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Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010

Posted By: Mike Fahle

Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/02/09 03:12 PM

From the "Scuttlebutt" e-newsletter:
* The Cuba Run will be the first open ocean beach catamaran sail to Cuba and back. As Cuba is still off limits and has restrictions to free travel and other limitations for all USA Citizens, the US Treasury has made available a way to travel to Cuba on a Cultural Exchange mission such as this event. The start and finish line will be in Key West, with the distance to Cuba to be approx. 95 nautical miles. The event includes a leg to Cuba, a day of racing in Cuban waters, a layday, and the leg back to Key West. -- Details:
http://forum.sailingscuttlebutt.com/cgi-bin/gforum.cgi?post=7539
Posted By: waterbug_wpb

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/02/09 03:40 PM

Depart KW at 10:00 and be ready in Cuba for the drinks by 21:00? You'll have to average almost 9 knots, do-able under good weather conditions...

Any support craft? I'd hate to rip a sail or break a rudder about 1/2 way across...
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/02/09 04:38 PM

Originally Posted by waterbug_wpb
Any support craft?


yes, there should be dozens of rafts, banana boats, homemade sailboats, and perhaps even a few "go fasts" cruising (at least on the return leg). Just make sure you have your green card in-case your "support craft" is pulled over by the USCG

[Linked Image]
Posted By: Jake

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/02/09 05:56 PM

Originally Posted by waterbug_wpb
Depart KW at 10:00 and be ready in Cuba for the drinks by 21:00? You'll have to average almost 9 knots, do-able under good weather conditions...

Any support craft? I'd hate to rip a sail or break a rudder about 1/2 way across...


That's....uhhh...part of the 'adventure'.

Sounds like a blast to me!

(why has this board gotten so negative recently?)
Posted By: ThunderMuffin

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/02/09 05:59 PM

Hrm, this looks...awesome.

Posted By: waterbug_wpb

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/02/09 06:04 PM

Sorry, didn't mean to sound so negative about it, because it does sound adventurous.

Besides, doesn't Hermanos de la rescue provide overwatch in that area?
Posted By: NCSUtrey

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/02/09 06:06 PM

Velocity Sailing 1 has signed up...Jaime Livingston and I.
Posted By: Mugrace72

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/02/09 06:44 PM

Originally Posted by Mike Fahle
From the "Scuttlebutt" e-newsletter:
* The Cuba Run will be the first open ocean beach catamaran sail to Cuba and back.


Wow! I saw this on the Hobie Forum and didn't want to get into it 'cause I was tied up with Tawd.

I do have more than a passing interest in this since in an earlier life I organized the "Key West to Cuba Race" in 1979 and 1980. We sailed from Key West Harbor to Varadero which is 45 miles east of Havana and has a wonderful harbor. The Cubans welcomed us and our US dollars, although we were greeted at the finish line by gunboats with manned machine guns. Nobody told the Navy we were coming! After a short delay, they covered the guns and happily escorted us into the harbor.

It was just done for two years and cancelled in 1981 because of the Mariel boat lift, and the Carter Administartion cut off all travel to Cuba again.

In 1979 we had made contact with the Cuban tourism bureau (INTUR) about the possibility of doing a race to Cuba. Several Key West Conchs had relatives that were in touch with the head of INTUR, Vincente de la Guardia. The short of it was, I was put in charge and we did the race twice.

The first year (1979) we had about 70 boats including the maxi-boat Desparado out of Boston. We had many current top IOR boats, a MORC class, and several PHRF cruising classes. The smallest boat was a Lindenburg 22. There were about ten J/24s.

Although only about 90 miles, this is a very arduous passage, not to be taken lightly. We went at night so as to make navigation easier, this being before GPS and Loran on smaller boats.

I'm not saying it would be fool-hardy on beach cats, but certainly someone else will. With a good weather window and proper chase boats, it would be an awsome adventure. However, it would consume a lot of resources to do it safely.

Props to the organizers and anyone who participates.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/02/09 06:54 PM

Originally Posted by Mugrace72
The Cubans welcomed us and our US dollars, although we were greated at the finish line by gunboats with manned machine guns! They escorted us directly into the harbor.


Wow talk about an entrance!.. Last time i had a machine gun escort...

I just saw on cnn that there has been a run on flights to Cuba since Obama eased restrictions and its turning into a nice little boom in Cuba economy.

All politics aside ... good, i hope the cuban people can have a little economic boom
Posted By: mikekrantz

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/02/09 07:07 PM

I've been following this also. If it does happen, I'll be there...

Posted By: Rolf_Nilsen

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/02/09 07:12 PM

That sounds like a great adventure, and the possibility of a great race as well. Loads of drama for sure. I would love to do it.
Posted By: Mary

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/02/09 07:15 PM

This is certainly not the FIRST cat race to Cuba. It happened at least twice in the late 90's, and maybe early 2000's, organized by (I think the name is) George Ballenger, of Key West. I don't know if he is still there and still doing it, but I know he got stopped at some point by the Treasury Department.

We had a story and picture about one of his trips (I think all on Hobie 16's) in "Catamaran Sailor."

After they got to Veradero, they hooked up with Hobie sailors in Cuba and had a race over to Havana and then had buoys races there with the Cubans.
Posted By: Dlennard

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/02/09 07:18 PM

Originally Posted by mikekrantz
I've been following this also. If it does happen, I'll be there...




