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2021 Rags To Riches Regatta
by John Farris. 05/20/21 05:06 PM
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Re: Smaller sail for Hobie 16 [Re: mako] #127194
05/05/08 08:41 PM
05/05/08 08:41 PM
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mako Offline OP
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Kathryn, I liked the idea of a 14 sail on my 16 but the cutoff 18 had the avantage of being free. I think the cutoff 18 is about the size of the 14. Anyway its worth a try. I did fix the sail to either use the 16 boom with a sewn in rope or gromets to use the loose foot 18 boom. I am not sure what the advantage of the loose foot is. I also do not know whether a mast rotation limiter is needed for a loose foot boom. When you sailed with the smaller sail did it tame the 16 down a little in wind close to 20MPH. I like to sail under full sail but there are conditions where sailing on the edge isn't that much fun. I spent the last 3 months fishing in Fla. and there wasn't many days I would like to be out in a full sailed 16.

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Re: Smaller sail for Hobie 16 [Re: mako] #127195
05/06/08 10:45 AM
05/06/08 10:45 AM
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Florida
Kathryn Offline
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Florida
I used the 14 sail more for single handed sailing the 16 and this was many years ago when reefing the Hobie 16 was still the chosen method for depowering. I didn't want to put undue stress on my 16 sail so I used my 14 sail. Yes it tamed it down a lot.
I am an avid racer and over the years have learned that a Hobie 16 with full sails is quite manageable in very heavy air. It is all a matter of loosening off the jib halyard until the windward hull is just skipping the top of the waves when going upwind sheeted in hard. It does take some self confidence but works amazingly well.
Back to your concerns: the loose footed sail gives the opportunity to flatten or make the main sail fuller according to how hard you pull the outhaul. The outhaul on the 16 with the sail fed into the slot on the boom doesn't offer much control this way. Ideally, heavy air, you want all the strings TIGHT! The hobie 16 has no mast rotation control and in heavy air, you want your mast rotated to the stops anyway, so you would gain nothing by having any mast rotator control for heavy air. (A Hobie 18 has diamond wires which puts prebend in your mast, making your sail flatter, and you would want the 18 mast with less rotation for depowering in heavy air. Without diamond wires and prebend, your mast bends more when fully rotated, allowing for a flatter sail.)


Kathryn Garlick Evolution, 28R, #185
Re: Smaller sail for Hobie 16 [Re: Kathryn] #127196
05/06/08 02:54 PM
05/06/08 02:54 PM
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North Carolina
hrtsailor Offline
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Kathryn,

Did you really mean backing off on the jib "halyard"? On a 16 that means loosening the rig. Do you mean loosening the jib "sheet" while the main is sheeted tight? I reefed my sail once on my H-16 and didn't find it worth doing. The newer H-16s don't have a reef point since the comptip mast was introduced.

Re: Smaller sail for Hobie 16 [Re: hrtsailor] #127197
05/08/08 09:13 AM
05/08/08 09:13 AM
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Florida
Kathryn Offline
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Florida
Yes I do mean backing off the jib halyard which does loosen the rig. Sheet jib and main sheets in hard for upwind sailing. You may want to travel out the jib and main a bit too.

This method depowers a 16 beautifully.

Start out with your rig at your normal tension and mark the halyard at the black band. If you find the boat wants to fly a hull too much, loosen the jib halyard until the boat settles down and is quite manageable. You will need to head up into the wind each time you want to make an adjustment and then sail upwind again to test your setting. With the halyard marked you can easily see how much you have backed off the halyard and reset it if the wind drops.


Kathryn Garlick Evolution, 28R, #185
Re: Smaller sail for Hobie 16 [Re: Kathryn] #127198
05/08/08 12:20 PM
05/08/08 12:20 PM
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California
mmiller Offline
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At the Hobie 16 Worlds in New Caledonia... VERY high wind sailing. The light junior crews were running a completely loose (like old style 14) on the 16 and smokin. The booms were touching the rear beam when unsheeted. I am pretty sure they had loose jib luffs and could not get leech tension on the mains. We are talking 20-30 conditions though.


