I`ve been away from this forum for a long time, and chose an interesting time to catch up on some reading.
Just another perspective to look at things from : (BTW I am not a class member, or am I ? I sail a Mosquito with spi.. does that still qualify as an F16 ?)
When I approached Wouter as the (then) class chairman I was interested in having the Mosquito with spi accepted as an F16, after looking at our proposal he agreed, as it could do no harm. The boat`s ISAF rating works out at 1.13, so it`s around 10% slower (on paper) than a real F16 or F18. In real terms we can sometimes surprise the Hobie Tigers given the right conditions (10-15knots, and over 25knots) The reason for us wanting the Mozzie included was to benefit both parties : The F16 class could gain numbers at that early stage and have representation in Deepest Darkest Africa, while the Mosquito class had no place for spinnakers in it`s one-design rules, so we would then have a class to sail under. We attempted to get the Hobie 16`s to join us with spinnakers as we don`t have fancy boats in Africa, our ratings are similar with spinnakers, but that did not happen as Hobie worldwide decided they didn`t want to play with other kids that didn`t look like them. The Australian Mozzies quickly caught up in terms of numbers using spinnakers, mainly due to the inclusion of the boat as an F16, and Tim Sheppard`s efforts. As a result there are around 40 spinnaker-equipped Mosquito`s that regard the F16 class as a place where they belong, even if they are rated slower. However, where I sail you would not be too happy on a fully-optimised F16 most of the time, often we would prefer less sail area on the humble little Mozzie, as our sailing season corresponds with a windsurfing season in which you get the most use out of a 4sqm sail.
It would not bother me in the least if the F16 class decided that the Mozzie with spi no longer fitted their class rules and excluded us, as in S. Africa we have adopted the spi as standard and voted it into our class rules, which has effectively divided us from our Auzzie counterparts. It may affect them negatively as they will have no class to sail in.
What I`m getting at is that raising the min. weight would require the Mozzie sailors to carry more lead than that which is allowed in the class rules, effectively excluding the Mozzies from the F16 class. I do realise that attracting the big manufacturers would be more beneficial to the class than retaining a small number of boats that are not ideal as F16 boats, so if that happened I wouldn`t lose any sleep over it.
My real point is that when first hearing of the F16 concept it sounded brilliant - allowing different design boats with similar performance to race on a level-rating, first-in wins, basis. To me it would not really matter if the various designs varied in their ISAF ratings by one or two points, as that is too small a difference to count. I realise that others would prefer a more tightly controlled class with the boats being almost identical, so that the OD philosophy prevails. The sad thing about this is that there is no room for innovation in the design of the boats, the kind of innovation that sparked the creation of 'Altered'. What we have ended up with is a class of boats that almost are identical in design, as they are all being designed to the maximum limits of the box-rule. Of course it may be difficult to get these boats in at min. weight for some mass-production manufacturers, but it is still possible for the smaller builders with high quality control systems in place, such as VWM and Stealth Catamarans. It is also possible for a home-builder or anyone else to build a boat that conforms to the F16 rules, but may be smaller in some dimensions than the maximum allowed, for whatever reason the designer / builder chooses, and therefore is easy to be below the current min. weight. Raising the min. weight just excludes these possibilities.
I believe the original concept of the class should be kept in mind. It allowed existing boat designs to be included such as the Taipan, Mosquito, Stealth and even the Spitfire (which is seriously overweight and has a slightly bigger sail area than allowed under F16, however it`s ISAF rating is 1.04, making it very similar in performance.)
I can well understand Macca and Stephen Medwell`s point of view, however i can also understand those in defense of the current class rules remaining unaltered. Perhaps it would be wise to consider the Taipans, Stealths and Mosquitos that could form a fairly large percentage of the class worldwide, and can all be built under min. weight (or in the case of the Taipan, could have been until recently, and are only having issues regarding weight as a result of a change in builder).
Just my opinion on the matter, sorry it took so long.
The attached image is of the wind stats from a few days ago - definitely not F16 weather.. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Stephen,

I have not weighed my boat on "proper" scales. Hoever a quick trip onto a set of bathroom scales indicate that it will be about on Min weight for a single handed boat.

So no actual manufacturer has officially contacted the Governing Council about the apparent weight issue, and there is no apparent weight issue.

This has been a lot of arguing over nothing.

No major manufacturer (other than AHPC who have asked for the increase) is interested in F16 at the moment because under the current rules it is not a viable option for volume manufacturing.

The whole point of my suggestion was to make the class interesting to those builders so that they had a chance to build boats at a good price and hence expand the class greatly.

If a manufacturer is actually interested in producing the F16, but would like to discuss an amendment to the rules, this is the worst way to go about it. All this discussion is doing is creating instability, which would not be in the interests of any manufacturer commencing F16 production.

Get in contact with the Governing Council. If you are indeed a manufacturers representative, you've done a crap job of helping that manufacturer get into the class with any possibility of amendments. I don't consider an internet forum a very professional avenue for a manufacturer or its representatives to bring this up with the council.

FOR THE LAST TIME: I AM NOT REPRESENTING A MANUFACTURER IN HERE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

My interest in F16 is purely from a personal point of view.

Stephen,

Maybe this can help.

If you have a spare autoratchet, then place it to the rear of the upper mainsheet block and have the line wrap around that instead of around the upper block. You will leave one sheave unused on the upper block but it really increases your holding power ALOT. It has to be an autoratchet as it has the disengage for quick sheeting out. The ratchet block can be put on the boom using something like an eyestrap as one block doesn't put too much tension on the light booms we are all using now.