Can I come too, I have never been to Cuba. I might get some new boat ideas seeing all those car boats.
Posted By: waterbug_wpb

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/02/09 07:37 PM

I guess if they allowed other boats, if the beachcats had a problem, the lead mines would eventually catch up to them to render aid?
Posted By: BLR_0719

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/02/09 07:37 PM

Just threw the idea out to my Tybee crew. If we can swing it, we'll be there
Posted By: P.M.

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/02/09 10:39 PM

Count me in.
Posted By: Karl_Brogger

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/02/09 10:47 PM

Other than my boat is too short, I think this is awesome. On the Hobie forum the dude made it sound like it was going to be a Hobie only thing though. He hasn't posted on there for a few days though.
Posted By: P.M.

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/02/09 11:02 PM

He has signed several of his posts under the name John A Webster. Any of you south Florida veterans know him?
Posted By: Team_Cat_Fever

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/02/09 11:26 PM

I think he's in Dallas, he's registered for the GT 300.
Posted By: catandahalf

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/03/09 02:14 AM

on your Formula 18, the Melges 24, 0r the Reynolds 33???

Aloha - B
Posted By: Todd_Sails

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/03/09 02:22 AM

I'll crew/drive on just about any cat is this run.

I'll take care of my expenses also.

PM me
Posted By: arbo06

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/03/09 03:13 AM

I like it. I will be looking for a driver for the ARC21.
Posted By: Robi

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/03/09 03:30 AM

If I can get permission from my employer im so in on this.
Posted By: ThunderMuffin

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/03/09 11:35 AM

Robi:

Wouldn't they have a problem with a Coast Guard (technically military) over there?

I remember when I was cruising the Dry Tortugas during spring break with my buddy who was in the Navy. He said that if, for some strange reason, we ended up in Cuba, that he would have to dump all his ID overboard.

He could have been blowing smoke up my butt tho.

Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/03/09 01:12 PM

Originally Posted by Undecided
Robi:

Wouldn't they have a problem with a Coast Guard (technically military) over there?

I remember when I was cruising the Dry Tortugas during spring break with my buddy who was in the Navy. He said that if, for some strange reason, we ended up in Cuba, that he would have to dump all his ID overboard.

He could have been blowing smoke up my butt tho.



Perhaps it was more for his saftey than our rules... heck we have a base in cuba...
Posted By: Jake

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/03/09 04:56 PM

Seacats I and Seacats II are listening intently.
Posted By: wildtsail

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/03/09 05:03 PM

I'm in as well! Too bad its a year and a half away!
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/03/09 05:12 PM

Originally Posted by wildtsail
I'm in as well! Too bad its a year and a half away!


I can't even plan for next week... let alone in 75 weeks
Posted By: ksurfer2

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/03/09 06:41 PM

I'll be in. I wonder if Stank can get a kitchen pass for a quick trip to Cuba?
Posted By: Robi

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/03/09 08:15 PM

Originally Posted by Undecided
Robi:

Wouldn't they have a problem with a Coast Guard (technically military) over there?

I remember when I was cruising the Dry Tortugas during spring break with my buddy who was in the Navy. He said that if, for some strange reason, we ended up in Cuba, that he would have to dump all his ID overboard.

He could have been blowing smoke up my butt tho.

As long as Cuba doesnt find out, all is well.
Posted By: Jake

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/03/09 08:50 PM

http://www.reuters.com/article/vcCandidateFeed1/idUSTRE5526KJ20090603
Posted By: dave mosley

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/03/09 08:52 PM

I was watching a fishing tournament that was in Cuba the other day, and I didnt realize what a beautiful place that it is. Incredible would be an understatement at best.
Count me in on some boat!
Posted By: Team_Cat_Fever

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/03/09 09:30 PM

Originally Posted by dave mosley

Count me in on some boat!


YEAH, RIGHT. Come on...
Posted By: SurfCityRacing

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/03/09 09:45 PM

Quote
OAS votes to readmit Cuba after 47 years


Link

J
Posted By: dave mosley

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/03/09 10:23 PM

Todd, I would race with you, but Im afraid you would throw me under the boat!
Posted By: Team_Cat_Fever

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/03/09 10:38 PM

Originally Posted by dave mosley
Todd, I would race with you, but Im afraid you would throw me under the boat!


You'd have to seriously step up your game! shocked
Posted By: P.M.

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/04/09 12:06 AM

Who is the OAS you ask?
Organization of American States homepage
Posted By: arbo06

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/04/09 02:43 AM

WILL WE NEED TO CARRY PASSPORTS?
Posted By: arbo06

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/04/09 02:45 AM

The OAS is impotent. More like a gentlemens club. (sorry)
Posted By: Jake

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/04/09 11:42 AM

I think the point is that things are loosening up for Cuba.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/04/09 01:11 PM

Originally Posted by arbo06
WILL WE NEED TO CARRY PASSPORTS?

Only if you want to return to America! smile
Posted By: Clayton

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/04/09 01:22 PM

Do you think they will let a Stiletto do it? Its just a beach cat on Steroids! You can cary plenty of beer!... uh, I mean water!

Clayton
Posted By: tshan

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/04/09 01:27 PM

Originally Posted by dave mosley
I was watching a fishing tournament that was in Cuba the other day, and I didnt realize what a beautiful place that it is. Incredible would be an understatement at best.
Count me in on some boat!