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Matt Miller
Hobie Cat Company
Re: Smaller sail for Hobie 16 [Re: mmiller] #127199
05/08/08 01:42 PM
05/08/08 01:42 PM
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North Carolina
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North Carolina
Kathryn,

Slacking off the jib halyard is an interesting idea. Matt's post indicates that it isn't unusual. Since you are talking about high winds, there is more chance that you could over. Is there a possibility in that case that the mast could come out of the socket? Do you secure the mast in any way?

Howard

Re: Smaller sail for Hobie 16 [Re: hrtsailor] #127200
05/08/08 03:35 PM
05/08/08 03:35 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 1,252
California
mmiller Offline
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Quote
Is there a possibility in that case that the mast could come out of the socket?


Yes.

They also had issues of mast rotation stops missing.

I had never seen anyone sail a 16 that way, but the local kids were fast.


Hobie Cat Forums
Matt Miller
Hobie Cat Company
Re: Smaller sail for Hobie 16 [Re: mmiller] #127201
05/08/08 05:45 PM
05/08/08 05:45 PM
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Thunder Bay ON CAN
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Backing off the jib halyard is more old school thinking.Not to say it does not work but the new thinking is depowering with the traveller(both main and jib) and max. down haul.All the while keeping full tension on the jib halyard.If need be set the shroud pins one hole lower.

Re: Smaller sail for Hobie 16 [Re: hrtsailor] #127202
05/09/08 10:52 AM
05/09/08 10:52 AM
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 40
Florida
Kathryn Offline
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Kathryn  Offline
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Florida
As Matt had described, slacking off the halyard is common, however he was describing much more radical slacking off than what has been normally done. In my years, I have not ever dismasted a 16 because of a loose rig; however, I did not have my rig as loose as Matt was describing. Last I talked with the Puerto Ricans, many of them were sailing in light and moderate air with their rigs loosened off. I tried it with great results too. Loosening off the jib halyard is a general setting for the sustained wind strength. Traveling the main and jib is what you do to handle the stronger puffs that overpower the boat for a short duration.


Kathryn Garlick Evolution, 28R, #185
Re: Smaller sail for Hobie 16 [Re: mmiller] #127203
05/09/08 11:07 AM
05/09/08 11:07 AM
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Florida
Kathryn Offline
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Kathryn  Offline
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Florida
Actually, Matt, I do recall that Worlds. The winds were awesome. I recall there were some specific instructions we were to follow with securing the jib halyards and how many wraps were allowed around the cleat. (Not enough by the way.) I also think we were requested to secure the masts to the boats because of the radical rake that was being used.


Kathryn Garlick Evolution, 28R, #185
Re: Smaller sail for Hobie 16 [Re: Kathryn] #127204
05/11/08 12:21 AM
05/11/08 12:21 AM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 4,118
Northfield Mn
Karl_Brogger Offline
Carpal Tunnel
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Northfield Mn
Do like the H14's do and use the main halyard to tie the mast down to the dolphin striker if you are concerned with it popping out with a loose rig.

Re: Smaller sail for Hobie 16 [Re: Karl_Brogger] #127205
08/20/08 03:31 PM
08/20/08 03:31 PM
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mako Offline OP
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I sailed my 16 with the cutoff 18 sail for the last 2 months.I used the loose foot boom from the 18. I thought it was easier to sail in all winds than the regular 16 sail. It tacks easily with or without the jib. The profile of the boat and sail look more like the later boat designs. About 15" short from the end of the boom and about 30" from the mast top. I had it out solo in about 20mph wind with no problem and saw GPS speed of 15.5 kn. It was the combination I was looking for for a crusing boat.

Re: Smaller sail for Hobie 16 [Re: mako] #127206
10/03/08 07:38 PM
10/03/08 07:38 PM
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 19
Mayport, FL
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Mayport, FL
I use a boomless mainsail from a Gcat, it's way shorter than my Hobie's original and allows me to take novices out without them getting knocked in the head. I raise it all the way up the mast, putting it well above everyone's head. I still get good speed as the winds pick up, although it tries to curl up in winds over 20kts. It depowers easily and I know there won't be any capsizing even singlehanded. That's it in my avatar pic.

Last edited by BLMay; 10/03/08 07:53 PM.

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