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Re: In Defense of US Sailing [Re: BrianK] #101319
03/23/07 10:38 AM
03/23/07 10:38 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,293
Long Beach, California
John Williams Offline
Carpal Tunnel
John Williams  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,293
Long Beach, California
Quote
Your a product of the man. Im making a JW/US Sailing "1984" video right now.


Product of the man? Dude. I see what you're doing right now and you should be ashamed.


John Williams

- The harder you practice, the luckier you get -
Gary Player, pro golfer

After watching Lionel Messi play, I realize I need to sail harder.
-- Have You Seen This? --
Re: In Defense of US Sailing [Re: Keith] #101320
03/23/07 11:33 AM
03/23/07 11:33 AM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 887
Crofton, MD
Chris9 Offline
old hand
Chris9  Offline
old hand

Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 887
Crofton, MD
What your size? I'll have them cut one for you. Mines standard gov't issue. Save the club some money that way. Have you been to the subject clubs website and looked at the Board Picture? Our two cat-sailing Board members must have forgotten their Blue Blazers on picture day!

While your there, check out the A-classers webpage and ours as well. Look at the picture at the top. What do you see?

BTW, it was your idea that started our local movement. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> It just took three or so years to get the YOUR idea moving, someone else to put their toe in, some more being prodded and that brings us to today.


Chris Allen
Nacra 20 Gertie
www.wrcra.org
Re: In Defense of US Sailing [Re: Chris9] #101321
03/23/07 12:22 PM
03/23/07 12:22 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 1,459
Annapolis,MD
Keith Offline
veteran
Keith  Offline
veteran

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 1,459
Annapolis,MD
Quote
What your size? I'll have them cut one for you. Mines standard gov't issue. Save the club some money that way. Have you been to the subject clubs website and looked at the Board Picture? Our two cat-sailing Board members must have forgotten their Blue Blazers on picture day!

While your there, check out the A-classers webpage and ours as well. Look at the picture at the top. What do you see?

BTW, it was your idea that started our local movement. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> It just took three or so years to get the YOUR idea moving, someone else to put their toe in, some more being prodded and that brings us to today.


It may need to be XXXXXXL if it needs to cover my ego! Just funnin' on the blazer, although I think they'd look fine with ratty shorts and a Hawaiian print shirt! One that would fit me properly might resemble a straight jacket...

You guys have a website? Way cooool!

Actually, as much as I like to take credit for other people's work, the idea for infiltration came from none other than Art Stevens when he brought Fast and Fun to town. "Nice club, you guys should join up and take it over" - I think that's almost an exact quote, maybe slightly paraphrased, after he saw the "club in question" and toured the impressive facilities of the WRCRA (I don't believe we even had our wonderful porta-potti at that point, but maybe a fresh load of oyster shells on the launch ramp).

I do freely admit to spreading Art's gospel. Ironic seeing that I haven't joined...

Re: In Defense of US Sailing [Re: Chris9] #101322
03/23/07 12:34 PM
03/23/07 12:34 PM
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 126
Northern Virginia
SoggyCheetoh Offline
member
SoggyCheetoh  Offline
member

Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 126
Northern Virginia
Chris - so where's this Nacra20 website your talking about. I can't find any mention of the Nacra20 anywhere on the WRSC website.


Alec D.
Pirates of the Chesapeake www.teampiratesofthechesapeake.com
Nacra20 1057 - Crew
F16 Viper 152 - Uni
Re: In Defense of US Sailing [Re: SoggyCheetoh] #101323
03/23/07 12:47 PM
03/23/07 12:47 PM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,049
Sebring, Florida.
Timbo Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Timbo  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,049
Sebring, Florida.
John, you put on that jacket and a tie and you are a "Sell-out"! I say you go in flip-flops, dirty shorts and smelly red Hawaiian shirt, sloppy drunk, and tell them to "Accpet Multihulls or DIE!" Then throw up on the Chairman's shoes... <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />


Blade F16
#777
Re: In Defense of US Sailing [Re: John Williams] #101324
03/23/07 01:46 PM
03/23/07 01:46 PM
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 503
BrianK Offline
addict
BrianK  Offline
addict

Joined: May 2004
Posts: 503
Quote
Quote
Your a product of the man. Im making a JW/US Sailing "1984" video right now.


Product of the man? Dude. I see what you're doing right now and you should be ashamed.


Better put my aluminum foil hat back on (p.s. its shaped like a duck).

Re: In Defense of US Sailing [Re: BrianK] #101325
03/23/07 04:41 PM
03/23/07 04:41 PM
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,114
BANNED
MauganN20 Offline
Carpal Tunnel
MauganN20  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,114
BANNED
Quote
Quote
Quote
Your a product of the man. Im making a JW/US Sailing "1984" video right now.


