New to this, wondering if its a good deal

Greetings,

New to the forum and new to sailing. I've been interested in getting into sailing for a while now. The wife has also voiced some interest in learning to sail. We are currently in the Galveston, TX area but have yet to get out on the water. We looked around for sailing lessons and found that it would have cost us $500 to get our license. I was advised by others to skip the lessons and start with a catamaran to learn and then work my way up.

Recently, a friend of the family mentioned he was selling a Boston Whaler Supercat 17 with trailer and sails for $800. I have not seen it yet, but he says it is in good shape. He did not remember the year, but thought it was '82 or maybe '86.

If it is indeed in good shape, does that sound like a good deal? Are parts readily available and are they as cheap and easy to find as I imagine Hobie parts are?

Unfortunatly, we're moving very shortly. The military has me moving quite a bit, which is one of the reasons I think a catamaran would be good. I can't imagine they are terribly heavy, and I have a vehicle that can tow it wherever the Army sends us. We will be moving to the Chicago area this time.

I've looked up prices for lessons and whatnot in the Chicago area and they seem to be quite a bit more than here in Galveston. Yet, another reason why I'm wondering if I should snatch up this cat before we leave.

What do you think?

On a related note, are any of you in the Chicago area? I would like to get in touch with some folks who wouldn't mind giving a pointer or two and direct us to some places to sail.


Thanks

I don't know anything about Supercats, so sorry, I can't help you there.

However, it sounds like you are under the impression that you need a captain's license to go sailing, which is not the case. Yes, you should get instruction no matter what boat you choose and keelboat programs tend to be pricey (as are the keelboats you'd be learning on).

Some cat sailor in your area would probably teach you the basics of cat sailing for a pitcher of beer and some wings. Or if you want a certified instructor I can possibly help you find one in your area.

I may know somebody in the Chicago area I can introduce you to via the magic of email. PM me if you'd like some more info from me.

The Supercat 17 is a great boat. It can be old, but its design was years ahead of its time. This price could be a bargain if the boat, trailer, sails, lines, hardware, etc. are in good shape.

A slightly modified version (a bit wider, self-tacking jib and spi added) is produced nowadays by Aquarius Sail under the name "ARC 17". Most parts remain the same, so replacements are readily available. Aquarius is a well reputed builder. You will find lots of information in their website: www.aquarius-sail.com

Ask your friend to explain how to rig it and to test sail the boat with you.

Good luck,

Supercat 17 is a great boat. If all the bits and trailer are in good shape sounds like a good deal.

I'm guessing the license you are refering to is the one that some states are requiring now if you were born after a certain date. Usually to get those you need to go to some safe boating courses (USCG Auxilliary), but I don't think you need full-on sailing classes to get those. Being the military you might want to check to see if there is a sailing club associated with the base - that can be one of the better deals for getting lessons. As an example, where I work (Goddard Space Flight Center) there is a sailing club that has a fleet of Flying Scots. To join, get lessons, and be club certified to check out club boats is around $150. You might research things like that where you're stationed now or where you're heading.

You should go out on a catamaran and see if it is for you... (my guess is you will love it)

Supercats rock! The ones i have seen and sailed all were solid and handled well. That being said... 20+ year old boats always need parts replaced and work...(so do brand new boats) so you should expect to do some work and spend some cash on parts within the first year...

The price sound good if the boat is in sailing shape.

They are pretty powerful boats and you should get some instruction.... actually the best way to tell if the boat is in good shape and you think you can handle it is to get your friend to take you out on it a few times. Even then... get some instruction, lessons, maybe even a boating safety course

You ask if parts are as available as a Hobie.... NO boat in the world has available parts like the Hobie's (esp the 16) but anything can be fixed/rebuilt/repaired...

Thanks for the quick replies!

The license I was researching was for the larger sailboats. It was required to be able to rent larger boats. I don't think it's required unless your renting...

Renting is expensive as well, so I think $800 for a boat I can take out whenever I want, realizing theres going to be some maintenance costs, is better on my wallet in the long run.

Looking into a club on post is a great idea, however, in Chicago I wont be near anything.

This guy has had the boat for around 7 years he says. Says that the sails are in storage and the boat has been sitting outside storage for a while. He said that I might want to replace the tires on the trailer, and he said the tramp might need some patching.

