When you switch from an end pole snuffer to a mid pole is it necessary to add a 3rd hole or patch for the snuffer rope to better pull the spinnaker into it's bag?
If so can somebody provide the approximate locations for the 3?
Thanks!

yes, you typically will need three patches to gather the spinnaker in enough to fit the shorter snuffer sock. Chances are that your two existing snuffer points are not in the correct locations for the mid-pole, so you will need to add three.

1) measure the length of the sock from the grommet at the back to the aft side of the hoop (basically the area of the sock that will completely cover the spinnaker). Subtract 8 to 12 inches. This is the length the spinnaker will be when snuffed.

2) lay the spinnaker out on the ground and stake the corners

3) take two (or three) pieces of string and tie an open eye on one end (large enough to fit around your stakes).

4) mark or cut each piece of string to the measurement you took of your snuffer sock.

5) loop each piece of string around each stake/corner of the spinnaker.

6) at the bottom of the spinnaker, bring the two pieces of string together so that their ends meet, taught, from the tack and the clew. Put a piece of tape there. This is one of the snuffer points (any longer and the spinnaker will be hanging out of the sock when snuffed).

7) take the string at the head and pull it towards the mark you just made at the bottom of the kite. Put a piece of tape at the end of that string.

8) If the distance between these two marks is less than the snuffer distance you measured, you don't need a third grommet (but chances are you will. If the third grommet is needed, simply measure halfway between the top and bottom mark and put a third piece of tape there.

These are your snuffer points.

Jake, Thanks a lot!
Great explanation. Sounds easy.

Nice, Quantum sails took 3 weeks waiting on word from EP as to where to put my retrieval patches on my EP chute. Then charged me 180 bucks to do it. You'd think a sailmaker could figure that out.

Apparently the sailmakers need to hire more engineers ;-)

I was rethinking that 8-10 inch subtraction and I think that's too much. I would re-recommend only subtracting 2 inches or so to minimize the size of the wad the spinnaker makes when snuffing. This will put the corners of the chute closer to the sniffer hoop but should still be fully retrieved.

Jake, what if the distance between the 2 points is more than twice as long as one of the strings? A 4th patch?

In other words my snuffer measurement is 6' 10".
I located the 2 points as you said. 1 at bottom between the clew & tack and 1 from the head. The distance between the 2 points is 16'.

Is a 4th patch necessary or will a middle patch do the job?

This is a spinnaker for a Bimare 18HT - 34' mast.

Thanks for your help!

I would start increasing the string radius up to 2+ I ches of the sniffer measurement. You do not want to need 4 sniffer points. It's hard enough to sniff with three. I'm getting ready to dive into graphic work - let me make a drawing to make sure we're talking about the same thing. I've had to do this for stock I20 kites before and the center point was usually much closer to the other two points than the max measurement.

Sorry, iPad keeps spell correcting sniffer.

OR...you could ask one of the guys here who has a mid pole I20 snuffer to lay out his spinny on the livingroom floor and measure the 3 patches distance down from the head. Might be quicker than all that measuring with strings, etc.

Snuffer. My iPad can do it. Lol. Get to the last letter, type it in then back space and re enter the last letter. BAM! Spelling correction on iPad blows.

The middle location should be centered between the upper and lower locations. When the kite snuffs the distance between the upper and center and lower and center is reduced in half. I think you said you had 16' between the top and bottom locations and if you put the center location at 8'(centered between top and bottom patches) when snuffed it would be half that 4'. Lay it out and grab all the patch locations together before sewing.

That just dawned on me and I logged in to reply to that. Thanks Dave!

Dave & Jake, your right!
I spent the afternoon at my sons baseball games and thought it out. Even drew it out and realized I only needed the middle patch as well.
Daves calculation was spot on.
Taking this further the measurement between the upper & lower patch could be up to 28' (on my sail) and would require a middle patch.
And if the upper & lower patches were within 14' then, as stated earlier, the center patch isn't necessary.
When making the first measurements I had already built in a cushion by measuring 6'8" instead of 7' figuring for material stretch etc.
Thanks for your help guys!

Yeah - but I type and dont look at it until I'm done. At that point, going back to correct it is a pain.

PS i fly an old style (wide shoulders) Tornado spin and it has only 2 patches. I use a mid pole system (capricorn style) without problem (now that the headboard is broken in)