Hi peeps,
I was just wondering if any of you have had problems with your back when using a duffelbag filled with water to provide extra leverage for righting a cat. I was told by a sailing instuctor that using it can put a lot of strain on your back. I weigh about 85 kilo's and my boat is 135 kilo in total(Quattro 16) Do you think I will need the bag or is the rightingpole a better option?
I have attached a picture of one of the hulls of my boat in case anyone wants to see. It has been my project for a couple of years now and it's nearly done, just the sails and the rigging to be done. At the moment I am sowing together one of them Sailrite sailkits on our home sowing machine, it's really a lot of sowing...

Some of the waterbags require you to heave them over your shoulder. Others attach to the boat so all you have to do is push them outwards (not actually "carrying" the weight). To answer your question - not all righting bags are as bad for your back.

I found righting bags to be near useless except when it was calm enough that you didn't need them. If you are big and strong enough to use them in 3-5+ ft seas you are big enough not to need then.

I found righting bar that you can quickly deploy and retrive to be a lot more likely to work when you really need it.

These experiences are from a NACRA 5.5Uni that needed 200-300 lbs to right, depending on wind angles. I built the right bar after I left the righting bag on a piling. I left it on a piling beacuse I was using it to keep the boat off the rocks because I couldn't right the boat with it before I drifted into some docks.


Congratulations on the boat. You will get special pleasure sailing something you built.

I agree with Carl. I am 165-170 lbs and with a Righting Pole I can right my 5.5 SL BY MYSELF. It's as much technique as it is weight I've found.

Bags? We don't need no stinkin' bags!

Greg

ok so poles probably will work the best thanks guys.
I have been a lurker in this forum for some weeks now...can't believe it took me this long to find catsailer.com this forum is the best
Are there any Quattro 16(14) builders on this forum? The most recent post about Quattro 16 cats I could find is from a year ago. If you have made one or are making one(Rolf...?*nudge nudge*) please post some pictures cause I am feeling kinda lonely here.
some pictures:

http://img89.imageshack.us/img89/8915/p10100300xc.jpg
http://img161.imageshack.us/img161/6567/p10100357af.jpg
http://img161.imageshack.us/img161/3310/p10100411bv.jpg
http://img161.imageshack.us/img161/3908/p101003377ny.jpg
http://img404.imageshack.us/img404/8473/onemoredeck5ad.jpg
http://img404.imageshack.us/img404/3153/q16spraying4cz.jpg

Lando
Nice work.

Check out my project. My pic's are a couple of weeks old. Its time for paint, the sterns are on, and the beams are glued up. This weekend looks promising, 60 deg on Sunday.

Anyone tried the Interlux Perfection paint?

Bill

Bill,
What kind of boat is that? Did you build it from a kit?

-Rob V.

Its an DK17 A cat.

DK is for the designer Dirk Kramers, its the 17th version of the design.

I built the hulls - 4 half's in Steve Clarks shop last winter. Dirk Kramer (Alinghi's designer) designed the hull shape, he and Steve Clark wanted a larger man's A Cat, more volume, more freeboard around the front beam. This is the 4th boat out of the molds. I heard of the project and talked to Steve, he was looking to defer some of the costs of the mold and charged a small fee to use the molds. Steve graciously helped me build my parts and we used his shop.

See
http://www.intcanoe.us/mygallery/index.asp
go to A Cat construction Feb 05

The pics are from Georges boat, he used Nomex, carbon, epoxy, I used foam, carbon, epoxy.

Foam is much harder to bend, I used Steve's oven and a heat gun, Nomex lays in the mold without any issues. The foam was a pain in the butt, I used heat and weight. Not exactly a scientific process. (see the pic attached)

I drove home with 4 half hulls last winter and its taken me until now to get a complete boat. I did the internal hull structure this spring, and glued them together this summer. I "beamed" it up over labor day, and now I'm getting ready for paint. I purchased flyer rudders, Bimare centerboards, Hall mast, Kinder tramp. The A cat crowd is extremely helpful and willing to answer my novice questions. I'm not sure I would recommend building an A cat from the ground up like this to anyone else, but its been a fun experience.

The beams and boom are from Forte - www.Forterts.com. I used the MAS epoxy system and 1/4 inch Corecell foam.

Right now the platform weights 31kg.

I hope it doesnt sink the first time out.

Bill

Wow....when I grow up, I want to be like you guys...seriously.

That is some incredible workmanship.

-Rob V.

Bill is that a roll on paint and does it use a catalyst?

You'll have a better result if you use a quality polyurethane.

Boat looks nice.

Mike,
Thanks

From the Interlux website. http://www.yachtpaint.com/usa/default.asp

Perfection is the ultimate performing, 2-part polyurethane gloss finish. It provides the longest lasting, ultra high-gloss finish that has superb colour retention, together with excellent chemical, impact & abrasion resistance.

It has been formulated specifically to enable amateur users to achieve professional quality results with ease on topsides, superstructure & decks.

Perfection gives you:

Ultra high-gloss finish with exceptional colour & gloss retention
Longest lasting results - contains a unique package of HALS/UV† absorbers together with a chemically cured polyurethane resin system which protect against premature ageing
Exceptional durability - gives prolonged impact & abrasion protection even on the highest wear areas
Resistance to a wide range of chemicals including fuels, mild acids & detergents

I heard good things about it and decided to give it a try.

Bill

I tried it on Kevlar/cedar strip. I did not find it to be a big improvement over any other 2 part paint. I decided to stick with Imron with US Paints brushing additive.The Imron was cheaper and I know how to use Imron.

I am interested in the A-Class. Were you at Key Largo in Feb?


How does the hull volume compare to the Marstrom?