It sounded like he hasn't seen the thing in a while. I'm going to go have a look see this weekend. I wont be terribly surprised if it isn't in the kind of shape he says its in. We'll see. I plan on taking plenty of pictures. Perhaps I can post them here and people could get a general idea of what kind of shape its in.

Basically, I would be buying this thing, strapping it to the Forrester, and driving to Chicago. If $800 is a really good deal for this cat and a trailer I'll jump on it. If not, I'll wait till I get to Chicago.

Concerning the trailer, what exactly is needed to make it road legal? Do they require plates? Registration? Is it a state by state thing? What about the boat? Should there be a title or something? Does it need to be registered in the state I sail it in?

As far as getting him to take me out I don't think it's going to happen. I was just given the green light to move by the Army so we will be moving in the next week or two. I've been trying to get this guy to take me out on his big 27 some odd foot sail boat but he is busy for the next few weeks.

Stinks that I have been here for a year and just now find out about his boats.

The paperwork varies from state to state. Check what is required in your current state, and try to get copies of what he has that satisfy those requirements. If your current state requires a title, get the title (trailer and/or boat), etc.. Check your new state for what it requires. There are usually variances made for out of state vehicles coming in, but you may need the correct pile of papers for the previous state to make the transition. That goes for the boat as well as the trailer. Some states are lenient, others not so much.

The Supercat 17 is a terrific boat. Make sure the hulls have no soft spots, the sails have some life, and that you get all the parts. I don't need a booat, but would be tempted to get one of those at that price. Getting new tires, and repacking the bearrings is probably essential if you tow it any distance. Try to hook up with a loccal fleet. They'll save you lots of time and money by sharing experience. Many fleets will teach you to sail. Keep us posted.

Is there anyone nearby who could go along and look at the boat with DangerMouse?

On the trailer thingy...the two most important things you need are new tires/wheels (available at Walmart, but measure them first, 4 lug or 5 lug, etc. about $30 each) and new wheel bearings if you are dragging this thing all the way to Chi-town from TX. Also, lights are really nice to have when it's dark and required in most states. Of course you need a tag, but that's usually pretty cheap. You can buy a new light kit at Wal Mart as well, about $25, but the new wheel bearings could be expensive ($100 installed) if you have to get the old ones pulled off at a garage, due to rust (if as you say, it has been sitting a while and might have been in salt water, ever)

But at $800 for a SC 17 with trailer, a pretty good deal, unless it's got holes in the hulls and the sails are trashed.

Spend at least an hour looking at: the hulls from underneeth, the trailer tires/wheels/lights, and the sails/mast. Be sure the mast is not bent or dented.

There are lots of sailing clubs in the Chicago area on the big lake, but find someone who has cat experience to help you get started.

<<<<Looking into a club on post is a great idea, however, in Chicago I wont be near anything.>>>

I'm sure they still have a wonderful sailing club at Great Lakes and they used to have everything from dingies to Naval Academy 44 footers. You may have to risk your life and reputation on a "lead mine", but you will be taught sailing they right way, down to how to tie a bowline or sheetbend.

If the owner doesn't have a title for the trailer it is a major pain, at least in the state of NC. They require you to take out an indemnity bond for 1.5X the value of the trailer. Of course the fee to get someone to write the indemnity bond is about $100 or almost the value of the trailer. Completely ridiculous!

The sailing gang there near you sails at Jamaica Beach (the "Cat House") or the Texas City Dike.

Either way, go here
www.tcdyc.com

and post your question there. Someone will either already know the boat or will be glad to go have a look with you. And they'll also be glad to help you get acquainted with sailing.

I love supercats but don’t feel rushed to purchase this boat because it is available. There are 100's of catamarans available for sale. i bet that $800 plus new tires ($30-40ea), bearings (est $60 ea), registration in TX (if needed)then IL, and gas(est $1.3million) will cost you more than expected and you can find other starter cats for the same amount without the hassle of driving across the USA.


If the boat and trailer is in GREAT shape.. and you really want this supercat... go for it.. they are great but take lots of time looking. take a close look at the hulls, sails, all the metal (beams, mast, rudders, rigging, etc).

I personally wouldn’t purchase a boat that has been sitting outside for years without a test ride, or a full rigging at the very least. Not to mention if you don’t know how to rig it… you will be “flying blind” in IL.