It may not be a perfect setup when the mainsheet setup is twisted but when faced with bad chooses you best go with the least bad.

Good luck !

Wouter

STEVE is the one with the mainsheet problem, not me. I know I am in your thoughts a lot these days so I understand <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

But the boat Steve is using has the NACRA Infusion system, so its a 10:1 with a tapered Maffioli sheet. The tapering greatly reduces the drag/grip in the system and would make it pretty hard to hang onto with one hand (I know cause I sailed that boat in the Lock Ness Monster Race last August)

I would suggest running a non tapered sheet to improve the grip in the system, or shortening the tapered section so that there is more of the fat sheet in the blocks at full tension.

Steve,

Personally I feel more loyalty towards guys that were here and supportive during the first hours then any Big Boy that sat on the fence till it was safe and demands all kinds of adjustments before even considering to join up.

Steve, I think it would be a great miss to have you guys exclude if it ever comes to that. Including the SA Mozzie was one of the very best things we ever did !

Thank you for all your support in the past.

Wouter

I`m getting confused about the number of Steves posting in this thread. I`m the one who`s happy with his mainsheet.
Thanks for the positive comments, Wouter. When we first wanted the Mozzie included in the F16 class it was with a long-term goal of putting a slightly bigger rig on it, which has been tried in Australia, I believe not very successfully, which is partly why the Taipan was created in the first place. We are still looking at it very tentatively, I say this because it has been blowing over 34knots for a week now, and I would prefer a F18 platform with a Mozzie rig on it right now, over a Mozzie with a Taipan rig ! I know this is completely off-topic, but after trying to read the many posts in all the different threads that actually come down to one subject, I`m a bit lost as to what the topic is.
All I know is that if the wind holds up like this for another month, the Hobie Tigers are going to have a very eventful worlds..
My point on the Mozzie being excluded was to illustrate that having a vote to raise the min. weight might not be beneficial to all the class members, Scooby Simon says his boat is on min. weight, would he want to add lead because the major manufacturers can`t do what John Pierce and Matt McDonald can ? I think that would be against the spirit of the class and it`s rules, as I understand them.
If you REALLY want the class to grow, would it not be better to canvas the Taipan class in Australia and add some 200 boats to the class, if there is interest. I think they will soon realise the groundswell that the F16 class is now acchieving and would be foolish not to become part of it, especially since they can just remove the spinnaker and it`s gear to sail in Taipan OD events, the best of both worlds. Man, I wish I lived in Australia !
And now for completely off-topic : We had a 17km (approx. 10 miles) downwind race recently open to all craft, it was blowing over 30knots at the start, and reached a measured 44knots at the first turnpoint. Kiters dominated, some windsurfers survived, and there were 3 Hobie 16`s sailing. Miraculously all 3 finished the race, but the first Hobie 16 over the finish line had no mast up : They attached a 16sm kitesurfing kite to the front beam, one guy steered and the other flew the kite. They beat the other 2 H16`s by a huge margin. I wonder if one day soon we won`t be discussing carbon mast vs alu mast, instead we might be arguing the virtues of mast vs no mast....Then again, maybe someone here will tell me to go fly a kite ... <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Go fly a kite upwind <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />
I think kites are good downwind, but they still have to improve upwind. LEIs are a good try, as can RAM kites, but I still think a decent catamaran rig will beat them. Interesting times though.

Steve:
Can you tell me something about the condition at Langebaan?
(I'm heading there next week for the Tiger Worlds).

What is the water temperature like?
I hear its a bit chilly, and what is the shark situation there? (So i know not to capsize! <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />).
Thx.

Best of luck at the Worlds, Tony !

Wouter

Hi Tony,
Water temp in Langebaan is on the other side of warm my guess is around 12-15degC.I`d recommend a full-length wetsuit. The Lagoon is warmer but I think you`ll be sailing more in the Bay north of the island (Saldanha Bay) as the lagoon shallows considerably from the island going south. Air temps should be 22-30degC, sometimes up to 34. Wind chill can be a factor if a cold front is pushing through.
I windsurf there more than catsailing, and haven`t seen a shark yet. Apparently the fishermen catch small ones that probably come into the shallows to find food, or for safety from bigger ones. Having said that I make sure I waterstart as quickly as possible when falling in, I share your concern about them ! There is a fish canning factory at the town of Saldanha, if there are any sharks they would probably hang around there waiting for scraps. We normally sail our nationals there, and have not seen a shark yet, or lost any competitors <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" /> (and I have been crowned the capsize king after 4 ditches in one downwind leg of a race <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />)
We have seen a whale in the lagoon, and had to tack to avoid getting too close, but it`s not the time of year you are likely to see any.
Wind should be good, if not a little too good based on what we have had lately. Our REALLY windy season is normally from November to mid-Feb, then starts tapering off into March, but it started late this year, and seems to be hanging around.
Have a look at Google Earth, search Langebaan Lagoon / Saldanha Bay. There is a "join" line in the map where the satellite images overlapped. The sailing area is likely to be just about where the darker image meets the lighter image, just north of the small island in the lagoon mouth. Launch beach is to the right of the island, in a narrow channel.
Hope this helps, enjoy your regatta. I might come up there for a day or two to watch and windsurf, what`s your sail number ?

In my opinion.. The mozzie was accepted as a F16 foundation boat and unless the mozzies ask to be excluded I cant see a good reason to change their status..