Todd A. Hart

BUMP

Thanks for doing this. You should have received an email from me with our 14 owners info. Let me know when I can do something else. Still working on front flips so don't ask for that just yet.

It's the backflips that'll get you.
Thanks for the info. We are steadily pulling it together. So far I've got 35 owners.

pm sent Todd

Didn't get it.

Todd, did you get my PM?

yep , Mary sent me one for Dave,from your account. He has a 6.0,(he needs an N-20)That's what that was all about. Do y'all need a mirror for Christmas,"handsome Rick"?

bump

how many are you up to so far?

51

Trey, Tawd and everyone, why can't we move forward with this loophole for distance racing like Tybee and GT? It really gives us quite a bit of leeway as long as the race organizers are on board with it.

I won't support opening up sails for distance races, it creates nothing but an arms race. I do think that we, as a class, can drive quality, consistency, and some development in the N20 sails through EP, but opening up the sails won't help the class or race.

After experiencing F18, I'm not sure I agree about the arms race scenario...but I do agree that it would not be to the benefit of the class to open up the sails if nothing else but from the 'perception' of an arms race. So, yes, I agree with Trey.

I am against the double standards concept. One standard please.

In general terms, I prefer open sail makers with a standard sail plan. I migrated to catamarans from a Thistle and from what I could tell this works really well for them. The people who want to sell sails end up actually sailing in the class and I think this is very good.

In specific terms for the here and now, I like the current approach of lets get the quality improved. I like this because I think we lack the self control to have one standard sail plan with open sail makers at this time. Just looking at myself, it has taken me 5 different classes of boats to find one that fits me and that’s just in the last ten years.

We have 11 N20's in our Fleet, with 3 more in the area, one being simi-active and two inactive. That is probably equates to 22 mains, 25 jibs, and 30 spins. I'm preparing for a sail measurement day, or three days as necessary. Hmmm, this may actually take a while.

What to measure:
Spins: Luff, Leach, Foot, and Mid-girth
Jibe: Luff, Leach, Foot and ?
Main: Luff, Leach, Foot, Square-Top, Luff Curve, Position of Max-Luff Curve, and ?

Anything else?

When you do buy a new sail do you get a tuning guide? No? Why the @#$%!%^! Not? Even Opti sails have a tuning guide associated with them. Lets see while I’m digressing, I just purchased a new jib, hmmm …. No sailmaker stickers….no class stickers….tell tales nope…shape, size, and workmanship does seem okay or at least similar to my last jib.

Btw, the last set of 6.0 sails we purchased the sailmaker brought them to me, helped me rig them, help me with mast tuning, sailed with me before and after the new sails, made a minor adjustment to the luff curve on the main, fine tuned the batten selection . . .

Todd, I think I just witnessed you receiving similar treatment with that LALB you brought up here...

I'm with Chris.

I don't think a double standard will help our class at all.

A lot of us like to sail in distance and one-design events. A double standard would make us feel like we have to have two sets of sails for the different events. Then you've just doubled my cost in sails.

If it's open for one it should be open for all in my opinion.

Now as for opening up the sails. Unless you are personally willing to come and measure all the sails for distance and National events then I don't think you need to push for opening up the sail plan. I tried to get sails measured for our F18's here at Carlyle. Nobody was interested in taking the time away from the beer truck to measure sails. We don't have the commitment or knowledge in the fleet. Ok so a few people do have the knowledge but they would rather drink beer. Measuring sails is a bit of a pain and if you've never done it then don't say it isn't. It takes time to get it right. Sailmakers make mistakes and then they have to be fixed before the regatta. It's a big pain. We use to do it in the P19's so I have some experience here.

So let's not jump the gun here. Of course anyone is able to buy a set of sails from anyone they want and race open class. I think Mark Smith did this. I haven't heard that his new set is any faster than the stock EP's. The only place that we still sail one-design is at Nationals and Tybee that I know of.

I don't like the idea of an arms race. I don't have a problem with an announced plan for EP to update his sails on a 3 year program of some kind. It would be good for EP and get the sailors an updated sail plan. Of course, EP would have to be willing to work on the cut which I'm sure wouldn't be a problem.

I don't want to show up at a Nationals to find out that there is a new cut someone is "trying out". That would piss me off. I'd probably dump the boat if that crap started happening. Nothing pisses me off more than to work all year to be ready for a Nationals only to find out that you have brought a knife to a gun fight.

Mike, that's not quite a fair statement about "rather drink beer". I was there and after I walked the two guys (who had never measured a sail) through measuring a set of sails, they realized they didn't have the resources needed to measure every boat there. It's a very time consuming labor intensive process that is regularly underestimated and you can't expect someone to start measuring at a 40 or 50 boat event without significant planning, prior training, space allocation, and tools (including a computer).

Measuring sails (and I mean REALLY measuring them like you have to do with F18 - not just laying them over a template) is a very time consuming process. With some light assistance, it takes me about an hour to do an F18 main, jib, and spinnaker (I could probably work it down to 30 minutes with some practice and a trained assistant...I could probably get it under 20 minutes per set with some jigs and fixtures and several spare hands). Multiply that by 50 boats and you're talking about quite an undertaking.

Yes but they do compensate you for your time. probably about 70 bucks for the set of sails... And... any sailmaker who did not build the sail can get approved by the class and measure your sail well ahead of the regatta.

So... what's better... Sails that are measured or a faith based system that the says... trust us... they are all the same.

Not at the event they don't (didn't).

Now you've just added $70 bucks to my sail. Am I saving money yet????

Jake, I was in no means trying to call you out at all. I know you would have worked to do this if I would have worked to help make it happen. Calling you out was not my point at all. My point is that you have to have people willing to really work on this. I don't think we have that in our N20 fleet. I haven't seen it happen yet in the F18 fleet either (I could be wrong I haven't been to the last couple of F18 Nationals). My point was it's a lot of work which you helped me make with your post.