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Mast Rotation Inducer #179920
05/27/09 03:27 PM
05/27/09 03:27 PM
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,121
Eastern NC, USA
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tshan Offline OP
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tshan  Offline OP
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Can you guys give me some ideas on how to rig a positive mast rotation system or a mast rotation inducer? This system will make sure the mast stays roated in light air and choppy conditions. Make sense?


Tom
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Re: Mast Rotation Inducer [Re: tshan] #179922
05/27/09 03:39 PM
05/27/09 03:39 PM
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 5,525
pgp Offline
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There's a thingey you can put on the front of the mast. Probably get it at Murray's.

http://www.apsltd.com/c-70-boommastbailsstrapstangs.aspx There is one that is more square in shape and a lot of guys used it on the H17.

Last edited by pgp; 05/27/09 03:45 PM.

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Blade 702

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Re: Mast Rotation Inducer [Re: pgp] #179924
05/27/09 03:47 PM
05/27/09 03:47 PM
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Eastern NC, USA
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tshan Offline OP
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Yeah, but I am worried about the jib track/sheet and spin stuff in front of the mast.

Very simply thinking, it is a line from the current mast rotator arm to small cleats on the main beam. I was just wondering if someone had come up with a slick solution. You could put a small turning block on each side of the main beam port/starboard) and run it back to a cleat on the other side....


Tom
Re: Mast Rotation Inducer [Re: tshan] #179935
05/27/09 04:31 PM
05/27/09 04:31 PM

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DougSnell
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I used this on my H-17 with a small double block for purchase and a cleat on the boom. Had a big ball to pull to adjust rotation. Use a bungee to corner casing in light air.

Doug

Attached Files
cd1260_R1_20.sized.jpg (1469 downloads)
Last edited by DougSnell; 05/27/09 04:34 PM.
Re: Mast Rotation Inducer [Re: tshan] #179939
05/27/09 04:42 PM
05/27/09 04:42 PM
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 2,921
Michigan
PTP Offline
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I think it would only be necessary for a distance type event. I rigged some up on the 18HT a few years ago for the RTI. I think we used them, but can't remember.

Re: Mast Rotation Inducer [Re: PTP] #179949
05/27/09 05:10 PM
05/27/09 05:10 PM
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,121
Eastern NC, USA
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tshan Offline OP
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Anything in light air with your foot on the boom or mast rotator to hold it in the correct place seems like a long distance race.


Tom
Re: Mast Rotation Inducer [Re: tshan] #179956
05/27/09 05:33 PM
05/27/09 05:33 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 9,582
North-West Europe
Wouter Offline
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Tom,

Yeah I got a few idea's for you.

You can fit a bungee to the mast rotator arm and have both its ends tied off to the spi pole some distance in front of the mast.

Another option is to tie one end of the bungee of to the boom and then go in front on the mast one time and tie the other end off to the same place on the boom.

In either case you need to kick the boom over in light airs but then it stays there.

I never rig these as I always use my jib cleats and two small line to pull the mast rotation arm over in light airs. When sailing two up it is a task I delegate to my crew (often myself incidently) as they will be on the leeward hull anyway.

The underlying principle if the same for either setup. See picture.

Basically the overall line length for the loop is longer when the mast and boom are aligned with eachother. This stretches the bungee cord. When the mast and boom are perpendicular to each other then the total length of the bungee is the shortest. When using a thick bungee cord the axial force in the loop is sufficient to pull the mast to side it is set. Working against the rotation limiter, so you can still adjust your mast rotation the normal way.

Numerous variation of this principle are possible. Using cleats etc. Where two pieces of line are fic to the mast and the run in front of the mast back to the boom and two individual cleats.

I'm not going to describe them all, so what are you looking for exactly. Something that is really simple and works or something that work really well but has you riveting eyestraps to your mast etc ?

Wouter



Attached Files
positive_mast_rotation.gif (1143 downloads)
Last edited by Wouter; 05/27/09 05:40 PM.

Wouter Hijink
Formula 16 NED 243 (one-off; homebuild)
The Netherlands
Re: Mast Rotation Inducer [Re: Wouter] #179970
05/27/09 07:19 PM
05/27/09 07:19 PM
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 3,528
Looking for a Job, I got credi...
scooby_simon Offline
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Originally Posted by Wouter

Tom,

Yeah I got a few idea's for you.

You can fit a bungee to the mast rotator arm and have both its ends tied off to the spi pole some distance in front of the mast.

Another option is to tie one end of the bungee of to the boom and then go in front on the mast one time and tie the other end off to the same place on the boom.

In either case you need to kick the boom over in light airs but then it stays there.

I never rig these as I always use my jib cleats and two small line to pull the mast rotation arm over in light airs. When sailing two up it is a task I delegate to my crew (often myself incidently) as they will be on the leeward hull anyway.

The underlying principle if the same for either setup. See picture.

