I think this topic was touched upon 2yrs ago but I remember seeing a photo of how Ben Ainsley wraps the mainsheet what looked to be around the back of his hand/wrist. I have got into the bad habit of wrapping mainsheets and spi sheets around the palm of my hand. This isn't good as my right hand in particular is still feeling the effects of last Sundays racing. As I'm not getting any younger! I would like to learn a less damaging means of gripping sheets. Does anybody remember or could let me know a safer way of holding my mainsheet (Keep it clean).

One word: teeth!

I can see it now, wandering into APS (insert your local store front performance rigging shop) and trying out lines and sheets with my teeth.

"You must be a uni-sailor" LOL!

Mark, I feel your pain, litterally! I've had that kind of pain several days after a windy regatta too. I just bought a new mainsheet which is that new soft Mafioli line, and there is about 10 feet of 4mm dyneema spliced in at the tail where it runs through the blocks.

What I found was it is much easier to trim, requires less "pull" due to the 4mm Dyneema running through the blocks I guess, but it is also less "hard" as my old cored sheet was and when wrapping the new one around my hand it doesn't hurt as much.

You may notice I didn't say doesn't hurt -at all- just not as much.

Oh, I also wear the cheap rubber coated cotton gloves you can buy in a hardware store because I find they grip the sheets much better than wet leather gloves, and at only $3.95 per, I can buy several and toss them when they wear out. That extra rubber gripping power means I don't have to squeeze the sheet so tight to trim it which helps alot, and it also helps me when dealing with skinny lines like the spin halyard/snuff line.

Bundy looks to have eaten Gashby for starters and is now on his pasta main course. What's for desert? Tiger's Balls

I hold my sheet kind of like Glen Ashby, or should I say try.

Go here.

http://www.ashbysails.com/blog/

and watch a couple of videos of him sailing, you will see how he holds his sheet. It's hard to explain, but you have the sheet exit out of the bottom of your fist...I can grip it and pull it and not wrap it. If you let a lot out, it is hard to get it straighten back out without wrapping around the wrist. You're only supposed to let out an arm's length if everything is set up correctly. That's actually easier said than done, especially with a newbie like me.

So far, I haven't had any issues with my hands hurting from doing it this way. I've had blisters, but that's another problem.




Mike

I think you'll find the mainsheet loads on an A are a little less than most F16's . Also, due to the amount of hours he puts in his hands are probably a lot more accustomed to the abuse and pain. In lighter winds I probably use a similar grip but once on the wire I'm almost constantly applying as much mainsheet pressure as possible hence the need to wrap.
Timbo's suggestion is one which sounds effective as my current mainsheet is 8mm Dyneema with the polyester cover removed where the sheet turns through the blocks. However, I'd end up with red spi and mainsheets which could be a bit confusing when they'd inevitably get tangled. Yes, I could buy a different colour but it certainly wouldn't be as cheap as the red maffioli at my local chandlery.
Rolf, was it you who posted the sketch of a more professional way to grip a sheet?

Mark,

If you already have a small line running through your blocks add one or two blocks so you have a bigger purchase. You can setup the main sheet blocks as John Alani does so you don't have to worry of sheeting in too hard (optimum point is block to block).

I have a 1:8 on the main with a 4 mm line running through the blocks.

For the spin, we have 2 auto ratchets instead of one (which is not really a problem in light air either).
This setup is feasable for me on the main and Kathleen on the spin. Ofcourse we divide the job and Kathleen has 2 hands free to sheet in the spin. (And she's starting doing the main upwind now ... :-) )

Finally when I sail one up I try to steer on the downwind and not to sheet, which makes it a lot lighter...

When I went to the GP mainsail sheet loads went up.

When I tapered (well got Mark's mate to taper) my mainsheet, loads went up even more as the sheets move easier on the blocks and so, as I never cleat up wind, the loads on the sheet went up too.


I went to a 10:1 mainsheet and I can now hold my mainsail all the time!

In my yonger years I used to grip the mainsheet in my teeth.

It was the blisters I got on my lips that made me see the error of my ways.

Have too much money tied up in dental work.

When I first started racing 16's I watched Hobie Jr use his feet. Lesson 476 in just how much I had (still have)to learn.

I grip the mainsheet with the cleat that is mounted to the blocks for that purpose

I had one of those but removed the temptation by adjusting it out of the way.

