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Formula 20s in N A - #14539
12/23/02 06:14 PM
12/23/02 06:14 PM
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 800
MI
sail6000 Offline OP
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sail6000  Offline OP
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Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 800
MI
N A Formula 20s

The first iF -20 championships are being held in Holland in 03 with more than 100 expected -
http://www.catamaran.co.uk/IF20/IF20.htm

Very encouraged by F-16 --F-18 and F-18 ht classes underway now in N A ,-seems inevitable that a F-20 class will follow .Really looking forward to racing good catamaran design in each type and class .16S 18S 18 Hhts and 20s
The Worrell 1000 this year on the Jav will be very interesting .

Many are acustomed to the 20 ft platforms maybe more idealy suited to 1000 mile ocean distance racing . Hope to see the event and many similar ones eventually including a Formula 20 class.

Currently in N A we have a variety of 20-ft catamaran designs being actively raced and sailed.

The idea of Formula racing is to allow all boat designs to race equally within the limits of basic box measurements of the same or very similar Length ;Beam Weight ;and Sail area. The H-Fox ;Inter 20 –and several others have been built with Formula in mind. Many other existing designs fit within the measurements per Formula rules and could be improved and modified with spin snuffer systems or most any modification and raced.

This allows all boats built to similar measurements to compete as Formula 20s and allows owners the freedom to change improve or modify any aspect of the boat they choose.

The N-6/0 is an interesting example of boat development going from its original version; -an Express version set up for a spin. With sq. top main, --and a N A version with larger jib. Any version could add a chute;snuffer system and race F-20. The boat would certainly continue to improve and develop on its basic platform. Performance Catamarans could offer a 6/0 version with the current I-20 c f mast and sail plan with lighter total boat weight which could prove much faster in many conditions and in distance racing . It may continue classic versions with improvements and spin area to make them competitive also allowed in Formula-rules.
Some may wish to purchase existing platforms of various types ;refinish them, -make the lighter and build their own version, -just as many of us now build or have built our own custom computer system to our specific preferences and uses.

Supercats were mentioned in earlier posts as one builder who offers custom building on variations of design per owners requested specifications. A Formula S C WITH SPIN SNUFFER would be an AWSOME ocean distance-racing cat.

The Hobie Fox may rethink its design for N A and potential upgrades it to outperform the Inter 20.
Rules would allow a lighter boat weight, -c f mast, and -and 15 more sq. ft of mainsail for the Fox.
For heavier existing 20s two weight categories are established for boat 376 and up with 270 sq. ft chutes and for those weighing 410 and up a 300 sq. ft chute is allowed along with slightly larger jib.
The 20s being so powered up with sail area is effected less by crew weight, so only boat weight is compensated with added spin area.

Any 20-ft platform or design can be modified for F-20 racing; -many types will be successful to various conditions and types of racing. One huge advantage is if you do not like your boat speed or set up then change and improve it, -Make it faster, -better handling, -stronger where needed and safer.

20 FOOT CAT DESIGNS CURRENTLY ACTIVE IN N A that fit into Formula 20 racing,
Ideally we will have articles with photos of modifications and chute with snuffer set ups of each type -as the year progresses.

-- H-Fox --Inter 20 --H-Miracle 20 ---N-6/0 NA --
Tornado-modified to 8.5 beam ,---P-19 -
The Mystere 20 are among potential F-20 boats -
see specs. and info on the N A F-20 forum listing

Again any could purchase an existing 20 at very resonable costs and refinish -rebuild , your own very competitive Formula 20 racing machine hopefully growing into larger and larger class structure over the years throughout N A and around the globe in very similar i F 20 .

Working on updating a N A F-20 web site .
We need volunteers and involvement from boat builders , boat dealerships ,-sailing clubs fleets , and event organizers ,-
most importantly from catsailors that would like to get involved in 03 .