It used to be the Monte Carlo of this hemisphere. Tons of casinos and high end hotels. Fantastic sport fishing. Tourism out the whazoo.
Posted By: Karl_Brogger

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/04/09 01:50 PM

Originally Posted by Clayton
Do you think they will let a Stiletto do it? Its just a beach cat on Steroids! You can cary plenty of beer!... uh, I mean water!

Clayton


The google group page says 18-22' cats with a spinnaker.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/04/09 01:55 PM

Originally Posted by tshan
It used to be the Monte Carlo of this hemisphere. Tons of casinos and high end hotels. Fantastic sport fishing. Tourism out the whazoo.


It also was a haven for prostitution, crime and other "social evils". This is way before my time, but i did see a documentary on it recently.
Posted By: palmwolfe

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/04/09 02:09 PM

Originally Posted by andrewscott
Originally Posted by arbo06
WILL WE NEED TO CARRY PASSPORTS?

Only if you want to return to America! smile

Passport rules have changed on June 1st, you now also need one to return from the Bahamas. Takes about a month if you don't want to pay extra to expedite it.

Crew available for this one!
Posted By: tshan

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/04/09 02:11 PM

Originally Posted by andrewscott

It also was a haven for prostitution, crime and other "social evils". This is way before my time, but i did see a documentary on it recently.


It was Vegas before Vegas was Vegas; if you like that kind of thing whistle. Casinos and high end hotels attract that kind of attention.

Of course, a US made documentary may paint a bleaker picture than it really was. Conspiracy theory and all......
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/04/09 02:26 PM

It does seem like it was very Vegas, mob run and all!!!

Posted By: GS01

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/04/09 04:36 PM

Im up for this one . If anyone needs a Skipper let me know.
Posted By: P.M.

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/07/09 03:19 PM

Here is the Hemingway Yacht Club. So, where do you put/manage the expected 75-100 beachcats? The north shore line (where the beach is) appears to be secured with a concrete sea wall.

Attached picture Hemingway Yacht Club, Cuba.jpg
Posted By: Robi

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/07/09 04:39 PM

Interesting, seems to be no suitable landing in that general area.
Posted By: samc99us

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/07/09 04:52 PM

Agreed. We need a different location in Cuba...there appear to be some beaches closer to Havana that would work, however, they also look to be A) Private or B) Resort "owned"
Posted By: P.M.

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/07/09 05:30 PM

Hang on samc99us. There appears to be alot of effort already in place on this project. I'm sure they are working a solution, i.e. trailers in Key West.

As quoted from John Webster on Scuttlebutt . . .

The USA start and finish line will be in Key West at the White Street Pier. The sail to Cuba will be approx. 95 nautical miles across the Florida Straights and will finish at the sea buoy marking the entrance to the Hemingway Marina. The fleet will sail into the Hemingway Marina and clear Cuban Customs and Immigration prior to pulling the boats out of the water.

After checking into the hotel all crew-members and support staff will be asked to collect at the Hemingway Yacht Club where the Yacht Club will host a Banquette dinner. During this event awards for each class will be given out in addition to the First to Finish trophy. Please read event Rules for complete race information (Work in Progress)

The 2010 CUBA RUN Cultural Event registration will open AUGUST 1st 2010 and end OCTOBER 1st. 2010 so there is plenty of time to plan your participation and organize the needed documentation for this very adventurous and interesting event.

Boat trailer storage and accommodation in Key West is currently under investigation and, as can be imagined, a group of approx. 150 to 200 catamaran sailors and 75 to 100 cat trailers is not an easy task to find storage and crew housing in Key West.

Accommodations in Cuba are currently being researched … there are two hotels located within the Marina grounds. One, The Old Man and the Sea has 140 rooms and is an excellent value for money proposition. The management of this event is currently working with this hotel to obtain group rates for the three nights stay in Cuba.
Posted By: P.M.

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/07/09 05:46 PM

Originally Posted by mummp
The fleet will sail into the Hemingway Marina and clear Cuban Customs and Immigration prior to pulling the boats out of the water.
.

Again, I'm sure the event organizers are working on the details. I don't think they would expect a wet skipper and crew to pull out a passport, clear customs, while on a beachcat, after sailing 100 miles, while the boat is in the water.
Posted By: Mary

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/07/09 07:58 PM

George Bellenger and his KWACS have not been to Cuba for about eight years, but he recently posted this video on Youtube about one of the two official race events he organized with Cuba.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZjP8nbIhXOQ

Ironically, even though he has sailed to Cuba on his Hobie 16 a number of times by himself and twice officially as a race (as many as five boats, I think), he is not involved with the organization of this new race and did not know anything about it until I called him today.

Posted By: Mary

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/08/09 04:59 AM

I am thinking that Boyd's Campground on Stock Island might be a good place to stay in Key West. George agreed and said there are a lot of places there to pull a catamaran up on shore.

And at Cuba he said there are grassy areas, quite large, along the breakwall where you can pull cats out. If you want beach, you would have to go to Veradero.
Posted By: Robi

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/08/09 05:09 AM

How about beach wheels? Are they going to some in Cuba? or do they expect the racers to take wheels with them?
Posted By: Karl_Brogger

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/08/09 01:17 PM

six very tired and exhausted guys just pick it up and carry it to where it has to go.
Posted By: waterbug_wpb

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/08/09 01:26 PM

Originally Posted by ksurfer2
I'll be in. I wonder if Stank can get a kitchen pass for a quick trip to Cuba?


with this much advance notice, it's definitely a possibility. Probably need that long to drop the extra 25 lbs to make weight on your tiny new F18! smile
Posted By: waterbug_wpb

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/08/09 01:33 PM

Out of curiosity, I have not crossed the straights before. Would it be safe to assume that the weather/sea conditions vary as much as they do crossing the stream to Bahamas?

