Yes, I have been looking for an affordable used boat and can't find one, especially considering the extra shipping here to Hawaii.

Who are you? I was in Ann Arbor a couple of weekends ago with a Viper.

(edit)- Also currently in CRAW we have a used Blade, Falcon, and Viper available. I'm not sure the age of the Blade, but the Falcon was new last spring, and the Viper hasn't even hit the US yet, and I can get you a new Viper as well.

Wayne, If you seriously think that the development done on the F20 foils will negate any development costs for a curved foil for an F16 then i'm sorry to tell you this: You have no idea what you are on about!




I can tell you from experience that the cost to build a mold for a curved board is a much more complex process and the costs are a lot higher in all steps, design, billet, cutting time, finishing, and even foil production. If you have a cheaper way then please let me know..




And you base this assumption on your extensive experience with both straight and curved foils?? I can tell you from my time with both foils that there is nothing in current technology that makes as much difference to the performance of a boat that the change from straight to curved foils. If all else is equal (ie sail area and dimensions of the boat etc) then the curved foils make a bigger gain in performance than any other feature.

Well this is not completly thru. We are experimenting a lot with both configurations ( straight and curved ) and to be honest which type will be really quicker we still do not now. It depends a lot on the conditions ( wind , wave ). We do know for sure that in light wind the curved boards are definitly slower then straight boards.

Hans

Hans,

You would be referring to an A Class? There are several issues in using the A class as a basis for foil testing: With the class rules restricting the curvature of the boards and also the fact that the righting moment is reduced with curved boards (A Class is already narrow for its length) plus the fact that the A Class is not adding any sail area downwind. all these factors reduce the impact of the foils in a performance test.

We did many hours testing with identical platforms and changed only the foils. The results were conclusive: Curved foils were always better on a 2 person, 3 sailed boat with a wider ratio to length than an A class.

Yes , i refer to A-class but the curvature of the boards is not restricted, the only restriction is that the tips of the boards when full down not closer is then 1500 mm. There is some room there to play with and there are several different type of curves used at the moment.
I go with you when you are adding a spin on the boat , in the F16 you may have canted boards ( 6 degrees )and in certain conditions with the spi flying this is helping the stabilty of the boat. I am not sure if the curved board will work on a F16 ( i am going to try that one day ) because the boat is relative short and that is maybe a disadvantage.

The shorter the boat, the better foils should work, it would need some thinking out of the box as to correct placement as upwind and downwind would be two quite different issues, I think there was a Dutch development 20ft boat a few years ago that tried a 4 board system with straight boards, perhaps if they were to repeat that with the knowledge learnt from curved boards, they may get interesting results.

Macca it is too bad you have "pissed in the sandbox" so many times...On this occasion you actually have something of substance to say... some interesting inside insight into curved boards design as done by NACRA, unfortunately few appear to want to listen to you based on your past pointless pot stirring...too bad...I think there are some golden nuggets that could be gleamed from your experience on this particular subject.

Didn't any of your marketing professors tell you..."Its not what you say that people remember...but how you made them feel"

waynemarlow....interesting you mentioned the four board system...I was thinking of that myself...it seems like it could be the next natural progression of the curved boards...a forward and rear board that could be raised and lowered to dial in the proper lift and for/aft balance could be an interesting experiment...might think of the single foil of the current boats as being similar in principal to a unicycle and a two board boat (per hull) similar to a bicycle...

Instead of doing a "wheelie" it might translate that power into forward thrust...of course if the front foil loses lift and the rear stays hooked up...wow...talk about a neck breaking catapult...LOL

No matter what foils you put on, straight put on at an angle or curved with or without twist the thing I don't get is how do you control the foiling (even if it is only partial foiling).

It seems to me you need a way to dynamically control the stance of the boat to avoid the F20 carbon "jump", or the "dive dive dive" if by mistake you start to pitchpole. I understand that weight placement and how far you put the board down will help but it will never be as reactive as the combination throttle tiller/active wand of the moth, the trifoiler palpers or the self regulating foils from the hydroptere/white dragon.

IMHO the next chapter in multihull foiling is not in curved boards, it's on how you control them. The more speed you have, the less angle you need, so as you accelerate something has to change somewhere to keep the lift under control.

Anyway, I'm not even sure why this discussion is in the F16 forum: F16 rules prohibit foiling in multiple way so if you want a foil fix hit the gym first then get yourself a moth or a rs600 (foiling on the wire!).