spitfire gelcoat crack

Hi there,

Having sailed a plastic dart 16 for many years, i recently bought a spitfire, so am new to fibreglass boats.

The boat i bought developed during the handover a 4"ish long crack in the gelcoat at the seam where the two hulls join on the top of the starboard bow (in front of the trampoline.

The crack doesnt seem to penetrate any deeper than about 1 mm or so, so i think its just the gelcoat - however the gelcoat seems to have lifted slightly on the raised side of the crack for about 1cm or two, on the outside (starboard side of the hull).

Wondering what caused it, i took a closer look today and found a small circular area (about 2-3" diameter) patch of hull that flexed slightly more than the surrounding area (which was all solid). This was on the outside (starboard) side of the hull directly below the crack, about 6" away. All around the crack feels solid.

Photos are here : http://www.nutsy.co.uk/bekabean/v/Mike/temp/spitfire/

Could this be a dreaded soft spot? Is it likely to get bigger? What could have caused it? I was planning to tape up around the crack (to prevent water ingress) and go sailing this weekend, is that a good idea?

Boat is about 5 years old. Am i just being paranoid after being used to a nice bouncy plastic boat?

Thanks in advance for any help or advice!

Ignore the soft spot. Probably a knee bump or a knock on the trailer that broke some fibers or compressed the foam. From your description this is not in a stress area. So if there is no water getting in it's not going to move. Just ignore it.

For the crack check that it is airtight by aiming the output of a vacuum cleaner toward the bung hole (*don't connect the two, blow from a distance*) and dropping soapy water in the crack. Bubbles = problem!.

If it is airtight, dry it up, tape it and go sailing. At some point in the future call the builder to get a little bit of gelcoat in the same color, remove the crud around the crack, fill it with new gel coat and fair it up. Done.

If it is not airtight this could be more involved as this would indicate that the two hull halves are separating there. It is unlikely however. My guess is that a bubble got trapped under the gelcoat and it just cracked from fatigue.

Get it checked out! If this is forward of the main beam this is a stress area (all the loads of of an unsupported bow, rig compression, every wave plowed through etc.). If you have ever seen where cat hulls fail you will know what I mean. I'm also sure most people remember where team philips failed!
It is quite likely that the the knock to the side has opened this up but you need to be sure that there is no crack down into the main hull seam which will propagate with loading. Very simple repair if caught early but remember gelcoat is just a protective coating and not structural, so shouldn't be used to repair any crack going down into the hull seam, just for refinishing afterwards. If your not sure about tackling this give AW sailboats a call.

Cheshirecatman

Totally agree;

Espically as you are in Essex and so may be very close to Andy Webb in Harwich.

It's worth doing as Pepin suggest and finding out if the crack is air tight or not.

It air tight I would suggest keeping a close eye on it, but not panicking right now.

If it is NOT airtight, I would give Andy a ring and ask his advice.


It might be a simple case of running a hacksaw blade thru the bap, hollowing out a little matting and filling with epoxy and chopped strand mat.

As it is in a potentially high strees area I would err on the side of caution and ask advice of someone who can get close to it and have a proper look.

I would scrape off some more gelcoat to get a look at what is happening beneath it. I would not take the boat out before I had done so.

Soft spot sounds like a point load like Pepin described. If it was on the other side of the hull it would worry me.

Caution. Some of the binders used with CSM are not compatible for use with epoxy.

Cheshirecatman

Nutsy,

I recommend you get in touch with Henry White at Loday White. I guess you already know they're based in Essex, and they'll know the boat better than anyone. Also ask for opinions on the Spitfire Association website: http://www.spitfiresailing.org.uk/index.asp

If that was my Spitfire, I'd get it to Henry, asap. I'd go so far to say that the repair will be quick and inexpensive.

Simon

Hi all - thanks for that, all good advice. It's put my mind at rest a bit! I'll check if its watertight first and then go from there. I'm only about an hour from AW/loday white, but would need to scrounge a trailer, if I can I'll probably take it up there to get an expert to fix it!

Mike

If you have trouble getting a trailer, take the hull off, and stick it on a roof rack (suitably secured fore and aft of course!). That would also help them to fix it indoors, which would be preferable at this time of year. Good luck.

