Nacra 6.0 What?

I have an '89 N6.0 which was built and sold in '88, sail #38. I am wondering what its configuation was called and how I can max out its performance without tearing the mast in half.
Performance is adamant that if I add a square top, it will snap the mast, I have also heard this from other first hand sources so that is out. Performance was also against adding a second set of diamonds and larger spreaders to acomodate a sq top.
This boat has a self tacking jib which I want to keep. It has no overlap, and travels on a track full leingth on the front of the main beam. This is not a curved track---yet.(N20)
This leaves the main, which is boomless.
I have read that the express had a massive main compared to the original(mine?). Was that a sq top? I have also been told that the jib configuration is an Express.(?)
What about increasing the foot leingth and a larger roach, leavin most of the increase low on the mast. Would this leave the sail too full and unable to depower? Also an un-managable leech?
What was done in europe to increase Ball size.
Any input is appreciated, other than "sell the boat".

I'm pretty sure I know the boat you have. It's a Nacra 6.0 original, not a North American. You have a Morrelli main and an EP main. The EP is the larger one for the N/A version. It simply has a bit more roach to it and generates a bit more power. In heavier air, you could break the mast if you don't upgrade to the longer spreaders and internal diamond wires. I'm sure it's the same mast extrusion as the N/A. You should contact Skip Elliot at E/P sails since he was one of the big designers along with Roy Seaman on this rig. Bullsheet on the square top crap. I sailed one a few weeks ago with a square top and ran the piss out of it. The mast did just fine with us double trapped. I would get the curved jib traveler track and stay with the jib configuration. The front spreader you have is the old version (round bar) and you should keep an eye on it and possibly upgrade to the foil type at some time. I have one for that boat if you're interested or you can get them through Murray's or Performance.
You have a great boat. If you upgrade to the longer spreaders and internal diamonds, they can be a pain to adjust. Get intouch with Rick Bliss from New England Catamarans for some inside tips.

whats an internal diamond wire???

My Nacra 6.0 NA has 2 sets of diamond wires, with one set sitting inside the other. So I guess that he means the smaller inside set as being internal.

Gotcha... i couldn't figure out how a wire would be run "Inside the mast".

Better known as intermediate-diamonds... that confused me at first... I designed and ran a square top for a couple of years... makes the sail plan very powerful, butcan depower it quickly also... I do agree with sticking with the self-tacking jib...

cheers...
Scott

Scott, PM sent, check your mailbox here!

I spoke with the guys at performance and was told that it is a lighter extrusion than the NA. I thought about adding the internal wires, but the NA mast configuration is a lot different. hounds nearly 2' higherspreaders 18"higher. I have been told that if I make these changes, the existing holes will weaken the mast and defeat the purpose of the changes.
I thought about adding the longer spreader in the current position, using the existing bottom diamond tang and one higher up than the current upper position to attach a longer outer diamond wire. and use the existing upper tang along with a new tang near the base of the mast for the inners. I just dont know how these measurements were derived on the NA, and how doing this willi nilli will affect mast bend and performance. If someone would post the measurements of their 6.0NA wires, I guess I could make a more educated decision.
I am just about to place an order for new shrouds, forestay and regular spreader bars, and dont want to do it twice.
This boat has original EP jib and main, and untii I got caught in a storm in rocky point a month ago, they were in pristine condition. The boat has hardly been used and is in beautiful condition, so I want to do what I can to optomise performance without making it a $10,000 boat. I would like to get a sq top when i upgrade the sails this fall, or sooner. But need to make the rig changes first.
How about some of you engineer types, any ideas about rig configuration?
Also, It does have the foil spreader. When I was in Mexico, the center strut on the foil curled up like a pretzel and got stuck into my furler. Performance said i am the first one ever to have this happen to their knowledge. Im lucky the foil held up when the wind started gusting over 40 and snapping power poles in Los Conches.

This boat come from Santa Barbara?

Yes

Hmmm. Not the boat I thought it was. It's not purple by chance, is it? You may want to either buy a new mast, or have Skipp Elliot make you a square top that will work with the softer mast.

Um, no, not purple.
If I could find an NA mast I would probably go that route.

Ohh Kay!!!! If this is the boat I am thinking about; the guy you bought it from got it for him and his son to go sailing? I believe he put on a new tramp, and got a set of beach wheels for it. If so, this is an awesome boat as it sits and the sails etc.... are in great shape. I had talked to the original owner at length and was on my way to look at it when the guy you bought it from jumped on it.