I've been across when it's flat as a parking lot (powerboat), and partially across when it got really, really ugly (like "50/50 chance of making it alive" ugly). Bravado has its place, but not in the Stream with inclimate weather.

Didn't Brad get on TV after their sail went afoul and they were stranded in a lifeboat for a week in the stream?
Posted By: Jake

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/08/09 01:43 PM

looks like a huge beach in the middle of your picture to me.
Posted By: Mary

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/08/09 01:47 PM

I am a little concerned about the whole project if they are thinking huge numbers of beach cats -- like 150-200 -- to do this event.

To me it sounds a whole lot more dangerous than the coastal distance races.

The Gulf Stream through that funnel between the Keys and Cuba can be more brutal than beach surf, and no landing place in sight.

You have to be really dedicated to the idea of "cultural exchange," to commit your life to it.

When you think about how few cat sailors are really qualified experiencewise to do the Tybee 500, you have to really think a lot harder about how many people are qualified to go offshore in a small cat across the Gulf Stream.

For a race like that, you have to be able to choose your weather window and wait for ideal conditions.
Posted By: David Parker

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/08/09 01:52 PM

Quote
Would it be safe to assume that the weather/sea conditions vary as much as they do crossing the stream to Bahamas?


Did you watch the video? Serious sea state for a 9-12 hour trip.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZjP8nbIhXOQ

(Why won't it embed? I tried the embed Youtube code...no go.)
Posted By: Jake

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/08/09 01:56 PM

I can't see 150 boats participating and when I see numbers like that it makes me question how grounded the organizers are. However, a sail like this is an adventure and the cultural exchange / teaching kids adds just a little more benefit. Of course there are risks but it wouldn't be an adventure if there weren't. The key is boat prep, body prep, planning, and more preparation. The sailors will have to take a little more serious approach to taking care of each other and I would consider setting up a buddy system of sorts so one boat doesn't get left way behind the others. I also wouldn't recommend crossing this bit of ocean without some sort of experience.
Posted By: Mary

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/08/09 02:02 PM

Quote
I also wouldn't recommend crossing this bit of ocean without some sort of experience.


It's not just a "bit of ocean." How many beach cat sailors have "some sort of experience" sailing in the Gulf Stream, out of sight of land?
Posted By: Mary

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/08/09 02:23 PM

I just hope the organizers will consult George Bellenger, because he IS the expert on making this particular crossing to Cuba and has done it many times.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/08/09 02:56 PM

Originally Posted by Robi
Interesting, seems to be no suitable landing in that general area.


I hear the "Bay of Pigs" has plenty of boat parking.. just not good access to overthrow a nation....
Posted By: waterbug_wpb

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/08/09 04:01 PM

why not open it up to other types of boats? model it after the annual "regatta del sol" from Tampa to Isla Muheres, Mexioc?

That way if the smaller boat(s) break down, there may be a good chance other boats are in the area (or the monos would eventually catch up)
Posted By: Mary

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/08/09 04:06 PM

Used to be a big-boat race (monohulls and multihulls) from Tampa to Cuba for years, and they had to discontinue it because of the new, stricter regulations. I haven't heard whether they are going to be able to start doing that race again. Anybody know?

As I recall, part of the problem with that race was that you are not allowed to spend any U.S. money in Cuba, so they had to have a sponsor to pay for all that in advance somehow. And then there was a dispute about whether that sponsorship was valid.
Posted By: waterbug_wpb

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/08/09 04:08 PM

so, the video makes crossing by H-16 (with powerboat assist) seem almost do-able.

How about spin boats which, by some accounts, are a bit more 'twitchy' in those conditions?
Posted By: Rolf_Nilsen

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/08/09 05:31 PM

Those waves in the video was not scary. Good preparation, emergency gear and emergency communication should make it safe as long as there are some safety boats around. Having a sensible eye on the weather forcast is the most important.

I can imagine 150 boats participating in this even in a few years. Great adventure.
Posted By: Robi

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/08/09 07:03 PM

People cross this patch of ocean in rafts all the time. THey even do it rowing wooden boats and when they make landfall they set everything ablaze.

I dont see how crossing it in a F18, I20 or anything in that size will be so dangerous.
Posted By: ThunderMuffin

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/08/09 07:16 PM

The waves that those H16's were in are nothing that can't be done on a nice, full bow'd N20.
Posted By: Mark Schneider

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/08/09 08:16 PM

Quote
That way if the smaller boat(s) break down, there may be a good chance other boats are in the area (or the monos would eventually catch up)


NO NO NO!

this is a big problem... It is simply NOT FAIR to the monohull classes to say... HEY... we beach cats are racing and if we break down... we KNOW you will bail us out and stop your racing to save our butts!.

They have just as much invested in the race as you do... and they have every right to expect the boats racing to be self sufficient!

On the Chesapeake.. the organizer know that the beach cats are self righting... carry tow boat contact info and DO NOT EXPECT a bailout from a racer! They know that if there is an emergency that is life threatening, the cat sailor will hail Pan on the radio on 16 ... otherwise... the mono's should keep on going ..

