18 Square

Anyone out in cat-land have a newer 18sq sail collecting dust ????? are there any 18 sq sailors left ???? its still an amazing boat to sail !!!

Lake Norman, NC

Just had Catfest last weekend.

http://home.carolina.rr.com/catfest/

Nice to see the 18sq is still alive in some places !!! not much of a fleet up here in Ontario Canada ..... would love to find a modern sail ...

Are there any 18 SQ sailors on this forum ??? would like some feed back on the newer square top sails , is there a huge differance in performance , on my A-class the square top was amazing and the way it invert and depower the top in strong winds was cool ...does anyone use a tilt trailer ??

After some research on Mike Coleman's 18sq website ( old site but still up ) I curious to find out more info on the other 18sq's that were built , the Climax and Coyote ??? anyone know about them ????

I saw an ad for a Coyote for sale one time, but didn't buy it.I have most of the parts to two Nacra squares, and the wreck of John Lindahl's LCD.

Kool !! nice to hear of more 18 sq's still alive ..... John L is one great guy .... great supporter of the 18 and A-class ... two of the best single handed cats ever ( IMO ) maybe I was born 20 years late but the idea of guys building there own boats from plans and showing up to race agaisnt other guys who built their own boats is just kool .... ok back to reality ... work , kids ..list of things to do ...... LOL .. and I sail a Nacra ... hope to be sailing again this weekend !!!!!!

Hey, Narca where do you sail, as i live in Southern Ont., Thanksgiving I'm going to retreive the Cat from the North, may sail it here, providing it's warm enough???

Paul

Mystere 5.0

Can't help but wonder which one of my 18 squares is the "wreck". I remember starting out with A boats and then going to the 18 square because the A fleet was so small. Now I'm back in A boats. My son, Ian, is in Santa Cruz right now at the A NA's. He's learning about big water. I've got a Yahoo group site at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/LR2ACATS/
Coyotes were from Jim Hanson and the Climax from Gino Morelli.

I have a bunch of 18Sq news letters from the 80's that I could scan and post as pdf. If any one is interested.

Hi, John, how are things?

Oh yes, please scan them and put them online if you can. 18sq and homebuilding stuff is all very interesting.

I believe that there are a few 18sq's to be found on Lake Norman, just north of Charlotte, North Carolina.

I'd also love to see the 18 sq newsletters! Thanks!

Dave

I'm in Guelph and sail the 18sq at the cottage in Stokes Bay Ontario .... also have a Tornado but going to sell it .. I like the 18sq .....

Also would love to read newsletters ....!!!!!

Found this on Youtube ....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xadyiN8seIY

My Nacra has a curved travler added .. much better sail control .......

Purdy boat in the attachment from Bham, AL..... some 18s in Ocean Springs, MS - as well.

I'd like to see those newsletters. And I'm sure that Mike Coleman would be TOTALLY stoked to put them up at his site, and he is the Bearer of the Square Torch:
http://www.geocities.com/mec_coleman/18square.htm

Here's Phil Mumm's vid of me sailing. I thought my sail trim was god-awful until I saw the above YouTube vid. Now I'm not too embarrassed to post this vid:
http://www.thebeachcats.com/gallery2/mai...7cfe24c7d4bb453

Love the Yellow boats !!! sail trim in that first video was so bad ... I really like the curved track on my the Nacra , much the same as my old A-class ....so much easier to set the shape and play the traveler and not the main sheet
Tami , is that a sq top main ??? I have to get me one !!!

Sean

Would love to know where you got the track/had it bent, and the details of how it was secured to the hulls/beam. Pretty please!

Dave

I will take some pictures thie weekend ... old track removed , new track attaches to the center of the rear beam and arcs out and attaches to the tramp tubes ( Nacra ) ..works amazing .. will post pics on Monday night
Track was ordered from local marine store ..

Sail trim in YT video was poor because the main wasn't sheeted in enough, not because it needed a curved traveller, although the curve is nice. I'm sheeted down hard in my vid - the wrinkles are because I don't have the downhaul enough on. I am looking up at it and mentally bewailing that issue as we were sailing along... and we're both way too far back on the boat, but then I'd never really sailed the boat with another person aboard. It being a singlehander and all ;-)


My main, which is most excellent, was built by Jay Glaser when he was at Ullman, and Charlie Ogletree was kind enough to measure/weigh my boat as a service as the Ullman rep. I would now be torn in telling you whom to go for a sail, in that Ogletree is now still with Ullman and Glaser is now on his own...

