If you search oodle.com there is one in annapolis for $650, but that seems awfully cheap. If it is in good condition they should go for close to $2k

If I am understanding you correctly, the extra feet mean less agility? If so, yes!

The 16' length and 8' width seem to mean the Nacra 500 is less agile, especially in light winds. Have heard a number of complaints about turning the longer boats in light winds, not to single out Nacra 500.

In looking at various boats, I use the Hobie Wave to start comparisons. The Nacra 460 is only 1' longer than the Hobie Wave, 1' wider, BUT has 5' more mast and about 40 square ft more sail area (includes jib?).

Assume the 460 speed factor a notch or two lower than the H16. 218 sail area vs 135 on Nacra 460. However, at 12-15 knot winds the H16 is overpowered, I hear?

Plus, at 280 lbs, Nacra 460 is only 45 lbs more than a Wave, but still in a manageable beach cat weight. However, it's weight carrying spec is much lower!

There seem to be three distinct levels of boats (can I say that among all the experts around and not get pelted?)

First, the recreational, big-weight carrying capacity. Second, the moderate performance boats with more power and less load capacity. Third, all the high performance boats. Some overlap.

Lots of factors to compare but for moderate to heavy wind conditions, more comfort on the moderate performance boats in those winds -- especially for solo sailing. Plus better agility in lighter winds.

Yes, do take all this with more than a grain of salt. I live to be heckled. Heckle away!

In doing some of my research, I came across someone selling a 450 who told me that it smoked H16s. I find that hard to believe while doing the math; however, I'm no expert. I don't know how much good lines will make up for LOA and sailing area. I have also had some tell me that with my weight, the 460 would be perfect, while others tell me that I am way too heavy for it (155 solo/220 with crew). I'm still leaning towards a 500 since I am holding out on my wife crewing/helming when the kids get older (our combined weight would be around 260-270).

Yes the 450 is nearly as fast as the H16 and will easily carry as much weight as a Hobie wave. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

There are basically two types with many different materials depending mainly on purpose and cost. For example the wave is molded plastic while the 450 is fibre glass and the 500 is fiber glass with foam core.<img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

What does the foam core do for the 500? How well does it hold up?

I strongly prefer the 500 over the 450 (and I guess the 460 too)

At my club we have both 5.0/500's and I think two 4.5's (predessor to 450)

Some advertise the 450 and 460 weights at 280 lbs 127 kg but NacraEurope doesn't nor the measurement based rating system like Texel and ISAF, here the boat is quoted as 142 kg (313lbs) and thus only 17 lbs lighter then the 500 at 150 kg.

It is also the 500 that is on a par with the performance of a H16 and not the 450 (or 460) Which is almost 10% slower. Considering that the difference between the fastest and slowest beach cat is about 40% that means that 10% is significant.

The most striking difference between the 500 and 460 is the fact that the 500 mast has diamond wires on the mast and the H16 and 460 don't. This makes the 500 more tunable, but there is a thing to be said about the ease of carrying and storing a straight mast tube without any spreaders or diamond wires.

Personally I strongly prefer the 500 if you are looking for some performance or ever want to participate in a regatta of catamaran race. With the 500 you'll be in the pact with much nmore common boats like the Hobie 16. On the 460 you'll be very much in the rear part of the fleet unless you have really good sailing skills.

As the 500 is much better known and much more sold I think the 500 is a better investment,it should be hard to ever sell that boat. My personal opinion is that the 460 is somewhere between the Hobie wave and getaway and the nacra 500 and therefor a bit of neither. If you are looking for a pure recreational boat with ease of maintainance that rotomoulded (plastic) is very attractive (Hobie wave). If you are looking for some more performance and to blast around with your (male) friends after you have gotten the hang of it then the 500 is your ticket.

Personally I would go for the 500 (or the original 5.0). there is just more growth potential there and you'll get used to the cat speed pretty quickly. At first the smaller boats may feel perfect, but when you really get into it you'll progress very quickly and I think the 500 has significantly more meat to it without being too complicated or much more heavy.

Wouter

Do you sail Nacra 5.2? I doubt it would be too different than the 500, other than the ability to play with the daggerboards against the eventual lack of weight (I have no idea how significant that is, I only sailed the 5.0 so far).
I weight about 185 lbs and I've sailed solo in pretty choppy conditions on the 5.0, with no problems. I don't think you should be too concerned about not having enough weight unless you will be mostly sailing in strong winds, I read here that the 5.0 is rather underpowered and that the 500 is very similar to the 5.0 in general. Not having much experience with other cats, I tend to agree, it's not like it will fly a hull for nothting. Personally I would hate to go to a smaller boat, I sailed H14s a couple times and didn´t find it really exciting. If crew weight (and budget) was not a concern, I would certainly be tempted to go to a bigger one, just get some beachwheels to take it off the water durning lunch, the rest shoulnd't be too different I think.

Well, maybe mast stepping might be an issue, but there are workaraounds, right? (I mean for going bigger than 500, it shouldn't be an issue for 500 or less)