Sailors who pirate a distance race give the organizer's real heartburn.... both catamaran and monohull OA's.

For this race... I would expect the OA will have the right amount of crash boats and experience requirements for the race. ... so.. work on that resume and save some cash for the safety boat that will be needed! (oh.. and your spanish... !)
Posted By: NCSUtrey

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/08/09 08:37 PM

If you can't handle your own safety and are not experienced with this type of distance racing, you shouldn't sign up for it.
Posted By: TeamChums

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/08/09 08:50 PM

I used to pirate the Santabarbara to King Harbor Race (130 miles) and would get chastized by the race ORCA organizer often. It was fun to fly past all the F boats with the chute up.
Posted By: Mark Schneider

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/08/09 08:52 PM

How much ocean sailing is proof that you are qualified to do this kind of race?

I know of lots of beach sailors who sail their hobie 16 off the beach... yet they are dog slow in a buoys regatta..

They have miles of ocean sailing and years of experience... does that count?

If they feel they can do the race on their 10 year old 16.. ... are they good to go?

Who in the OA makes the call... Yeah or Nea?

It's an issue.
Posted By: P.M.

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/08/09 09:32 PM

Originally Posted by Jake
looks like a huge beach in the middle of your picture to me.
My point was how do you get to it, hence the comment about the concrete sea wall that surrounds it. Could be a long line at a single ramp, sharing what ever beachwheels that are provided. Inquiring minds and all that . . .

Attached picture 9072321.jpg
Attached picture 11188469.jpg
Attached picture 5885326.jpg
Posted By: Robi

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/08/09 10:26 PM

Originally Posted by Mark Schneider
How much ocean sailing is proof that you are qualified to do this kind of race?

I know of lots of beach sailors who sail their hobie 16 off the beach... yet they are dog slow in a buoys regatta..

They have miles of ocean sailing and years of experience... does that count?

If they feel they can do the race on their 10 year old 16.. ... are they good to go?

Who in the OA makes the call... Yeah or Nea?

It's an issue.
Hobie 16 cant enter this race, its for 18 to 22 foot beachcats with spinnakers.
Posted By: arbo06

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/08/09 10:36 PM

Coral Pink leisure suits, wide lapels and dark glasses. Hmmm.
Posted By: arbo06

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/08/09 11:17 PM

Cuba rejects OAS invitation.... I guess they are not finished with the Human Righs violations and exploitation of the citizenry.
Posted By: Mugrace72

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/09/09 12:41 AM

Have any of you actually contacted the organizers? It looks like they have done a lot of homework and planning.

It seems that rather than guessing about a lot of the parameters, it might be smart for y'all to be talking directly to the guy in charge.

I see much speculation but few facts here.

Just my observations:

That 95 miles can be a piece of cake or a malestrom.

There are plenty of beaches in Cuba.

I can't believe there are cat sailors who can't get their boat in without Cat Tracks. 4 guys can schlep a Tornado, 6 makes it easy. Maybe that's why all my old T buddies have bad backs now.


Anyway, lots of interesting talk here. I hope it happens.

And....yes you can spend greenback dollars. They love'em. They didn't used to take credit cards...probably do now. Again...check with the organizers.
Posted By: CatInTheHat

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/09/09 12:43 AM

This thing is just cool... Lets not talk it to death before it even gets formed. Those of us interested will figure out a group safety system, likely some chase boats will be needed somehow. A few day shiftable weather window should be considered. Anyone interested should seriously consider sailing the Everglades challenge, Hogsbreath, Tybee, and Steeplechase before then, assuming they haven't before, just to get warmed up. But man, this race looks like it has it all.
Posted By: flumpmaster

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/09/09 01:02 AM

Originally Posted by Undecided
The waves that those H16's were in are nothing that can't be done on a nice, full bow'd N20.


Or possibly even faster on a tricky narrow bowed F18 :P
Posted By: Team_Cat_Fever

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/09/09 01:09 AM

Originally Posted by flumpmaster
Originally Posted by Undecided
The waves that those H16's were in are nothing that can't be done on a nice, full bow'd N20.


Or possibly even faster on a tricky narrow bowed F18 :P


You even used the quintessential Tad tongue, nice.
But your days are numbered.See ya in a week,you F-18 junkie.
Posted By: Team_Cat_Fever

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/09/09 01:12 AM

Originally Posted by Mugrace72

And....yes you can spend greenback dollars. They love'em. They didn't used to take credit cards...probably do now. Again...check with the organizers.


I thought it was our govt. that wouldn't let you spend greenbacks over there.
Posted By: Mugrace72

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/09/09 01:24 AM

Originally Posted by Team_Cat_Fever


I thought it was our govt. that wouldn't let you spend greenbacks over there.


That's sorta true but they can't really do anything about it and thats all the Cubans want.

When we did the KW-Cuba race in 1980 I carried $34,000 over in a canvas sack on my J24 to pay for all they hotels and bus tours that we had arranged. US State Dept. and customs knew what we were doing and just said "have a good time".

The next year when there was really bad weather, the boat carrying the money almost sank on the way over.
Posted By: Mary

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/09/09 01:28 AM

Quote
I thought it was our govt. that wouldn't let you spend greenbacks over there.

That's correct.