Tami , is your 18sq a NACRA ?? are you using the standard mast ? and agreed , the curved traveler would not have helped him one bit ... LOL ...

Yes, my Sq is a NACRA.

The mast in the video isn't an original Square mast. It's a stock aluminum 5.5uni mast that I've added a foot to. That said, though, you could prebend an original 'bendy' Square mast - just tighten the diamonds.

Charlie suggested I go with a prebent rig so I ended up with the 5.5U mast, it just worked out that way. I did, before the pictured sail, have a Kevlar Elliot-Pattison main with my original bendy rig. Which I had added a foot to that mast as well - it is a common modification for the old Squares. That is, to have a sail built that's higher-aspect than the old pinhead main, thus you need to add the mast height.

The bendy-rig Kevlar main wasn't as high-aspect as this 'new' Ullman main is, although it was higher-aspect than my 30' luff pinhead Dacron main. (I keep saying 'main' like there's another sail in question. Duh, that's what I get for buying a trimaran. Too many sails.)

LOL ... I'm still sailing on the old pin head dacron main .... still its a real fast boat .... But one must always want to go faster !!!!!! Do you add to the top of the mast ???? I bought a 34 foot Sori wing section a number of years ago from John L ... maybe I should put that on ..... but I was saving it for a Formula-20 sq trimaran project ....
what trimaran did you buy ???

Nacra SQ,
The Sori is a nice lightweight for an aluminium mast.
We had the Sori masts back in the 80s. As this was before the square top main sails the masts were tapered. Had they invented square tops there would have been no need back then to taper the mast. Just wondering if your Sori is tapered?

Regards,
Phill

Add to top of mast. Use a section of another mast for a sleeve between the mast and the addition.

34' is a bit tall. I'd hold off for the 18sq unless you're going to be in light airs.

I have an F-27GS trimaran.

Hey Phil , my Sori section is not tapered .. and its a virgin stick , not a hole in it yet !! I bought it to us as a plug to build carbon masts over .

The F-27 is great boat .. I sail on my friends Dragonfly 25 thats been re-rigged with sq top and sceacher on the bowsprit !! total blast doing 20 plus knots in a boat 19 feet wide ..

Hello Square sailors,

we have 7 nacra 18 sqares at our yacht club

Catergory 2.

2 of them are sailing new skip elliott square top sails

see attached pic

Scott

Another pic of squaretop

Nice looking sail !!!!! any chance anyone has an old sq top for sale ???? Which club are these sailing at ??

That looks like Lake Norman Yacht Club in North Cackalackie.

Curved Traveler pics added ...

The orange one that went to Houston was (largely) destroyed while (by?) being doublehanded by a 190-lber and a 6ft 6 225 lber (on the wire of course) in 15-20 and Galveston Bay chop. The main beam is broken, the port hull is holed, and the starboard hull broke in half at the daggerboard trunk. It's sitting on a trailer in my yard; I bought it because I coveted the rig and the curved traveller.

Thanks for the details. That boat won a couple of 18 sq. NA's and at the time was a real experiment in construction. Many said the plywood/honeycomb/plywood sandwich would never hold up. I guess 20 years of sailing isn't too bad. The mast was a Nacra 5.2 with a tapered carbon tip. Did it survive?
I'd like to see an 18 square with the new LR2-ACAT hulls.

Here's a link to Tilley's tilting trailer design

http://www.thebeachcats.com/index.php?module=pictures&g2_itemId=11313

Here's pix of what I've seen in curved travellers, this is why I say, that traveller looks small to me. Every other one I've seen goes the width of the beam. How well do you find yours works? Are you seeing mast-rotation pressure at the outboard ends of travel? How is your leech tension?

The short track is really only about 4" shorter in travel than the straight track on the rear beam set up ( via. the arc. ) .. it works amazing .. leech tension is great , sail control is perfect playing the traveller and the downhaul ... a great improvement over the standard set up , mast rotates nicely ..the boat tacks without having to release mainsheet tension as on some other cats .. this all may change if I try a newer sail ... but for now it works awesome ... and I'm really happy with it ...