If your going to the Chicago area and your military the MWR program at great lakes Ill had a boating safety cource. Alot cheaper than outside private lessons. Also you can get your uscg safe boating quals done on base. Look into them.

Thank you all again for your replies.

I'll definitely look into Great Lakes and the MWR, I hadn't thought of that. I'm sure those Navy folks wont be too turned off by a Army medic looking to learn to sail.

I called the County tax office here today. In Texas, a trailer does not need to be titled unless its empty weight is over 4000 lbs. I can also get a 30 day temporary permit for $25 dollars, to get me up to Illinois. He couldn't guarantee other states would honor it if I got pulled over, but said he had never heard of it being a problem.

I posted over at that Yacht club. Sounds like they are very close to me. Unfortunately their web server is down so I posted on their temporary google setup. I asked if maybe someone would be willing to check the cat out with me this weekend, we'll see what happens.

If this boat turns out to be in bad shape, what would you recommend? Personally, when I get into a hobby I go all the way, probably more than I should. My wife is another story. I just think it would be a great thing to have to take on camping trips etc. I have a son who is still too young for boating, but I imagine it would be a great father son thing to do when he gets old enough.

Don't worry about it... there are plenty of catamaran's for sale in IL... i am sure you can find one. Look on craigslist, thebeachcats.com, etc... It is a great sport for sure.. I am sure with just a bit of research, you can find a great used cat to fill your needs in IL.

Might be a good deal. Take someone who knows what they are doing with you when you check it out. Or just wait to get one in Chicago. I'm just west of the city in St. Charles and I picked up a Hobie 18 for 600 with most everything one would need. Used cats are cheap unless someone is selling it on a sailing website--ha! Even then they are cheap though. Craigslist is your friend there. Winters suck here, but the summers are great! I'll be in Texas next weekend for the Texas 200 raid with my H 18 if you are still around--it goes from S. Padre to Magnolia Beach.

Dan

Don't buy. That is, unless you like fixing boats more than sailing...

Additionaly to what was already said (straight mast, usable sails, etc.) old Supercats may develop problems in the transom because the rudder stock and gudgeon are strong and the glass may break first. Same with gudgeons loose from th transom. Old rudders may not be working. Bring a silicone spray and apply some to see if they move (one line pulls down and the other pulls up - test). The stainless steel rigging may be in bad shape, torn, etc.

It was stored outside, but maybe something was used to protect it from the sun. Check this. Exposition to UV destroys the tramp and make the hulls look ugly long before permanent damage is caused to the hull. UV damage may be only cosmetic, but it can also go real deep, sometimes beyond repair. Verify.

Somewhere in the web there was a checklist specific for each cat model. There was a link in the Catsailor site years ago, I'm not sure if it is still there. Try to find it if you have to check the boat without experienced aid.

just a quick update:

The family friend just called my father in law. Boats at his house ready for me to look at. He dropped the price down to $300. My first thought is that he had a look at the boat and it's not in as good of shape as he though. This may be the case to some extent, but I think it has more to do with the fact that he just wants to get rid of the thing, for space purposes.


We'll see.

Definitely take a look at your MWR program. The sailing at MWR facilities is usually underutilized. I worked at Del Mar Marina on Camp Pendleton for a number of years it was a great program. After you get through the the different classes you can take out any of their boats. The biggest boat we had in our program was an Islander 36. We had a fleet of Coronados, Cat 22's Cat 25's, Cat 27's etc. We did trips to Catalina Island. And it was all fairly priced.

No multihulls though <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

I took the base commander out on a windy day on a Catalina 27 and he had a grin from ear to ear. I can't imagine what he would've done if it was a real Cat. Let's just say...if you're a punk kid working on an active duty military base it's good to have the Colonel call you by first name. It can get you out of some real jams <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />

I always thought it would be a good community service/ outreach for a fleet close to a military base with a sailing branch to their MWR program to do a "Try a Catamaran Day". NTC in San Diego would be perfect.

It amazes me how little known the MWR program is. I think a lot of soldiers see MWR and think of the little tent they had on the FOB in Iraq that had a warped ping pong table and a few books and magazines.