The following is from www.righttotraveltocuba.org
Quote
The Bush Administration has increased restrictions on our right to travel, systematically denying both individuals and groups with legal ways of going to Cuba. U.S. travelers are subject to serious charges and fines, yet to date no one who has stood up for their rights has gone to jail or had to pay the full penalties. Crjminal charges have been dropped, and in most cases, settlements have been negotiated or are awaiting appeal. By demanding our basic Constitutional Right to travel, we can make a difference!

In one of the U.S. government's most extreme cases to date, two Key West sailing enthusiasts faced up to 15 years in prison for organizing a sailboat race to Cuba's Hemingway Marina. Michele Geslin, 56, and Peter Goldsmith, 55, were indicted on charges of acting as unauthorized "travel service providers" for organizing a 2003 regatta for about 15 sailboats. The event was reportedly the ninth annual such regatta to Cuba, and in no way represented a threat to our 'national security' as alleged by the Department of Justice. All charges were dropped against the couple.

Here is a more specific link: http://www.righttotraveltocuba.org/defending/victories_vs_travel_ban
It's interesting to read all the incidents where people have been fined or threatened with jail.

Also interesting to read all the information that you can find by googling: "Michele Geslin and Peter Goldsmith."
Posted By: Mary

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/09/09 02:49 AM


Quote
Federal rules quash boating trips to Cuba

By Jennifer Babson. jbabson@herald.com. Posted on Sun, Jun. 20, 2004.

KEY WEST - Almost everybody who has lived for any length of time at this end of an island chain knows somebody who has crossed the Florida Straits -- if they haven't made the trip already themselves.

Among those boaters is the city's colorful former mayor, Charles ''Sonny'' McCoy, now a county commissioner, who famously water-skiied to Cuba in 1978, and has returned by boat several times since.

Whether many of the Keys-to-Cuba trips taken by others were ''legal,'' well, that's another matter entirely.

For years, it was rarely an issue, because federal officials charged with regulating and enforcing the 42-year-old embargo against Cuba didn't vigorously examine pleasure boaters unless they were suspected of hauling contraband or cocaine.

At the dock, officials 'would say, 'Do you have any Cohibas?' and we'd say, 'We smoked them all on the way back!' '' McCoy said. ''Then they'd say, 'Next time, save us some.'' It was very light-hearted.''

But that jovial era may be over.

A series of new federal rules, regulations, and procedures have already begun to quash ''regular'' recreational traffic between Key West and Cuba, according to local boaters.

And the potential stakes for violating the embargo have risen sharply in the past two weeks.

On June 9, two Key West sailors, Peter Goldsmith, 55, and Michele Geslin, 56, were indicted on criminal charges that could cost them hundreds of thousands of dollars in fines and up to 15 years in jail.

Their offense: allegedly violating the Trading With The Enemy Act by organizing and promoting a series of sailboat races between Key West and Cuba. Prosecutors say the pair were acting as unauthorized travel agents without a Treasury Department license.

Last week, the federal government released details of new Cuba embargo rules slated to go into effect at the end of the month. The changes would eliminate a controversial provision that has allowed boaters to visit Cuba as ''fully hosted'' guests of a nautical club operated by the Cuban government-owned Marina Hemingway, just outside of Havana.

MORE REQUIREMENTS

Within the next month, the Coast Guard is expected to release the details of more new requirements that would expressly bar from Cuban waters U.S. boaters who don't have an export license from the Commerce Department and a license from the Treasury's Office of Foreign Assets Control, no matter where the trip to Cuba originated.

''We are not going to issue a permit until they can present the licenses from OFAC and Commerce,'' Tony Russell, a Miami-based Coast Guard spokesman, said. In the past, the Coast Guard routinely issued the permits regardless of whether vessels or the people on them were authorized by other federal agencies to visit Cuba.

Many local boaters feel an aspect of their way of life is under siege: after all, they say, Key West's geographical and cultural proximity to Cuba are a matter of history and tradition. But critics say the lax attitude toward boaters visiting Cuba has gone on too long.

Statistics and anecdotal evidence indicate that Bush administration promises to examine boat trips to Cuba more closely may have already had an impact.

The Coast Guard received 263 written requests for vessels to leave the Security Zone off Florida's Coast and enter Cuban waters between October 2002 and Sept. 30, 2003, according to Russell. Since Oct. 1 of last year, only 88 requests have been made. A tiny fraction of the requests was denied both years, he said, mostly because the applicants filled out paperwork incorrectly or inadequately.

American boats have all but dried up at Marina Hemingway, according to its commodore, Jose M. Diaz Escrich, who called the new rules "an artificial wall.''

''There has been a very substantial decrease -- practically we don't have the arrival of any American boats,'' he said, through a translator.

Though some of the new rules have yet to go into effect, they've already made some who would otherwise be inclined to go think twice or abandon their Cuba plans.

''I've been going for the past 10 or 12 years, but I didn't go this year,'' said Joe Mercurio, 61, captain of the charter boat Triple Time.

Mercurio said every time boaters figure out a way to comply with regulations, the feds throw them a curveball.

"First you couldn't spend no money, then they said you have to get an export permit license for the groceries you are taking over and eating yourself.''

Still, some wonder if the tough talk is a product of election-year politics they hope will fade in a matter of months.

''I know hundreds of people who have traveled to Cuba, almost thousands. I don't even know a single person who has ever been fined,'' said Craig Eubank, a Key West charter boat captain who has been to Cuba 37 times in the past 11 years, about 1/3 of them by boat.