Basically the overall line length for the loop is longer when the mast and boom are aligned with eachother. This stretches the bungee cord. When the mast and boom are perpendicular to each other then the total length of the bungee is the shortest. When using a thick bungee cord the axial force in the loop is sufficient to pull the mast to side it is set. Working against the rotation limiter, so you can still adjust your mast rotation the normal way.

Numerous variation of this principle are possible. Using cleats etc. Where two pieces of line are fic to the mast and the run in front of the mast back to the boom and two individual cleats.

I'm not going to describe them all, so what are you looking for exactly. Something that is really simple and works or something that work really well but has you riveting eyestraps to your mast etc ?

Wouter




Wouters last option works well. We had one on both my Hurricane 59's but with rope and a cleat under the boom. Just push the mast spanner and cleat the rope onto the boom. Job done.


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Re: Mast Rotation Inducer [Re: tshan] #179971
05/27/09 07:22 PM
05/27/09 07:22 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,906
Clermont, FL, USA
David Ingram Offline
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That's how Robbie Daniel has his set up.


David Ingram
F18 USA 242
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Re: Mast Rotation Inducer [Re: David Ingram] #179988
05/27/09 10:09 PM
05/27/09 10:09 PM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 163
Atlanta
GeoffS Offline
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I had a Boyer Mk 4 that worked as shown in the attached figure. I remember I always forgot to uncleat it before jibing.

Attached Files
rotation.jpg (1055 downloads)
Re: Mast Rotation Inducer [Re: GeoffS] #179989
05/27/09 10:16 PM
05/27/09 10:16 PM

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DougSnell
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DougSnell
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Originally Posted by GeoffS
I remember I always forgot to uncleat it before jibing.


That is why mine was attached to the boom. It was like a self tacker. It didn't matter witch tack or gybe you were on.

Doug

Last edited by DougSnell; 05/28/09 09:33 AM.
Re: Mast Rotation Inducer [Re: Wouter] #180016
05/28/09 07:24 AM
05/28/09 07:24 AM
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,121
Eastern NC, USA
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tshan Offline OP
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tshan  Offline OP
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Thanks. That sounds like the ticket. Something that will allow a gybe or tack and something that is removeable for the days you do not need it. I may just tie a rolling hitch of some sort on the boom, make the bungy the right length and voila. A removable, simple solution for the days you need it.


Tom
Re: Mast Rotation Inducer [Re: tshan] #180036
05/28/09 09:32 AM
05/28/09 09:32 AM

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DougSnell
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DougSnell
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I liked the setup because it was so adjustable on the water. You could trim the mast rotation to changing wind conditions and pop the cleat to go downwind. I had bungee system looped to a line between the bow tangs that helped rotate the mast to about 110% for going downwind. Simple, yet efficient, as I needed all the help I could get with the H-17 downwind.

Doug

Re: Mast Rotation Inducer [Re: tshan] #180045
05/28/09 10:47 AM
05/28/09 10:47 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 9,582
North-West Europe
Wouter Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Wouter  Offline
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North-West Europe


On the Taipans they add another component that may also be of interest to you.

Basically it is the bungee setup but now the bungee near the boom runs through a small block and the small block is attached to a line that runs through an eyestrap and cleats of to a cleat some distance to the rear of the eyestrap.

This allows the crew to engage and disengage the setp while sailing.

I don't know how well the bungee works but if it is insufficient then this Taipan cleated setup can also be implemented with a simple line for a bungee and really secure the mast. However, It will no longer rotate on its own so you'll have to uncleat and recleat it everytime you gybe or tack.

Wouter


Wouter Hijink
Formula 16 NED 243 (one-off; homebuild)
The Netherlands
Re: Mast Rotation Inducer [Re: GeoffS] #180046
05/28/09 10:49 AM
05/28/09 10:49 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 9,582
North-West Europe
Wouter Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Wouter  Offline
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North-West Europe

Ohh yeah, Geoff's picture is the setup.

Note however that it is not needed to put an eyestrap onto the mast. The system will work just as well without it (and with a continous loop)

Wouter


Wouter Hijink
Formula 16 NED 243 (one-off; homebuild)
The Netherlands
Re: Mast Rotation Inducer [Re: ] #180211
05/29/09 11:54 AM
05/29/09 11:54 AM
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 98
Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA
WillLints Offline
journeyman
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Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA
Doug, i would like to understand the rotation inducer you used on your H17 but the photo is, well, i just can't visualize it. I wonder if you could draw a diagram?
Will


Will_Lints
one-up, Blade 706, epoxy bottoms
Re: Mast Rotation Inducer [Re: WillLints] #181015
06/04/09 08:16 PM
06/04/09 08:16 PM

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DougSnell
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DougSnell
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Will:

Really simple system once you get all the parts made up. I loved it.

Doug

Attached Files
Mast Roation System.jpg (503 downloads)

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