$300 for boat and trailer, sounds pretty hard to beat

i've pulled up the numbers for a few similar sized and aged boats, the kind you are most likely to find sold cheaply in the usa

Length Width Sail A Weight
Supercat 17 17'00 8'00 234 325
Nacra 5.2 17'00 8'00 220 350
Hobie-16 16'07 7'11 218 340
Hobie-18 18'00 8'00 240 400
Prindle 18 18'00 8'00 218 350

data comes from this page

http://www.multihullsmag.com/boats/boatlists/cats_up_to_20_feet.htm

seems to show the supercat17 is light and has a lot of sail, both good

here is the link to the previously mentioned ultimate catamaran buyers guide

http://www.sailingproshop.com/catamaran_guide.aspx

it doesn't seem to mention the supercat17 but the information is still good for generic checks about battens, rigging etc.

probably a good idea to join the arc forum and ask specific supercat17 buyers questions there. maybe someone has a manual they could copy for you?

http://www.aquarius-sail.com/catamarans/index.htm

be best if the seller will tow it to the water with you and rig everything, even if you don't sail. but for $300 he may not want to bother. if so spend a day trying to rig everything by yourself in the yard. you only have to be missing a rudder or the main block to add another $300 to the price to get it sailing

not sure if the supercat17 came with the "righting shrouds", would be good if it did and you want to solo a lot

post some pics if you can and do some searches on this site

http://www.catsailor.com/forums/showflat...;o=&fpart=1

Thanks for the info. I got in touch with a guy from a cat club in the area who was gracious enough to offer to go with me to check the boat out. Understandably, it was a bit farther than he wanted to go but he offered to have me over to talk cats for a bit before I went and looked at them.

I say them because I just found out that I have an uncle in-law who is willing to sell a cat and trailer for $100. When it rains it pours huh? I don't have any info what-so-ever on this one though.

I'll take plenty of pictures tomorrow.

Ok, so I took a look at both boats today. Went to see the Supercat 17 first.

Took a bunch of pictures and uploaded them to photobucket
http://s16.photobucket.com/albums/b12/DangerMouse_06/Boats/

I'm not a big fan of photobucket, sorry that they are not in any particular order and that I don't know how to embed them in this forum.

First thing I noticed was that there were some cracks in the paint around where I assume would be stress points. I didn't detect any obvious delaminating there or anywhere else for that matter.

Second thing I noticed was that the tramp was a mess. It doesn't have any tears in the middle but the seams are all coming undone. I don't know whether to put it in the repair or replace category.

I apologize ahead of time for my lack of terminology knowledge. The pulleys, brackets, and wires all looked in great shape. None of the pulley wheels were chipped or binded. The wires looked fairly new, and had no freying.

Whether everything was there...unfortunately I don't know. Would have been nice to have someone there who could tell but like I said, the gentleman who had offered to come with ended up not coming because of the distance.

The mast looked ok from what I could see. I didn't see any bends, bows or dents. Again, I don't know if all the attaching hardware was there but what was there was in good shape.

The rudders were detached from the hulls. They're the type that flip up for beaches. The rope within that mechanism, along with all the rope elsewhere, needs to be replaced without a doubt.

There was some damage to one of the rudders which I took pictures of. One of the top brackets on a hull was slightly loose. I can only guess that the damage to the bottom of the rudder blade and a slightly loose top "bracket" = someone forgetting to flip the rudders up before landing on a beach. It didn't seem too serious though. He didn't know where the bar was to attach the two rudders together, and didn't know where the attaching hardware was, or the tiller. They may be buried in his storage and he promised we would find them.

There were also some cracks below where the cross members met the hull. Again, looked cosmetic to me, a layman. Neither hull flexed when I shook the front of it up and down. The seller said that the hull should be resealed at the cross members, as it hadn't been done in a long time.

Each hull had a... port that could be opened to gain access within. These were located at the back of each hull between the two rudder mounts. Below was a small drain plug. I opened the right port hole and took a picture. At first, I didn't notice the water that was sitting at the bottom. In the picture I took you can see it.

I don't know if this is a big deal and I didn't ask him about it because for some reason it didn't dawn on me until I saw the picture after I got home. Now that I think about it I was in my car, ready to follow him to his storage to look at the sails when a lawn care guy pushed the boat to mow under it. I noticed some water drain out.