While some boaters have sought U.S. government permission to make the trip, others have opted to make the trip without Coast Guard permission, though that's a risky approach.

''People in the Keys tend to do their own thing, like Hemingway did. He would just take his boat and go over there,'' said Eubank, who has a fiancée and 7-month old son in Cuba. Eubank, captain of the Mr. Z. sportfishing boat, said he has always gone to Cuba legally.

AN ISLAND'S APPEAL

Like many locals who've made the trip - which can take 20 hours by sailboat or five hours by powerboat - Eubank said the island holds a special appeal.

A number of boaters who've made the trip 'fully-hosted' admit they have spent money in Cuba but were careful to destroy the receipts. For many, though, the allure of sailing or cruising to Cuba has more to do with a desire to get to know an island that used to be a quick ferry hop away.

''It was our sister country for a long time, remember that,'' said one sailor, who did not want his name used. "It's probably hard for people in the rest of the country to understand that we are so close to Cuba.''
Posted By: P.M.

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/09/09 03:27 AM

Just an observation but that article was written 5 years ago.
Posted By: Mary

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/09/09 04:04 AM

Originally Posted by mummp
Just an observation but that article was written 5 years ago.

Yes, but, as far as I know, the same regulations are still in effect unless and until they are changed under the Obama regime.

Maybe I should make it clear that I do not think the United States government has any right to tell me where I can or cannot go when I leave U.S. waters on a boat.
Posted By: Mugrace72

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/09/09 12:03 PM

Originally Posted by mummp
Just an observation but that article was written 5 years ago.


What's that got to do with it mummp? It still applies.


Originally Posted by Mary

Yes, but, as far as I know, the same regulations are still in effect unless and until they are changed under the Obama regime.

Maybe I should make it clear that I do not think the United States government has any right to tell me where I can or cannot go when I leave U.S. waters on a boat.



Thanks for the updates Mary.

So...it looks like unless the administration changes things soon, it could be a little dicey.

Everyone here is ramped up to do the race, but politics and organizational aspects are what will make or break this.

Cat sailors are notoriously disorganized. Whoever this John A Webster is probably needs help and support. It would be nice to see what he has to say.

Posted By: Jake

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/09/09 12:06 PM

Originally Posted by Mary
Originally Posted by mummp
Just an observation but that article was written 5 years ago.

Yes, but, as far as I know, the same regulations are still in effect unless and until they are changed under the Obama regime.

Maybe I should make it clear that I do not think the United States government has any right to tell me where I can or cannot go when I leave U.S. waters on a boat.


Obama Eases Travel Restrictions to Cuba (April 13, 2009)

and one more
Posted By: Mugrace72

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/09/09 12:18 PM



"Travel restrictions for Americans of non-Cuban descent will remain in place"

Hopefully this will move forward quickly, but there will be some very heated debate in congress. I don't know why they can't just get over it.



Posted By: waterbug_wpb

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/09/09 07:56 PM

Robi's comment about how many people "make the trip" across the straights had me wondering how many ATTEMPT the trip across. He's got firsthand knowledge, and probably some anecdotal figures on those that DON'T make it all the way.

Still, I think it'd be a trip to remember, even if it's on an 18.... smile

And a week plan gives you a few days to play with for a weather window across...
Posted By: Robi

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/09/09 08:16 PM

Originally Posted by Mary
under the Obama regime.
WHOA!!! WOW...

Originally Posted by waterbug_wpb
He's got firsthand knowledge, and probably some anecdotal figures on those that DON'T make it all the way.
Yep I do, some are hilarious some are not so much.
Funny - we spoted a yola doing circles, there rudder got stuck to one side and they couldnt kill the engine.
Sad - The mother that had no family in Cuba, her kids and husband were in Miami waiting for her, we intercepted her and she was scared for her life.
Fudged - The Captain that yelled at me for talking with the "enemy"

I have very serious thoughts on this entire Cuban embargo and how we handle it, but they are very personal and will not talk openly about it. I just do my job and save lives before the sea gets a hold of them.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/09/09 08:58 PM

Originally Posted by Robi

I have very serious thoughts on this entire Cuban embargo and how we handle it, but they are very personal and will not talk openly about it. I just do my job and save lives before the sea gets a hold of them.


and i am sure i speak for many when i say, "THANK YOU FOR WHAT YOU DO"
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/09/09 09:02 PM

Originally Posted by Mary

Maybe I should make it clear that I do not think the United States government has any right to tell me where I can or cannot go when I leave U.S. waters on a boat.


You can go where ever you want.. you just may not be welcome back...
Posted By: waterbug_wpb

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/10/09 04:54 PM

kind of like "you can do whatever you want, as long as you don't get caught".. right?

I don't quite understand the duplicity of people's statement when they say "I don't want the government interfering with my life", when the government has already done so...

Does this statement imply that the speaker does not want law enforcement, municipal services, fire protection, ability to occupy/use land, defense against invaders, and other things offered (or more correctly "taken for granted") to citizens?

Or does it mean that "I only want the government to impose my sense of "right" on everyone else"?

That people have to live and interact together in some fashion virtually requires that some individual rights may have to be compromised in order to promote some sense of harmony, does it not?