Product of the man? Dude. I see what you're doing right now and you should be ashamed.


Better put my aluminum foil hat back on (p.s. its shaped like a duck).



And we wonder why we're not taken seriously :P

Re: In Defense of US Sailing [Re: MauganN20] #101326
03/23/07 05:35 PM
03/23/07 05:35 PM
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 5,558
Key Largo, FL & Put-in-Bay, OH...
Mary Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Mary  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 5,558
Key Largo, FL & Put-in-Bay, OH...
I was thinking the same thing. Actually, I think that a lot when reading the forums. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Re: In Defense of US Sailing [Re: waterbug_wpb] #101327
03/23/07 06:06 PM
03/23/07 06:06 PM
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 337
Victoria, Australia
C2 Mike Offline
enthusiast
C2 Mike  Offline
enthusiast

Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 337
Victoria, Australia
Quote
multi sailors have always been counter-establishment, so I guess this situation is the fuit of our effort (or lack thereof)

I'll have to go with you on that JW and Mark. If you're going to bitch, you'd better be a member.

NAMSA tried to "start our own village" that catered primarily to multihulls. It directed its efforts at exactly what everyone is whining about, but looking at the numbers, very few actually stepped up to the plate to encourage change. A herculean effort was put in place by those that did, but when it came time for people to join up, interest and support waned.

I guess $35 per year is too substantial a price for sailors. That's about two Harken 8mm micro blocks, isn't it?

Maybe Mary's suggestion is best: Join under Golden Anchor to be listed as a multihull, and then the sheer numbers will require us to be dealt with as an equal, not a red-headed stepchild.

I've never dissed all that US Sailing offers, just never had the need to take advantage of it. My fault, not theirs.

And yes, join your local yacht club too, especially if it's built by sailors like you. The yacht club here is mostly powerboats, and the membership fee is around $60,000 per year (plus monthly food/bev. minimums). Now, that is something a little too pricey for me.

The sail club, however, is much more reasonable ($50 per year?), and while I don't have all the time to go to the meetings, I still want to support my local club (and they've got a handful of bigger multis and tris)

So, for less than $100 per year (a modest dinner for the family) I've supported TWO organizations, and then have the right to complain about stuff!

Cough up your dang money and vote... Or shut the heck up.


It isn't the money. Set it at $1 or $1000 and you will still have the same problem. Whenever people are presented with a bill that is "optional" a large percentage of them won't pay.

Reading between the lines, I think US sailing have made life worse for themselves because a significant proportion of the greater sailing community perceive no value for them (actual reality doesn't matter). This is 100% a failing on US sailings part as they either don't provide any value to the sailors OR they have failed to communicate it effectively.

Next - how to get those who see benefit but still don't contribute to cough up.

I refer to the Australian model because it is the one I know and it seems to work. Yachting Australia and it's individual state affiliates do offer an extraordinary level of support to Australian sailors both directly and via resources for clubs to successfully host regattas.

YA (Yachting Australia) collects it's fees via the individual clubs who collect the money. There would only be a handful of clubs in Australia who are not affiliated with YA. Whenever a regatta is run in Australia, as a condition of entry, all sailors are required to hold a membership of a YA affiliated club. All members get a YA silver card which verifies this and is required for entry to all regattas.

The system is not perfect and I'm sure there are some who slip thru but overall it does work well.

Of course this doesn't solve our Olympic problem. As a wider conspiracy theory - does this mean that any sport where the good ol' US of A isn't a good chance of winning will eventually be out??? <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" />

Tiger Mike

Re: In Defense of US Sailing [Re: SoggyCheetoh] #101328
03/23/07 06:55 PM
03/23/07 06:55 PM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 887
Crofton, MD
Chris9 Offline
old hand
Chris9  Offline
old hand

Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 887
Crofton, MD
Send me the pictures and maybe I show you. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> It is right in front of you nose Adam!


Chris Allen
Nacra 20 Gertie
www.wrcra.org
Re: In Defense of US Sailing [Re: Chris9] #101329
03/23/07 07:29 PM
03/23/07 07:29 PM
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 613
New Hampshire, USA
windswept Offline
addict
windswept  Offline
addict

Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 613
New Hampshire, USA
You know, I have worked extensively in fundraising and with foundations through my profession and though it is not easy, it is attainable to setup sailing foundations and get fundraising efforts together. On another subject, reading though alot of these threads on this issue, it is pretty clear why WE are not taken that seriously. It needs to start here, with us as a group of concerned sailors. We need to get serious and lead the way instead of keeping the role of outcasts, mis-fits and the number of other thoughts given towards the multihull community.