Should be a great cat sailing year ahead

Carl

link to rules -http://www.lakelaniersailing.com/f20class/






Last edited by sail6000; 12/23/02 06:30 PM.
-- Have You Seen This? --
Re: Formula 20s in N A - [Re: sail6000] #14540
12/23/02 06:53 PM
12/23/02 06:53 PM
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 273
Key Largo, FL
MaryAWells Offline
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MaryAWells  Offline
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Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 273
Key Largo, FL
I hope this new Formula 20 class succeeds better than the initial one did in Europe (when? early '90's?). Before it could even got off the ground, the class died because Morrelli & Melvin designed the Ventilo and it was so much faster than the other boats in the class. I can't remember whether it was Gino or Pete who told me they felt kind of bad about it -- their design killing the class.

I should also add that Rick tried to organize a Formula 20 Class in North America several years ago, but it never went anywhere. I guess the time was not right. Maybe it is now.

Last edited by MaryAWells; 12/23/02 07:21 PM.

Mary A. Wells
Re: Formula 20s in N A - [Re: MaryAWells] #14541
12/24/02 10:25 AM
12/24/02 10:25 AM
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 800
MI
sail6000 Offline OP
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sail6000  Offline OP
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Posts: 800
MI
Hi Mary

Thanks ,

You hit on the main points as always ,--
Timing may be right ,-with other Formula classes and catsailors in N A becomming more educated about sailing ,-design and types of catamarans available . Catsailors want better class structure in each length catagory that Formula Classes provide . This will void dead boat classes to a large extent and the endless cycle of them in the future.
I would like to see a singlehanded F-class emerge --looks like one base on H-FX and Inter 17 types . --In non spin hope the A-Class continues to become more and more popular ,-It is a similar limited development class based in a fundamental box measurement rule of Length Beam Weight and Sail Area that has numerous excellent builders and boat dealers to support them .
Being able to modify and update existing design will revive many 20s, or at least provide longevity as well as a very inexpensive entry level boat to the sport .
Any can look at the classified section and find numerous 20s for less than 2 th. add a spin snuff system and mods for 2 more and some T L C , in refinishing and custom additions ,-maybe team logos and art work and your racing something of real value ,-
Or just purchase a new F-20 -Inter 20 ,-maybe an upgraded Fox version , or custom S C 20 per Formula-specs.Many 20s are available. We need some to get involved in Formula 20 racing .-Inter currently has a near monopoly and has no insentive to support F-20 . H Fox currently does not want to upgrade , the answer is for all to purchase a Tiger . Great boat and F-18 racing will grow but does not meet the needs of all . -Am really looking forward to seeing the Tiger and Nacra F-18s line up and race this year ,--We have some of each locally in CRAM with excellent equally matched sailors aboard . Hope we see some line up for the Tybee 500 in May also .. Of course along with a number of 20 entered as Formula 20s -per F-rules outlined.
98 99 Worrell races were run with limited production boats in class including N-6/0s --Mystere 20s --Hobie 20,--and one brought a Tiger at that time as well .
Rick had the right idea 5 or 6 years earlier trying to combine several 20 classes to race even up , this may have elolved into a Formula class . A good Formula rules basis that treats each boat equally to a max set of specs is fundamental.
Persistance is a key ,--If the Formula 20 class does not become instantly popular we,re prepared to continue the next and next and next as required . -Europe is having its first i F 20 Championships this year after founding it 5 or more years earlier . Persistance ,-just as with Worrell racing ,- 7th this year , each one gets better as the race itself does and partisipation and interest in it grows .Formula 20 efforts will similarly continue , already been working from the idea-concept based on iF 20 RACING for the last 3. It was a set back to find the I-20 not built in N A to iF Formula rules as the Fox is . The N A version Inter 20 often weighs in the 380 range ,though class rules say 390 , Any can easily remove 10 lbs of boat weight if desired also. The Inter 20 in N A also we discovered 3 years ago has 15 more sq ft of sail area in a larger sq top main . Matt was good enough to measure it having one of the first I-20s at that time . The boat has more than 200 now ,-the Fox has very few ,-so we have based the class on the more popular specifications for N A or the N A Inter 20 .
For the casual reader please realize we have no strong central organization. All we can try to accomplish is to accomodate all existing popular 20 ft cat designs as best we can based on mfg. specs of boats as currently built .
Any boat can modify and match the I-20S basic specifications .
We will see many better versions of 20s that have the potential to outperform the Inter 20 if sailed to that potential .
One thing all who race realize is that there are the Tiger Woods type of catsailors that set new standards of excellence in our catsailing sport. Matt is one , expect to see them battle and become the Olympic Tornado rep , though Robbie and the existing T team will be very tough to beat and have this same ability on most any type of cat design sailed .
These types of teams -sailors can hop on most any cat design and sail away from a fleet of really good catsailors with years of racing time and experience . We all realize this .
One big problem with setting a handicap based on average times, they sail and focus on one or two types of popular active design . If there were some way to have these sailors sail every design and record times in consistant conditions in numerous races ,-then there would be a verifiable means for a yardstick handicap systen like P-rating ,-but it is not realistic,-
or intelectually honest to believe this .. Just read the ISAF rating for cats which states this in effect . The rest of the cat sailing world realizes this but we can not . We continue to seperate and alienate Hobie and many other class oriented catsailors as a result .
Maybe this is the way people like it ,--small controlled groups serving ego and monetary interests in sport , I don't believe this is good or serves the best interests of all .
Also the education and improvement factor in the sport .
New design ,innovation ,-and true competitive nature of sport .
Europe has us beat all to heck in this regard ,--WHY ?
tHIS STUPID RACE STRUCTURE WE HAVE IN PLACE IS A LARGE PART , prohibiting us to grow elolve for the bettermeant of sport .
If your oriented to small groups of handicap racing that is fine ,-but do not expect others to accept it as anything more than an artificial average timed handicap of other sailors not in your club or small group ,-If the intent is to handicap the individual to give new sailors an opportunity to compete or win a pennant or trophy then give them an individual handicap .--like golf , and be honest about the type of sailing you believe is fair , a handicap type .