Tami:

Like the new Avatar!!! That you in your younger days?

Doug

frogs on squares

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xadyiN8seIY&feature=related

yes, the mast is intact.

i also got an new elliot sq top made for my sq oversized.i love it.ordering a new spin too jeff

Any pictures of your new main ??

dont know how to show them? un less i email to you

if you use the switch to full screen option at the botton of the window you can add pictures using the file manager in the post options near the bottom ,

I actually saw a Coyote one time, if I remember right, the mast had 2 or 3 spreaders. the hulls were amazing.
I have the section drawings of a Climax somewhere I found on a web page.

I would love to get a chance to sail a Coyote or Climax to compare to the Nacra ..... I really like the Nacra its a blast to sail , points like crazy ....but always wonder how green the other grass is ??LOL

I know of an old Coyote complete with trailer for $2,000.
John Lindahl 269.650.5900

Hey John , have you sailed many of the differant 18 sq's ?? wondering if there is much of a differance between platforms ?? I'm still sailing with your old LCD sail that we picked up when we bought that big Sori section from you ....still a great sail but looking to update..

Time to dust off the 18sq once again !!! Still looking for a newer sail for mine !!! anyone have a newer extra they want to sell ??????

NEW YOUTUBE VIDEOS

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bxo5NRwWR_Q

Very cool video, but I gotta ask - where were the PFDs?

i agree.. adults get the choice to drown, kids dont

Thankfully it seems no one was injured while making this video !! but agreed .... PFDs are a must .... Watching the video has me pumped and ready to get the 18 sq back out for another FUN season of sailing .... wish more people would have the chance to sail one !! they are such an amazing boat !!! fast and simple uni rig !! much like the A-class just scaled up !!1

We have had Henry Bossett build a couple of new ACAT sails and they have looked real good. Since he made almost all my Square sails I'd bet he'd do another.

MY LCD sail ... still in good shape

I bet there is alot more of John's sailing gear in Canada than he realizes.

Fred

This video makes me cringe.

Not because of the boat. I't s fine example of a 18² flying around. Nice and fast boat.

What makes me cringe is the woefully inadequate equipment for the crew considering the conditions.

First wear some kind of buoyancy aid. I believe it is mandatory almost everywhere in the US for kids.

Then make sure your equipment actually fit and never let a meter of strap float away ready to be caught on something.

Don't sail barefooted. At least get an old pair of trainers. I've seen mangled foot from landing badly in a capsize: that's not pretty.

And I'm not even going into the long term issues like sleeve protection or the absence of decent hats or the lack of sunglasses for the young lady there.

But nice boat.

http://www.uscg.mil/legal/cgho/CGHO_doc/cgho.nwl.vol5.pdf
33 CFR 175.15(c) provides that no person may operate a
recreational vessel underway with any child under 13
years old aboard unless each such child is either wearing
an appropriate PFD approved by the Coast Guard or below
decks or in an enclosed cabin. If the child is observed
above deck without a PFD, then a violation has
occurred.

Hey JOHN , is Henry Bossett still with North ?? or on his own ?? My current LCD sail is AWESOME took a while to get battens to work well with it .. black magic carbon fine tuned work well .. would love to try a newer sail LOL just to see what it might do ... always loved the SQ top Goodall sails on my A class boats .. they would depower themselves in a gust and power back up and go ... Just hate the idea of buying a NEW sail for $$$$$ and find its a dud....

I like this video. It is taken from a NACRA 5.5 18SQ of a Prindle.

http://youtu.be/vlqAVoHpP9o

Hi Every one , im steve from australia .I have sailed a hobie 18 for years but recently bought a nacra 18 sq ,Im trying to find as much info on the class and also the F 18 boats , so i have read the last few posts and found youre info really interesting ,, i also wanted to make some improvements to this boats performance ,, by using a F18 sq top main , jib ,,and a symect s pinn , Similar to a f 18 or 5.8 nacra set up ,,, Have any one seen this done ,,?? what type of issues will this bring ,, Any idears also of where to obtain the F18 sail plans and measurements ?? I would appriciate any help or advice greatly ,,Thanks

Steve

i just put a used n6.0 on my 18sq. i'm pretty sure it's over 18sq but it sure spead up the boat. there's a pic in a back thread nacra 18sq. good luck