I recall reading that some water is normal and ok, to a point. I don't know what that point is though.

The bottom of the boat looked ok but there were a few parts that looked like the paint had been totally chipped off. The extreme bottom had a strip about an inch wide of "paint" that was whiter than the rest of the boat and was on top of the paint. It looked like it was brushed on. I don't know if that was bondo or what. I took a picture.

I don't know if the water is from a leak in the bottom or from rain, sitting out for so long. I imagine it could be either one, or both. He said it hasn't been in the water for years. Only way to test it would be to put it in the water I would think.

What else... The trailer, is a home made contraption. It started its life as a galvanized trailer that tilted back to get boats off and on. It was then welded so that it couldn't tilt, and an arm was welded to the front for laying the mast on, and a "bulldog" hitch was welded on the front. The electric lighting needs work. Looks like the wiring is ok but the lights themselves need replacing. One tire is missing and I would have to replace both anyway, probably bearings too. He said they were "buddy bearings."

A few of the rollers are jacked up and would need to be replaced as well. Other than that, trailer looks sound. Don't think it would fall apart on the road. Welds looked ok. Arm that holds the mast is adjustable so I wouldn't have to worry about leaving the mast at the first underpass.

Finally, we went to his storage. After a very brief look found the mainsail and the bar that attached the two rudders. No "spinniker"? and no tiller. He again promised they would be in there somewhere and we could find them later, as he had to leave.

The sail seemed to be in good shape. No tearing, freying, grommits all present and accounted for. None of the battens were broken, and a small jolly roger was attached. arrrrrrrr

Thou I concentrated on the negatives, if those negatives are minor things than overall I think the boat was in good shape. If any of those things raise big red flags however...

I feel it important to mention the sellers character. As I said before, he is a friend of the family, a retired sherrif, and a great guy. He wouldn't lie to push this thing on me. There may be things that he isn't totally knowledgeable about though. He's not a guy who frequents cat forums and races and stuff. He bought this thing to take out and have fun with, then it sat for a while. He a dabbler, if you know what I mean.

That reminded me, there was not a serial plate that we could find. All we could find was the name of the boat dealer and an address and phone number.... Is this an issue?

No title either. In the state of Texas at the time that he bought it only a bill of sale was necessary. I believe the same is true today.

Post is getting long, I'll explain the second boat in another post.

I hope I haven't put anyone to sleep yet!

Second boat. Uncles boat. I haven't added any pictures of it yet.

This "SolCat" was in the back yard overgrown with vines. This thing was in pooooor condition. There had been some kind of accident. Parts of the trailer were bent and a big section of the front of a hull was delaminated and cracked.

The mast looked good. Is it possible to use it as a backup mast for whatever boat I end up getting?

Tramp looked good too. This boat has a bar down the middle unlike the supercat 17.

Trailer wasn't much to write home about either.

The sails however, were in excelent shape. Even better than the supercat's sails. Both were present as well. I had the mainsail of the supercat with me and I laid it on top of the mainsail of the SolCat. The solcat sail was about a foot shorter and a foot wider at the base. Could it be used as a backup sail for any 17? The sail says 18 on it btw.

Anyway, uncle just told me to take what I wanted, sell the rest and some day give him $100 for it. You think I can use the sails and mast?


This is pretty much where things stand. I'm sorry for my dry boring novel here. If anyone bothered to read it all, and is still awake, your input would be greatly appreciated.

$300 for the supercat and trailer, with the issues I noticed listed above. Again, I have no idea how serious our unserious thse issuse are, being a layman.

"$100 some day," for a SolCal in bad shape, but with both sails, trampoline, and mast in good shape. Possible backup parts?

What do you think?

I have a rule of thumb that says don't buy a boat that isn't ready to sail. Its one thing to want to improve a boat another to rebuild it just to get it ready to use. I'd suggest you'll be up for around $500 - $1000 beyond the purchase price before these boats and their trailers are up to any sort of usable condition.

Sorry.

I would pick up a nice used FRESH Water cat around Chicago.
These boats are used only about four months a year.

are prices for used boats in places like Chicago cheaper in the winter? Figure people use them in the summer and then sell them that winter.

Best time to buy is in the late Fall, just before the first snow. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Forget about the other boat. The SC17 seems to be in good conditions for the age and price.

