recommended small light catamaran

I am looking for a small, light catamaran which is fast and relatively light. And that I can buy used.
Have thought of a Hobie 14 but am looking for something a little faster? A Nacra 5.0? Suggestions?

Depends on where you are and your definitions of "small" and "light"-
I have a Hobie 14turbo and owned a Nacra 5.0 for 17 years. The Hobie is >100lbs. less than my 5.0 was and 2 foot smaller. For one person the 14 is great- not good for 2 (adult) people IMO while the 5.0 is good for one person (except racing- number sucks!) and great for two (IMO again). My Taipan 4.9 weighs less than my Turbo and is great for one or two but you could buy at least one of each turbo and 5.0 for price of a good 4.9. An Isotope 16 or Cheshire 14 are both light, small boats but unless you are in NC/SC area you won't see any- Mosquitos are great little boats and popular in Aus and South Africa but very rare in US. Lightest cats are "A" class cats- 165lbs. if 90's up- but they are definitely more of a "racing machine" and 18 feet long with 30' mast but only 7'6" wide. If you are new to cats I would recommend a good 14turbo or straight 14- if you learn to tack a 14 w/o jib (boat I learned on!) in any conditions you can tack any cat that can be tacked plus they are tough, fairly common, and relatively economical. Once you get good on it, and if you find you often get a chance to take crew out, you may want to "move up" to one of the other options.

Kirt

http://www.catsailor.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=postlist&Board=6&page=1

Unless you are light, forget about the Hobie 14 and think about a Hobie 16. Hobie 14 do not support more than one adult, and a light one only. Hobie 16 are a little overpowered for one person, but manageable.

In the small cats category you have the Wave or the Dart 15, both good boats, rotomolded, indestructible, but heavy. They both can do 2 adults as well.

The Nacra 5.0 or 500 is longer, more powerful, still manageable with 1 crew, but capable of 2. Heavy however.

I personally don't like the Hobie 17, but some people do. This could also be an option.

An old Nacra 5.2 is a lot of boat, but a bunch of us did/are sailing this boat alone. But be prepared: it is hard to get back on its feet by yourself after a capsize. But those are fairly cheap and really robust, they take upgrades really well (spinaker!). Also, come with daggerboards, not the ideal if sailing in shallow water.

In the light cat category A class are *really* light, but those are formula one boat: expensive, light, fragile, highly technical, racing only, one crew only. And at 18" long, with a 9.5 meter long mast I'm not sure if it qualify for "small". This said, for recreational sailing, an old non competitive A class is a lot of value for not a lot of money.

The Formula 16 (and Taipan 4.9, there are some in the classified) are light lively boats which can fit one or two people (but not two big blokes). Ideal for around the can racing and fun sail. But I'm biased, I own one.

Hobie FX-one are fun boats too, F16 are lighter, but still ood value for money.

And there are more... Please tell us where you are and what usage you will have. Racing? Jumping waves and reaching back and forth with the windsurfers? Day trip to nearby islands? This should be taken into consideration before making a recommendation really.

I love it how he asks about a Hobie 14 and a Nacra 5.0 and immediately the next logical leap for you people is ... F16!!!!

Thanks for all the great recommendations! I will mainly be sailing on inland lakes - I live near St. Louis - so the wind is rather light most of the time! I am a bit older (55) but strong and light - I weigh about 160. I like the idea of the H 14 since it is light. But will definitely look into the F-16 and the Taipan 4.9....
Seems like there is a bit of a hole for small, light cats!

You might look into the Nacra 4.5 as well.

Dart 18.
Light at 290 lb. Sails great uni or sloop, one person or two. Great price for used ones if you can find one.

A F-16 is supposed to be lighter (230) than a H14 (240), but in the real world this won't make much of a difference.

With your weight you will not have any buoyancy problem on a H14, unlike me! However I think a H14 will be boring in light wind, you need plenty of wind to make a 14 alive.

The Dart 18 suggested is also a good alternative, weight a little more than the H14, is way longer, but is is simpler than a F16 and can probably be found cheaper. some people like the "classic" look of it as well, I personally do not.

Also some of the listed boat have spinnakers (F16, Taipan, Nacra 500), some could be equipped with one (Dart 18, Nacra 5.2) and some are too fragile to be retrofitted (H14, H17, A Class). IMHO in light winds an asymmetric is a good thing to have!

Have fun choosing, form your own opinion, ignore the naysayers. The goal is to have fun!

A price range would be helpful. There's a considerable difference between the a H14 and a Taipan.

J

rfarson,

There's an '81 Prindle 15, near Tulsa, on ebay right now. Jump on this boat! Ends in 9 hours. When new at least, they weigh 260 pounds. I don't think, in this price range, you'll find any boat that compares, performance and weight wise. The DP-N rates these just a few tenths slower than a Hobie 16! It has a single trapeze, rotating mast, great fun. This particular boat includes a Prindle 16 jib. Only drawback I've encountered with mine is some rear beam slap when taking my wife for a ride, in big air.

Nice, small, light, catamarans

ps check under My Stuff, i sent you a PM ps

A Sea Spray would fit your criteria quite nicely. Faster, lighter, and probably cheaper than a Hobie 14. I've also had a H14 turbo and a N5.0. The 14 was a dog compared to the 5.0 but was lighter and easier to manage.