Yes, again I am a US Sailing member and I am so that I can have a voice in this and other issues that concern me and this sport.


Tom Siders
A-Cat USA-79
Tornado US775
Re: In Defense of US Sailing [Re: Mark Schneider] #101330
03/23/07 11:16 PM
03/23/07 11:16 PM
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 1,037
Central California
ejpoulsen Offline
old hand
ejpoulsen  Offline
old hand

Joined: May 2002
Posts: 1,037
Central California
Some good points from Mark S.

Another thing that has hurt "us" is the Hobie edict--Hobie way or the highway...I know it really bristled my local yacht club when they heard about it. Of course a company or class can do what it likes...but consequences follow.


Eric Poulsen
A-class USA 203
Ultimate 20
Central California
Re: In Defense of US Sailing [Re: ejpoulsen] #101331
03/24/07 07:45 PM
03/24/07 07:45 PM
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 613
New Hampshire, USA
windswept Offline
addict
windswept  Offline
addict

Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 613
New Hampshire, USA
WHy don't you layout the "Hobie Edict" for those of us who do not clearly know about it.


Tom Siders
A-Cat USA-79
Tornado US775
Re: In Defense of US Sailing [Re: windswept] #101332
03/24/07 08:34 PM
03/24/07 08:34 PM
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,884
Detroit, MI
mbounds Offline
Pooh-Bah
mbounds  Offline
Pooh-Bah

Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,884
Detroit, MI
"The Hobie Edict", put succinctly, is that Hobie Fleets cannot run "open regattas" and still use the "Hobie" name. This was phased in during 2004 and became Hobie Class policy in 2005.

I you want an extensive read, go here.

BTW, this has nothing to do with US Sailing or Multihulls / Tornados in the Olympics.

Last edited by mbounds; 03/24/07 09:11 PM.
Re: In Defense of US Sailing [Re: windswept] #101333
03/25/07 07:17 AM
03/25/07 07:17 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 12,310
South Carolina
Jake Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Jake  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 12,310
South Carolina
Quote
WHy don't you layout the "Hobie Edict" for those of us who do not clearly know about it.


A regatta sanctioned by the HCA can only have Hobie brand Catamarans - no open classes. At the time, the majority of all our catamaran regattas in the USA were structured under the HCA.


Jake Kohl
Re: In Defense of US Sailing [Re: Jake] #101334
03/25/07 11:19 AM
03/25/07 11:19 AM
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 613
New Hampshire, USA
windswept Offline
addict
windswept  Offline
addict

Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 613
New Hampshire, USA
Definately limits participation from any other classes and puts an emphsis on owning hobies. For some reason, I have never cared for them anyway. I do know that Hobie has done a great deal for the sport by making affordable cats available and by exposing them to the general public. I just am not a big fan of the boats, thats all.


Tom Siders
A-Cat USA-79
Tornado US775
Re: In Defense of US Sailing [Re: windswept] #101335
03/26/07 06:39 AM
03/26/07 06:39 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 12,310
South Carolina
Jake Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Jake  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 12,310
South Carolina
I'm not going there again. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />


Jake Kohl
Re: In Defense of US Sailing [Re: Jake] #101336
03/26/07 12:05 PM
03/26/07 12:05 PM
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 5,590
Naples, FL
waterbug_wpb Offline
Carpal Tunnel
waterbug_wpb  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 5,590
Naples, FL
Quote
I'm not going there again. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />


Dang, and I just finished nuking the popcorn. Who says reruns aren't fun to kill time...


Jay

Re: In Defense of US Sailing [Re: waterbug_wpb] #101337
03/26/07 12:25 PM
03/26/07 12:25 PM
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 917
Issaquah, WA, USA
H17cat Offline
old hand
H17cat  Offline
old hand

Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 917
Issaquah, WA, USA
Maybe we should follow NASCAR's lead with the COT, Car of Tomorrow. Make everyone sail the same exact Cat, only allowable change is the trim and color.
Caleb

Re: In Defense of US Sailing [Re: H17cat] #101338
03/26/07 01:58 PM
03/26/07 01:58 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 1,459
Annapolis,MD
Keith Offline
veteran
Keith  Offline
veteran

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 1,459
Annapolis,MD
Quote
Maybe we should follow NASCAR's lead with the COT, Car of Tomorrow. Make everyone sail the same exact Cat, only allowable change is the trim and color.
Caleb


And just like NASCAR, we can put stickers and graphics on the boat to make them LOOK like the boat they are supposed to be! Just paint the outline of a Hobie Tiger on the side and voila! A Hobie Tiger as far as the sponsors know...

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