I think there are very few who live completely "off the grid/radar" (maybe nomadic singlehand sailors or mountain men?) and are totally self-reliant.

sorry for getting so far off. I need to brush up on my spanish/cuban. Maybe start watching those Novellas on Univision?
Posted By: Mugrace72

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/10/09 05:18 PM

Originally Posted by waterbug_wpb
I need to brush up on my spanish/cuban.


It is called "Cubish" in Key West...and probably Miami too.
Posted By: fuzzy

another WAVE unfriendly regatta - 06/10/09 06:06 PM

so, will the waves be unwelcome to this one as well???
Posted By: Mark Schneider

Re: another WAVE unfriendly regatta - 06/10/09 06:23 PM

No... they are not invited....


Posted By: brucat

Re: another WAVE unfriendly regatta - 06/10/09 07:45 PM

I'd like to start a collection and see if we can come up with a Wave or an old AquaCat to take these two funny guys to Cuba. Or maybe, we could just take one of those inner tubes from a refugee, jury rig a Hobie kayak sail onto it...

I think this could solve a multitude of problems. Who's with me?

Mike
Posted By: SurfCityRacing

Re: another WAVE unfriendly regatta - 06/10/09 08:24 PM

Originally Posted by Mark Schneider
No... they are not invited....


Now that's messed up right there. Even after that guy just did the Ditch on a Wave?
cool
J
Posted By: waterbug_wpb

Re: another WAVE unfriendly regatta - 06/10/09 08:29 PM

Doesn't IWCA allow hooter/spinnaker? How long is a wave? Would it not meet the 18' spin boat requirement?
Posted By: mayhem

Re: another WAVE unfriendly regatta - 06/10/09 08:34 PM

Years ago, Tim Rynolds (Team Key West Worrell 1000 sailor) and I talked about organizing this race after Clinton allowed sports and cultural exchange exemptions in the Cuba visa restrictions. The great thing about the Tybee500 and W1000 is that they had a nice sandy beach nearby that would allow anyone to sort themselves out and be relatively self sufficient. No beaches between Key West and Cuba. We thought it might be a good idea to put two motor boats out in the middle somewhere and make it a safety gate.
Posted By: waterbug_wpb

Re: another WAVE unfriendly regatta - 06/10/09 08:50 PM

so what's the final verdict from the legal standpoint? Are US citizens of non-cuban descent allowed to travel to Cuba in this cultural exchange?

And what about ground crews? How does the organizer propose travel for them (if they're allowed at all)?
Posted By: Robi

Re: another WAVE unfriendly regatta - 06/10/09 08:52 PM

Originally Posted by mayhem
Years ago, Tim Rynolds (Team Key West Worrell 1000 sailor) and I talked about organizing this race after Clinton allowed sports and cultural exchange exemptions in the Cuba visa restrictions. The great thing about the Tybee500 and W1000 is that they had a nice sandy beach nearby that would allow anyone to sort themselves out and be relatively self sufficient. No beaches between Key West and Cuba. We thought it might be a good idea to put two motor boats out in the middle somewhere and make it a safety gate.
Again, people cross it on inner tubes, rafts, row boats, if it floats they get on it and cross. Crossing it on a beach cat will be piece of cake compared to how the Cubans cross it.
Posted By: Mark Schneider

Re: another WAVE unfriendly regatta - 06/10/09 08:55 PM

Rather then a gate

the tracking tools that they used for the tybee would be a perfect solution... put one on every boat... The safety officer knows where they are and the race fans can follow at home. Your safety boats could trail the fleet and actually know where the back of the fleet actually is!
Posted By: waterbug_wpb

Re: another WAVE unfriendly regatta - 06/10/09 09:01 PM

Has this technology proven accurate and reliable? If so, I agree that is a good idea.

Would it be safe to presume that safety equipment similar to that required for T-500 will be required? Sounds like their past trips have been pretty casual, but this sounds like a formal race thing...

I also agree that certain "qualifying" races be used to show the organizers the teams are up to the challenge. Like what was suggested earlier - KL steeplechase, Keys 100, T-500 (optional), OBX 500, or other coastal races 75 km or greater...
Posted By: P.M.

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/10/09 10:46 PM

The title needed fixin'. Carry on. . .
Posted By: Mary

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/10/09 11:24 PM

Thank you, Philip. I don't know why people change the subject title in the middle of a thread. Makes it very confusing.
Posted By: arbo06

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/11/09 12:29 AM

I beleive it is Spanglish, if you have to lable it.
Posted By: Mugrace72

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/12/09 12:03 AM


I just got this today. It seems there is a lot of sentiment toward getting Cuba back in the fold, so to speak. I think the old policies never did what they were intended for. The Cuban people are wonderfull and they shouldn't be punished any more.

Besides, I want to go back.


Dear Jack,

At Orbitz we believe passionately in the power of travel to transform lives. And we believe that people should have the freedom to travel wherever they choose.

Americans today have the right to travel to any country in the world except Cuba. Three weeks ago, we launched www.OpenCuba.org, a campaign that gives people a way to petition U.S. leaders to end the 50-year Cuba travel ban and give all Americans the freedom to travel to Cuba.

With Congress considering the bipartisan Freedom to Travel to Cuba Act, the opportunity to end the 50-year ban hangs in the balance.

Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Beach cat race to Cuba in 2010 - 06/12/09 02:06 PM

Originally Posted by Mugrace72
Americans today have the right to travel to any country in the world except Cuba.


I am booking my flight to N Korea tomorrow..... Anyone know if they are testing any nuke's this week?
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