If you enjoy 1 up sailing,a 20'2",digger boards, mast weighing in at less then 25lbs. and speed upwind like a larger cat (H-16 etc.) take a look at a Sea Spray 15. The boat sails fast, resest pitchpoling,very forgiving in heavy air, and at 180 to 200 lbs. full up, can be had for far less then a H-14. They normally come as a std. halyard rig with jib, but are also raced with a sock rigs. Pictures and info can be found on both this and other sites like Canadian Sea Spray .org

Good luck and any in any case, Enjoy the art of sailing

http://www.intl-fiberglass.com/cheshire.html

Check out the Cheshire.....

Check out the built-in dolly on the trailer.

Click on slide show under "Trailer with Dolly Built-In"

Cheshire Rigging

That's the way to launch a cat and protect the hulls.

There are still a number of older A-cats around. I got a wooden one (Cal Fuller 200 pounds) for $1000. It whups all the Hobies around the bouys (stated as an old Hobie racer). I have had more fun with it than years of beach cat racing, and sometimes it supports a Hobie18SX spinnaker, and sometimes hydrofoils. (see my avatar).

This is a lot of great information - looks like I have some exploring to do. Thanks for all your help!

You said lake boat.... what is the water depth like? If shallow, this will rule out some great, optimal light air boats like A-class/A-cat boats because they need dagger boards and don't normally have rudders that kickup automatically.

If you have the water depth and the skill, there are almost no other catamarans that are really fun in 5-10 knots of wind other than an A-cat of any age. On the opposite side, an H14 is completely indestructible but for me is completely frustrating due to difficult slower speed manuverability in winds less than 18 knots. Prindles, Waves and Nacras of the smaller sizes are probably good compromises.

I sail in a large lake so daggerboards should not be a problem. Can A-Cats be found used in the U.S.?

There are two in the classified, but they are relatively recent ('99 and '00) and still in the 7-8 thousand range... Wooden A class are older, way cheaper, but fairly rare: Class A is a platform in constant evolution, homebuilders usually evolved their boat instead of building new ones, changing the mast one year, the hulls the other and so on.

Try here:

http://www.usaca.info/index.php?option=com_content&view=category&id=7:a-class-catamarans-for-sale&Itemid=16&layout=default

Another great thing about A-class is that there are easy sources for new and used parts from various competing factories and the boat only weighs 165lbs. Downside is that it will not withstand beach dragging and hotel resort style abuse. Think vintage Lotus track cars as opposed to an older Corvette.

I would suggest that you find a fleet of A-cats near you and look at the boats actually sailing before you commit to a purchase. (Here is a video to motivate yourself for a drive-- Glen is the current world champion: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qVJJMolTe60 Note how little wind he is sailing in ) When you see them live, you will either be scared to death and run away or scared and strangely attracted like a moth to the flame. If the latter, post an ad on USACA looking to buy a wooden or 90s model C-class. If the former, any of the boats mentioned above are good choices-- best bet it to get one in great condition since parts for these older boats can be more expensive and frustrating than anticipated.

Matt

BS !

He is sailing is some good breeze here !

Wouter

I paid $1500 for an older wooden A. You can soon convert the rudders to kick up with fibreglass rod and a bit of ali tube if you want. The wooden A will have an ali mast that is not as stiff as a new carbon one but can take more abuse, the wooden hulls can take a beating and if your off the beach like me just add some epoxy whereever the hulls wear. There are plenty of good second hand sails and masts around if you want to upgrade no matter what country your in. You can easily handle it, right it, sail it and repair it on your own. It can go really fast or slow if you want, I found it a brilliant learning boat as it only has one sail and instantly tells you wether you've pulled the right string by going faster or slower. If you want to race at club level you will be competative against other boats and have a lot of fun.
regards

I would recommend sailing each of them.. even include a P-16 or a H-17... it mainly depends on what kind of sailing you want to do.. I would not recommend boards if you are not racing at all.. they become a pain... I have had (2) N 5.8's, (2) P-19's, a N 5.0, Tornado and now a H-17...

I picked up an A cat this month and think its got a lot of potential for a PWC. Wasn't able to try before I bought it needed some TLC to get it seaworthy. You can get a beach cat for a lot less and they get on the water in a snap but coming up from an H16 I will be having a ball on this boards and all. No wood just lots of aerospace composites.
I'm new to this board can someone direct me to the A-cat forum? I've got some rigging and tuning questions

Charlie
2000 Boyer MK IV USA 71
Long Beach, Ca.

You can get lots of information right here, but for specific stuff: http://www.usaca.info/

Charlie,
I find more help here than the usca site. You can call or PM me with questions if you wish, I have a mid 90s Boyer A.

dave 509 276 6355 Spokane, WA

I would like to ditto the Prindle 16 mentioned earlier. I've been sailing for 45 years and just moved to a small lake in NC. I looked over Craigs list last spring and was able up pick up a P-16 w/ usable trailer for $550. I put a new tramp, lines, etc on her and cleaned her up a bit and she's been transporting me (and occasionally my g/f too) all over the lake for over 6 months. I can't right her myself (even when I fill the jib bag with water) but there are plenty of helpful power boats on the lake (twice) - after the second I stopped referring her by her new name, then I performed a formal denaming ceremony w/ champagne and a day later a formal naming ceremony also with champagne and haven't dumped her since.

have you tryed the righting pole? It looks like an easy addition and does't need to be emptied once your back up. I've had my A out on the beach a few times and a little dragging on the sand didn't leAve a scratch.
I looked at cats on several sites including usaca.info where one boat for sale lead to another not advertised. One of the things I had to consider was how far was I willing to haul my new boat home. I lucked out finding a local boat already where I wanted to go sailing.