A few comments:

-The SC17 did not have a spinaker, it is the jib that seems to be missing. It is smaller than the mainsail and could be rolled inside it.

- Water in the hulls due to condensation and rain are common if the boat is left unused, not necessarily a problem (but could be, see below).

-The gel coat cracks seem to be cosmetic, but you will only know for sure after disassembling the crossbeams from the hulls. Rain could be filtering through a crack in this area.

-The serial number is probably molded in the transom, close to the inspection hatch a hull. It is difficult to see if the area is dirty.

- In order to re-rig this boat and put in sailing conditions, some advice is needed (that can be obtained in this forum), plus hours (or days) of relatively specialized shoping, and hours (or days) of work.

-I estimate that you'll spend more then USD 1.500 in this boat, probably 3.000 if the jib is missing and the tramp needs replacement, or more than 5.000, if it is in worse condition than you thought and you have to buy more things than you thought, or decide to improve the boat (like buying new PFDs, trapeze harness, sailing clothes, etc.).

-If you are lucky with the missing or damaged parts, repairs are less than expected and the cost you assign to your work time is low, it is a bargain.

-If you feel that problems could worsen, you don't take pleasure from this type of work and your time is valuable, take the advice to buy a similar boat in your destination. Used boats that are ready to sail come with all the equipment, even if used, and are already licensed for the right sailing area.

My personal opinion: if this boat was sitting in my club and was offered for that price, I'd take it. If it was on the other side of the country, I would try to have a more precise assesment of the final cost and work time.

Good luck,

Excellent Post Luiz!

This reflects my second hand buying experience exactly.
You definitely have to factor in the cost of clothing, trapeze and safety gear! Especially if you are running on empty budget wise...
I'd add that Murphy's laws apply to sailboats of any type.

I'd say the chances of underestimating the repairs are exponentially related to your will to go sailing asap.

Dennis

I fear you would be getting into alot of repair work just to get on the road... the trailer needs, wheels, bearings, lights.... no tags, no title... etc.

You won’t get far without any of those items. I believe the supercat was sound once, but it is unknown at this point..

That trampoline is shot... you don’t want to fall through it raising a mast... nor when you are sailing... that’s $400-$500 to replace. All the lines are shot (and gross &#61514;)... there is another few $100.... I would guess all the rigging should also be replace... more $$$.

You could easly end up with $1000's in replacements before you get wet... that’s if you can find parts.

That cat is a steal as a replacement part boat… but probably not worth the work and money needed to get up to speed…

You also may want to consider buying some new flip flops… those look past their prime… (<img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />)

You could always buy my 5.0 and be done with it! $1400 gets you nice rudders, all new rigging, trap lines, 1 summer old tramp, main and jib with windows, all new line, fx hiking stick, 2 different trailers to choose from, new sheet on main, new blocks and cleats, 2 spare main sails and jibs incase you go flying through the one on the boat!
By the way im the guy that emailed you earlier...haha

I just looked at the pictures more... the supercat has some serious looking issues under the hulls... i think you are asking for tons of work and money getting either boat in the water... i would suggest you move, and purchase a boat in ready condition in Chytown

Once you figure in the money to get it sailable, there are far better deals out there.

The bulldog hitch is cool - I thought I was the only person crazy enough to put one on a cat trailer.

That boat could be fixed by someone with knowledge, skills and lots energy.

As a newbee who wants to sail soon, forget it. The time alone to redo the hulls would be staggering. You know anything about fiberglass itch?

You didn't touch that green stuff growing on the mainsheet did you?

The green stuff? Is that why my allergies are going crazy?

Oh and back off the sandals man!! I'm going for that weathered look

@Turbocat, I thought that boat sounded familiar, heh

excelent thread. We've all been where your at looking at our first used boat. All suggestions have been insightful, but my rule for old boats ( I just bought my 11th last nite is ideally spend 500 or less then put 5-10 times that into it <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />. Seriously if you were staying put might be worth your effort but you better have a fare Amount of free time, a tolerant wife and some spare change. The other thought that hasn't been brought up is racing. Racing is the best way to get better at sailing fastest. The chance of your finding other super 17s to race against is slim to none. The is only 1 super 17 I know of in Florida. I would try to get hold of the local cat fleet in chicago and see what kind of boats are showing at their regattas then target on those. Hobie 16s are universal and likely best ba g for the buck all round. Hobie waves are also real fun in medium to heavy wind and fairly bombproof and great solo boats, but are usually 4 k new and not much less used. Whatever you do however, you'll be psyched and think its worth it the first moment you fly a hull on a nice close reach.