From little things big things grow.
Hopefully this pic will load
The other hull had little cracks on top when I dismantled it.
"Trouble on the weekend" is the best add for an F18 ever made
regards

What's the story of the Tornado? Looking at the photo I wouldn't be surprised to find some centreboard impact amongst the root cause.

Cheshirecatman

(ps. Spitfire is only a 16 footer)

Thats the best bloody add for a F16 that I've ever seen then, which is another cat on my list of have to.

Had this in a post about a year ago
the Tornado had the upgraded rig on it when I bought it.
About 15 knots two on the wire, lost power, gently folded in half exactly at the main beam let go top and inner side then peeled the rest back down the side in fact was still joined on the outside and had to break that off to get it on a trailer. Sold it for bits and when I pulled the other hull off it had cracks in front of the main beam too.
Had just one hull on the trailer the Binks boys said it was now a "cyclone"
I saw Matt Taipan was looking for a T to do up I still have the bow and side with the name on it just needs a few personal touches to get her going again.
Sorry for the hijack but I think it was on topic.
regards

Thanks Jeff, that explains the tearing out of inside aft section of the centreboard trunk and also the forces involved at the front end. If you measure the difference between the hulls at the bow when unloaded and then when rigged and sheeted in hard most people would be surprised at the deflection (boats with bow foils or compression beams excepted), and that is without the side load when piling through the waves.
I hate to disappoint you but the Spitfire is not an F16 boat either. I think it falls outside the rule on beam (by 3cm) and each sail by a marginal amount. It would still be my 16ft boat of choice.

Cheshirecatman

Tell me more about the Spitfire, I wondered why we never heard of them on this forum but there are obviously a few of them about. Were they developed before F16? Like the Taipan. Were they developed despite the F16? How many are there?
regards

The Spitfire came before the F16 or while the F16 concept was in its infancy I think, as a dedicated two-up boat. It is built in England at the White facility and is mainly a boat sailed around GB. At least that is my impression. Looks like good boats with high quality racing and some great fun. Their "Spituba" and "What did you do in the weekend" videos are classics.

Ref: http://www.spitfiresailing.org.uk/

As Rolf says, they are mainly UK and North EU; great boats to sail and a good bunch of people. BUT strictly racing 2 up only.

... although when I do the SCHRS calcs for 1-up, without the jib, it comes out at 1.03, as opposed to 1.035 when 2-up. Given the very close similarity to F16 with the other measurements, I have to wonder if it could be sailed 1-up.

My only concern is with righting it, as it is heavier than the minimum for F16s, at 135Kg.

Mainsail is too big, boat too wide and Spi too big to fit the F16 rules.

I assumed you rounded as I get 1.029 as a rating....

Ok, I accept it is no longer grandfathered into the F16 class, but it is only just "too big" by a tiny amount. Given that its weight results in a slower rating, there is no theoretical advantage - so I wonder why has it been excluded. Is there anything related to the 1-up usage I have overlooked, or is simply the measurements being even a little too big, regardless of rating?

If I lost the use of the Shadow, I would be very tempted to sail the Spitfire 1-up!

But could still be raced singlehanded! Okay, not at Spitfire events but for club racing every weekend. It may not fit the F16 rules but that is neither the issue or a problem. Given the option of a boat to sail 1 or 2 up at club level and the opportunity of fleet open racing I'd still go spitfire, making sure I had a crew for the opens/nationals.

Cheshirecatman

I raced the Spitfire 1 up quite a few times in Club races. It's OK up to top of a 3, but getting a bit hairy from force 4 up.

that tornado pic was scary!

Its a shame the spitfire can't be included in the f16 class, since it would probably help the class grow a bit.

There's quite a few spitfires at my club, and the odd shadow, but no F16's.

Most times cracks in the gelcoat are just that, I put the Tornado pic in just to show that it doesnt hurt to have a close look at cracks. I did a repair on the kids Arrow for a small delamination when I ground back the gelcoat and followed the cracks I had to chop out about 600mm from the bottom and inner sides. How do you know how bad a crack is without grinding it? If the inner tapes intact it would still hold air.