I do the same but only when going in the opposite direction for obvious reasons

Hi Gill
Once on the wire, roughly around 10+mph wind speed (approx 13-14kmph) I find that you can't over sheet the main with my 8:1 mainsheet purchase. However, the wind never appears to be that constant hence I don't cleat. This might have something to do with the sail itself as Stealth Mains have a boom/foot which is at least 9" or 225mm longer than a Blades.
In moderate winds I can usually keep the top inside tell tale flying horizontally 90% of the time but the two middle tell tales are often breaking. I use these two tell tales as a guide primarily for main sheet and downhaul tension and to a lesser extent mast rotation. The bottom tell tale is just a guide for outhaul tension.
If I ignore the top and bottom tell tales and want to work on keeping the inside middle tell tales horizontal then it takes alot of mainsheet tension and a fair amount of downhaul and this is with a main that I have had re-cut to "improve" it's single handing characteristics.
However, constant application of mainsheet tension is probably causing untold damage to my hands as I wrap the sheet around the palm and that is why I ask the question? Is there a better gripping technique.

I just cleat the damn thing and keep the boat on the edge using my rudders. I uncleat only when I see a gust coming over the water. That's probably the reason why I'm slow. But then, I can use my hands the day after a race

I've also tried cleating the main and feathering the gusts with the traveler. I think it could work it you have a traveler that actually work, albeit a little coarse grained. My traveler is a little too rough, and doesn't roll easily enough for that purpose however.

I was looking at the Shadow skippers last time we raced with them and they actually never touch their mainsheet upwind: They keep the downhaul in hand instead and crank it hard in gusts. I haven't tried that yet, but as I changed the purchase from 8:1 to 16:1 on my downhaul I may try that next time.

Pepin,

the downhaul technique have been tried and left again on the bigger boats. It was very "in vouge" for a while and the french Tornado team used in the games at Athens. I dont know of any other teams using it there though (after 2004 I lost track).. Trimming the downhaul instead of the sheet makes it very easy to end up with a main much flatter than desireable. To release downhaul properly to re-shape the sail you also need to relase a bit of mainsheet, so I think this will only work in special cases.
About cleating and then driving.. What does Ashby and the likes do on their solo boats? I think they are sheeting actively and helming straight or on waves. I have not checked so I could be wrong.

Mark,
you find it impossible to oversheet your main with a 1:8 mainsheet? Becouse it is too hard to sheet in more? If that is the matter it sounds like you could need more purchase, less friction in your system, better technique or more strength Pick any one you want to improve on
(or release some downhaul to oversheet and go even slower.. )

I dont think how you hold your sheet is going to make a large difference. Larger diameter and softer sheet at the working end is good. Strong grip with good gloves is good. Splice in a 4-6mm dynema line for the parts not running through the ratchet in the system or move to a in-boom cascade system for less friction.

Rolf
I really like the 8:1 simply because you can't oversheet! I think I'm putting on enough tension to pull the sail into it's designed shape, I say this because I get to a point where it's practically impossible to pull any more sheet in, if I do then surely I'm going beyond the designed shape and just pulling the nuts of the the leach which in turn must be having an adverse affect on other areas of the sail shape! I don't really suffer muscle wise whilst sailing with what I consider to be adequate main sheet tension it's just my hands ache for a couple of days after due to them being crushed. I'm using Harken blocks and a 8mm tapered Dyneema sheet which are washed out in fresh water at least once a month so I don't think I have a friction issue and my Gill gloves aren't in too bad a condition.
I might just have to consider adding some purchases and be careful when the adrenalin starts pumping.

Mark,

how about going up to a 12mm sheet, in a very soft braid, so it flattens over your hand instead of cutting into it? Having a large diameter sheet makes it easier to hold the sheet inside your hand instead of wrapping the sheet around the hand.
If your hands hurts after sailing, my opinion would be that you use too much force. That is why I mention things like friction, more purchase etc.

Here is a pic of the best way I have found to hold the sheet if you can not just hold the sheet in your hand. It was posted on the open forum some time ago by John Williams I think.



PS: Mark, in another thread we concluded that oversheeting was catastrophic in a race. Undersheeting was not as bad, but still not fast enough to keep up with those who sheeted optimum. I would want to check my max-sheet point compared to others