And don't forget about....

http://mwrgl.cnic.navy.mil/recreation/marina/marina.htm

It seems they actually have a "Catamarn Beach" although it looks like you can only rent monoslugs. There's a good side to learning to sail on those. Just don't get stuck in that lifestyle too long. Wisconsin is nearby and they seem to have a lot of Cat activity.

Thanks for mentioning Wisconsin CRAW is a active group that has hosted NACRA nationals and has sailors form Ill MN and of course WI Check us out at crawsailing.org. We have a great bunch of folks and sail from sites all over the state.

on the stitching on the tramp coming apart

my 1982 nacra seems to have the original tramp, about 5 years ago? the previous owner ran a simple single running stitch through the mesh to back up the original thread which was breaking from uv exposure

in the usa i guess i would have just bought a new tramp or looked for a 2nd hand one

back in new zealand i would have taken it to a commercial sewing shop to get all seams re sewn but here in backwoods japan no one seemed to have a big enough machine for such work. so instead i spend about 5? hours of quality winter bonding time with my new cat by hand sewing every seam with either heavy nylon whipping thread, for the simple mesh to mesh seams on 3 sides, or waxed heavy nylon thread and a sewing awl, for the heavier area across the back where the tramp is tensioned to the rear beam.

a pain at the time but a good lesson in sewing and i've already used the sewing awl to fix a few back packs etc.

with my new skills and tools i'm also going to sew a couple of mesh pockets to the front of the tramp for the halyards and add some hiking straps

1 of the shots of the supercat seemed to show their expendable shrouds which allows easier righting when the boat goes over

pity you are moving as for $400 the 2 cats would provide HOURS of fun and get you a few credits with friends by getting them off their hands

but as you are moving so far and probably want to get sailing this season you should probably pass on these and pay $800 for something that can be sailed right off

but hey, if you are not buying them and they are not picky about who does pass on the contact details here or elsewhere

Im pretty sure Mr.Mouse just picked up a sweet Nacra 5.0 but i will let him fill you in on the details!

This man speaks the truth!

First off let me thank you all for your replies and input. I can tell that this place has a lot of great folks and a wealth of knowledge to draw on.

I went and checked out TurboCat's boat last night, an '83 Nacra 5.0 that apparently talks! We spent upwards of an hour and a half going over the boat, the trailers and just shooting the proverbial four letter word. He was kind enough to offer to hold onto the boat for a week for me, even though he said he was getting calls left and right for it.

He even got a call after midnight. The way he described it, the heavy beathing on the other line, makes me wonder if it was someone wanting the boat or just a stalker but hey.

Not only was he willing to sit on it for a week, but he's offered to help fix up the trailers, help put a hitch on my subaru, and do some odds and ends on the boat.

I've talked with a handful of cat guys in the area, including TurboCat, and if they are any indication of the type of cat people I will meet wherever the Army takes me than I can't wait to get started.

Here's a question I think both Turbo and I would be interested in asking. He has a light duty cat hauler, and a heavy duty power boat trailer set up for a cat. He thought the HD trailer would be better to haul a cat on because it would not flex the hulls as much while traveling since the trailer frame is more rigid. Seems like sound reasoning to me.

However he says most guys in his area use the light duty trailers. He's giving me both in the sale, and I was wondering which one would be better for a trip from Houston to Chicago. The HD needs springs, wheels and bearings, and the axle looks a bit rusty. It's set up for a cat but I think Turbo saw a problem with the wheel touching the bottom of the hull if the springs flexed enough. He recommended smaller wheels. I don't recall what size is on there now.

The cat hauler is good to go. I would get wheels and bearings but other than that it's ready for the road.

What do you think the best option would be? I'm hoping that selling whichever one I don't use will pay for the extra gas to tow a boat 1100 miles.