In speaking to the original owner he and another guy bought this boat to do the Worrell 1000, and they never had the chance to do it. It was sailed a few times for set up and practice and then sat in a warehouse in West Hills, CA for a number of years. From what I was able to find out from Performance there were only a handful of these built in this configuration. I may be wrong, but I think you have a slightly larger mainsail that the standard 6.0, but smaller then the NA, and a slightly smaller jib to accommodate the self tacker. I believe the spinnaker was never used and if you’re looking to upgrade you may want to go with the newer style Inter 20 hardware setup (pole and snuffer).

Congrats on your boat, this was an awesome deal and thought about it again when it was up for sale this past spring.

Bring that bad boy on over for the Tri-Point, and if ya need a crew we'll find ya one

Yes, that's the boat.Clean as a whistle. and the spin is still un-used. I have a large F-18 spin on it now. I also saw it the first time it sold and tried to talk a friend into buying it, he passed. I had just sold my N5.7 (after winning the innaugural Border run) when it came up for sale again.
Only thing I dont like is the whimpy mast.

On a related subject,
The self tacker system seems to leave the jib pretty loose at the leech. Even when using the top hole on the clew plate. How tight should the leech get?

Also, if anyone knows where to find a used curved tacker track, It would be a great addition.
I am looking into thre tri point, maybe the W&R.

Something else I forgot and it may be nothing, but check the measurement of your bridal tangs from the main beam.

The reason I say this is that when I spoke to Performance they had mentioned the name Roy Seaman a few times pertaining to these boats. In looking at a few of the 6.0 he had brought to the Milt and the other ocean race we do here in Ventura, he was all about huge jibs and radical mast rake. To accommodate the jibs, he had the bridal tangs almost to the front of the bows.

fyi - This may screw you when getting new rigging

Those boats that Roy did that on had holes drilled in the bows like we did your spinn pole John and the regluar tangs were still in place. Since you brought that up, the converted 6.0 I saw in Ventura (franken boat) had the tangs just behind the front of the decklid. This boat was a 5.8 that was converted to a 6.0. The normal production 6.0 has the tangs just ahead of the decklid.

You won the border run??? I thought a boat with black sails won this little race...

These boats were not retrofitted by Roy like Frankenboat or the guy from Morro Bay that had a whole custom stainless steel piece mounted to the front of the bows. They were production boats.. Not speaking gospel here, just an after thought of something to check.



Sounds like you need to make it to the Tri-Point to set the record straight

Sounds like you need to make it to the Tri-Point to set the record straight

[/quote]

I have the trophy. As for tripoint, I would love to come shred it up, but I sold my boat last week and I have a newborn on the way... No worries though, I will have a new boat soon enough.

matt

John you are right, Performance did build eight 6.0s with self tacking jibs for the Worrell. Gary and I owned one of these boats for awhile. I thought the mast was the weakest point on this boat. Boat also had big spinnaker with broad shoulders ... DDW. This boat also came out of the Santa Barbara area and had very little use. Not sure if it raced in the Worrell or not.
Buzz

You probably had one made for yourself. Boatless or "Nutless"? Who cares, get a new boat and talk some more smack beeatch! I can say that since I delivered your first baby (Tiger). Now you gotta put on the catchers mit for this one. Sell your wife's Tahoe and get her a VW so you can get a new boat. Geeze man, do I gotta tell you how to do EVERYTHING!?

Disclaimer: Team Chums has NEVER beat Team Chums II. EVER! Maybe someday but I doubt it.

I thought that might bring you out of the woodwork Matt.
I didnt say that it wasn't a short lived victory.
I have the printout of the original placement framed on my wall next to my second place trophy. If you like i can email you a copy. I still dont know what the PHRF is on a N5.7.
Congrats on the Baby. Healthy and happy I hope.

All I can say is that if you want to be down, then you best check out team chums, cause when you down with team chums, you down as can mother f'n be! team chums biotch!!

As for the race, no disrespect to the other teams, they sailed really well. In fact, AZ put on a clinic. Having said that, just using straight up portsmouth numbers without factoring in calcs for square top main sail and added spins on boats normally not equipped as such, we still finished well ahead of all the other boats. I am not sure how in the world the race committee for the border run came up with their figures but they somehow screwed this one up big time! If you run just straight portsmouth numbers it is team chums II, wet kitty, team chums, wild kitty, TheMightyHobie18. If you factor in square top main and spin, it is: team chums II, team chums, wet kitty, wild kitty, TheMightyHobie18. The elapsed time is noted at www.theborderrun.org if anyone doubts my calcs. Not that it really matters, but I do feel bad for Brett given the race committe reported incorrect results at the onset...