I use used a similiar hull half construction with a kevlar/cedar strip boat. I was never happy my method attaching the internal structure and the my flange added more weight than I like. If I ever do it again, I will do it differently. What was your impressions of joining the hull halfs.

Hi Bill that is looking good and at 35 kilo you might want to tie it down so it doesn't float up in the air by itself I would love to see it sail, very interesting design. Does it have centre boards or skegs? Building in carbon fiber is great for keeping weight down but for a one off project it is just not worth it making an outside mould (and above my budget too probably).
I think Catman is right about the two part polyurethane paint being the most durable. If you do spray rember to wear protective clothing and gass-mask because Xylene is very nasty stuff indeed.

Sorry Lando, but my Quattro 16 is dead. I bought an old Tornado rig and wanted to adapt it to my Quattro 16 hulls. Unfortunately, I was stupid enough to assemble and fix some foils etc. for the Tornado and went for a sail on it.. That was really a mistake with regards to the Quattro! Instantly hooked on the Tornado, and I haven't looked back on the Quattro or similar boats since (but that Blade 16 really looks like the thing).

I had lots of fun with the Sailrite kit, and learnt a lot both from building the Quattro and the sails for it. I have since buildt some plywood seakayaks from plans and designed/buildt sails for our Tornado (our homebuildt Tornado sails), so the skills have been put to good use. Just having assembled a set of sails yourself is a real eye-opener for what the manual part of sailmaking really is about.

If you did not cover the inside of the hull with epoxy, why did you paint it?
Have you found a rig for your Quattro 16 yet? That was the hardest part for me..
I hope you did some non-skid painting on the double-ply deck, where you will be sitting/walking.

In case you haven't buildt the rudders yet, consider building them from strip-plank instead of plywood. I have personally broken no less than three plywood rudders and two centerboards on our first T. Strip is much stronger than ply, and the foils we buildt in strip still holds up!

About pictures, I have loads of pictures from the construction, and most was posted on multihullboatbuilder.com, but they removed all small projects when they revamped their site. The photos I have are paper copies, so they need to be scanned again.

Hope you get on the water with your boat soon! The pride and joy of navigating a vessel you have buildt yourself is great

Well Jake, I thought you already were . . . .
I remember the last cat you built.
Turned out a little small . . ., but it sure was pretty.
Just take your 36" RC CAT and add some Fertilizer.
(Has not worked for my Victor RC Cat, BTW.)
Mebbe cause mine is a factory model, I don't have the construction skills you have.
You oughta bring your RC to Midlands and we'll race, I'm finally getting the bugs out of my setup. Need to dump that factory Dacron and get the Same Sail material Rico has on his Vikkie, seems to perform better. (Hey can I get that in Hobie Pink?)

It has center boards, I purchased Bimare's clear carbon - hollow boards and used a Hall trunk thats wider and deeper than the boards, so I can switch them out later if I want. Or play with gybing boards or something.

Carl,
I struggled with how to join the hulls and then I saw the inside of a wrecked Flyer, the flyer has a 1.5 inch inside overlap, so I added a 2 inch layer of cloth to one half, on the inside, and let it stand proud of the joint by about 1 inch. I also added a strip of cloth on the outside of the joint once they were together. I liked that solution, they sort of snapped together.

Butt joining the halves didnt seem to have enough structure and I have heard of A cat joints cracking, so I spent more time creating the joint. My hull halves were 6kg with bulkheads, so I had lots of room for adding structure.

As far as volume, I think it has more volume around the main beam. The bows have less and are similiar to the A2 bows, but fatter at the water line.

Everyone who sees it in person says "is it upside down?"

Rolf nice job on the Tornado sails, bigger rig and sails equals more fun on the water I suppose
The only thing I have added to the design is the inspection ports in the decks so I can get a sponge in and remove any water, it should also make it easier to dry out the hulls when the sailing is done.
I think I will be sailing solo most of the time so something as big as a Tornado would not be good for me.
The insides of the hulls have 2 coats of epoxy and one coat of paint as indicated on the Woods plan. The mast and cross beams were bought from www.sailspar.co.uk this was quite expensive but hey this is my baby and I want it rigged out properly.
For the rudders I have ordered the Dotan rudder system, it is lighter and stronger then any home made rudders. I just couldn't see myself pulling strings and levers and point the boat into the wind etc. when going trough the surf so the Dotan rudders seemed the best option.
OMG I also made a couple of sea kayaks from the Chesapeakbay plans(see picture. I have been having lots of fun with them on our Lake, wooden boats always seem to attract lots of attention. One of them was free as I had wood and epoxy left from my Q16.(plywood sheets come in bigger then usual sizes here in France).
btw. do you have any idea why it is called the Quattro 16 because for all I can see there is nothing on the boat that is actually 4 like the name implies(in Italian)?

Very nice kayaks! Shame about the offset color of the plywod on the foredeck on the right one.. Loved the trailer! Think I will have to get something similar as boosting the kayaks to the roof of my car is heavy work.

Bigger boats are not neccesarily more fun, but as we race mostly distance races we appreciate a larger and faster boat.

I dont understand why Richard specified a coat of paint on the inside of the hulls. Two layers of epoxy should be sufficient..
Did you get a rotating mast from sailspar? They could not offer a rotating mast when I was in contact with them, hence the Tornado rig and the de-railing of the project.. I was planning to cut off the foot of the Tornado mast and move spreaders etc. but never got so far.

The Dotan rudders are a good call! You would have managed with the rudders Richard outlined in the plans as well (the rudderheads and up/downhaul was poorly explained I tought, no sketches for that) as the skegs makes the boat track well without rudders down.

I dont have the faintest idea why Richard called the designs "Quattro". Perhaps he was inspired by the "Audi Quattro"?