Pics of the trailer and boat are here
http://s16.photobucket.com/albums/b12/DangerMouse_06/Boats/

thanks again

personally i would go with the lighter duty cat trailer... you DO want some flex in the trailer and the more ridged the trailer the more the boat itself takes the bumps and bruises of being towed... also you really really want fenders so that rockes don't jump up and bite the hulls...
i went from a slighty stiff gavl. trailer for my SC19 to building a flexier aluminum trailer... just my 2cents worth..

most of all our trailers are a little flexible and very similar to the one pictured under that boat. I would use that one.

Light is usually better, just like your new cat.

I don't like flexy trailers, so I homebuilt my trailer. Flexiness isn't good for the trailer or boat, it's just a way for compensating for improper axle springs IMHO. My new trailer is fairly heavy and very stiff, but I used rubber torsion axles which are well matched to the loaded weight of the trailer.

The converted power boat trailer is probably way over-sprung for the weight of the 5.0.

Do they make spinner-hubs for trailers? Got to tow in style, you know...

haha werd.

What if we took the springs off the light trailer and put them on the heavy duty?

What size wheels do you think would be best for a long distance trip?

Also, fenders for trailers? What are those and can I get Yosemitie Sam on them telling people to back off???

Don't bother. Just use the light one. I had to replace my old trailer, so I went all out on the new one. I'm sure the your light trailer is well enough designed, just check it over first.



Bigger means fewer wheel revolutions for the same speed, which is easier on the bearings.



Fenders are required for trailers in my home state, quite possibly in other states too. Maybe you are thinking of mudflaps?

There are fenders on the Lighter duty trailer already. in pic# 3115 you can see it right under the orange tie down strap. Replace the rusted bolts, new bearings and bearing buddy's, tires and you will probably be good to go. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

If you want something to get out on the water and your not worrying about looks you can make a go of it…if you want to make it into something that looks good…forget it …it will cost you a ton of money and time and you will still end up with an old boat.

I have a 1994 Super cat 17 and I use to own a 1982…that one is pretty neglected…but hey its $300.00…the factory is in Minnesota…you might want to shoot them an E-mail and get their opinion.

The Supercat 17 is a great all around boat…

Regards,
Robert

MR.Mouse is now the proud new owner of a Nacra 5.0 . He came by and we rigged and de-rigged yesterday so he knew what to do when he hits the beach. Im glad my Boat went to Mr.Mouse to say the least. If i didnt find a buyer that would actually use the boat often and i knew would take care of it i wasnt going to sell it. Mr.Mouse came along and i knew immediately that he had good intentions for the boat, and was very enthusiastic about his new cat sailing hobby. We loaded him up for his trip and made a few corrections to the boat and trailer.

Hey Mr Mouse...Have a safe trip man and remember that if your ever back in Texas you,ve got somebody to call to sail with. Take care and have a safe trip. Oh Yeah..dont forget to take all the sockets and wrenches incase you get a flat.

AND DONT FORGET....When she talks to you, you have to talk back...It makes her happy! I'll miss Her, but maybe we will cross paths again.

Did you give him a house plant too? NO??? perhaps try the decaf! - <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />

Glad to hear a happy ending to this chapter of the story! Mouse Sounds like you got a great boat! The 5.0 is another I've often admired. Turbo I like your attitude!

Plastic fenders are available for trailer supply places on lin. I recommend them as they are polyethylene & their corners won't scratch your boat.
A SC-17 was at Kelly Park Regatta a week ago and broke a hull off in medium air. They had a spare... and came back out Sunday.
Always check your bearings before a cross country trip.

How do you check / what should you look for?

Haha, I think I'll be getting the house plant for my wife. Both of our significant others started getting a little pissed because Turbo and I were taking our merry time with the sale, spending pretty much all day yesterday teaching me how to rig the boat and just hanging out.


Likewise, when you find yourself in Chicago let me know. Hopefully it will be in the warm months but if not I'm sure we can find something to do...Maybe take the Nacra out ice fishing????

Sucks that I'm moving now but I think if I had found you guys sooner I probably would have failed out of college and would have had to go back to Active Duty.

Try explaining to you Commanding Officer why the guy that was such a pain in the butt paperwork wise to get this early discharge and scholarship is back in the unit, prematurely, because he spent too much time sailing <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />


Oh, the subaru handled the boat like a champ, BTW.