Need to research the Morelli -Melvin boat ,--I understood it was a H T type design with more beam -sail area and much lighter weight than current Formula rules allow . more of a ht 20 .
Think we will see a H T 20 Class in the future ,-a good very high performance design /designs are due to replace the Tornado type design , lighter weight , similar beam ,-maybe planning or front foiler type design features . we will see boat design continue to develop. thats for sure.

-One Formula Class in whichever Length catagory will not provide all the answers , People will find this type of racing interesting ,-its not for everyone or meant to be , just as distance racing or just buoys racing is not . The combination of Formula Classes and established classes like A s -allow each catsailor to find one suited to their intented preferred type of racing . -Racing in small groups of diverse types , some type of rating system is required ,-that is great also but not a substitute for good class racing because of its inherant inequitities . These inequities discourage class oriented sailors from partisipation . Hobie Classes have dominated numerically because many are alienated by handicap racing ,--for good logical reasons .
People talk about social structure in catsailing . I really liked the term Bob used --"a meeting of the clans "" it is so diverse ,-no one really has the total picture in N A . We are so spread out over a huge continent. -You and Rick have brought us a long way in communication and a central meeting ground .

Thanks so much from so many of us -
Happy Holidays , and New Year
Carl

Last edited by sail6000; 12/24/02 11:18 AM.
Re: Formula classes and rating system in N A - [Re: sail6000] #14542
12/27/02 04:52 PM
12/27/02 04:52 PM
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 800
MI
sail6000 Offline OP
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sail6000  Offline OP
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Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 800
MI

Attempting to put 2 and 2 together , Formula Classes and new F-classes -singlehanded and others mentioned as they grow over the years and include more and more diverse brand types along with good established class racing and development type racing should be more than enough for any interested in the sport to find a class type or a number of types that suits them best . This type of class oriented racing combined with a simplified easily understood rating system {see building a better mousetrap /rating system} that compliments it would serve the sport much better than the half hazard approach and structure we have in place resulting in numerous dead end brand boat classes and complex rating that promotes it , and alienates class oriented catsailors and seperates them .

The sport can really become very popular again if we allow it to grow and develop with new interesting design and events with good class stucture to race them in, this benifits all involved ,-boat builders and dealers sell more boats ,-sailmakers make more sails ,-hardware mfg,build more -sell more ,-gear and apparel, and we catsailors have better boats events and racing opportunities .







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