Just talking smack to your teammate. Dont get your undies in a bundle. You smoked all comers.
I hope Santa brings you a new cat for christmas.
Good to hear from you, Sleep well.
P.S. 3:am wiggle the leggs like they're riding a bike till they fart, then its off to a late night snack.

would this be the rating you're looking for?


CODE 0-1 2-3 4 5-9

Nacra 5.2 Slp 2-up N5.2 72.1 78.0 74.8 71.6 67.4
Nacra 5.5 Slp 8.5' N5.5 67.0 73.5 69.5 65.7 61.2
Nacra 5.5 Uni 8.5' N5.5U 69.7 74.4 71.9 69.0 64.5
Nacra 5.7 2-up N5.7 72.6 75.5 74.8 72.2 68.6

from here

http://www.ussailing.org/portsmouth/tables08/tables08mh.asp

Hello Brett,

Thanks for your post. My post above is directed to my delinquent brother in team chums, just haven fun!! It's been good to see new interest in sailing here in az. I just want to be sure you and others know that I did not high jack the race. If you want some rail meat on your new 6.0, just give me a shout. Thanks for your note on the new baby. We are expecting Brayden by Sept 2nd, which is just around the corner!

Westside respect bitch, your sh-t aint down if your posse don't wants to through down with Tri-Point.

Congrats on you upcoming arrival, boy or girl?



Word!!!! Go over to Sailing Anachary on check out the Border Run thread under Multi-Hull Anacahry. I had made a few inquiries as to how they came up with such screwed up ratings. Two words Mark Michelson, it is all coming clear now? It would be nice if there was a wholesale adoption of a system like TEXCEL. Would certianly take the question out of class legal vs. square top retrofits etc.....




The original owner of this boat had it at a warehouse right around the corner from you. I was just walking into Wells Fargo to get the cash when he called to let me know that boat just sold.

BTW - Am I still banned? And did you vote? Don't forget, as I always say; "vote early and vote often."

John it is my understanding you were never banned and I did not vote.
Buzz

While the OGs may not be there, I think Brad S. may show up; not sure though... Perhaps next year I will be there with a new boat. Do they let hobie waves race?

I am going to look for a 60na mast, and then i'll get a sq top dress for her. then I'll give you a shout and you can show me some tricks.

Can't make any post, not that I care too.



Brad is, AAMOF I have his main sail sitting here in my office ready to take to EP for spome repairs. Hobie Wave??? Is it 18' or better

AZCat - little further info on yer boat. Last spring when I was thinking real hard about buying that boat I had made some inquiries about some upgrades.

One of the things was to add width to the beam of the boat. As noted earlier in the thread there was a 5.8 in our yard that was stretched to a 6.0 and the beam was widened from 8' to 9"3". I was thinking 10' My purpose for this was two fold; the boat wouldn't heal as fast making for a better family platform, give more tramp area making the deck cleaner, but also to exploit the sail plan - think Tornado!!!! There will be some argument on this, but then again this is a personal preference.

The other thing I thought about was doubling up on the diamond wires as earlier mentioned and recommended by Lee Wickland. In doing that I would also going to a heavier wire for the diamonds. My thinking the same width that was used for shrouds. I upgraded the width of the wires with my 5.8 and and honked down to a 1.5" pre-bend and this seemed to have stiffened things up a little - so it seemed. I can't understand why NACRA didn't go to the thicker extrusion. My 5.8 had a "noodle mast" too and is use to bug the daylights out of me. Funny Prindle mast are pretty stout, and my 18-2 mas is a solid as a rock.

I had also looked at about upgrading the spinnaker system to the Inter 20 style snuffer.

The last thing I was thinking about was a square top, but that would have been only after I had thrashed the original sail; which would have been in a few years.

To get the hardware for the beams, mast, and spinnaker snuffer etc... you're looking at about $3K

I know you don't want to turn this into a $10K boat, but!!!!!!

I think I will just attempt to beef up the mast or change out the mast to an NA.

Why couldent I run a second set of diamonds up to , say, the spin tang area? Is this due to compression/

Or run a sleeve over or inside the mast to add stiffness?

If your gonna change out the mast, why not go carbon?

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$