F18 and H16 Double Stack

Hello All,

We need to double stack a Hobie 16 on top of an F18 (Infusion), I've got a couple of ideas for doing this but wanted to know what other people have done before we do the stack this weekend.

Piece of cake, especially since the Infusion has straight beams.


Ghetto double-stack:

1. Get two, eight-foot long 2x4s and a bunch of old towels (and 4 old PFDs are a bonus). Also, get lots of tie-downs and extra line.

2. Remove rigging from both boats.

3. Tie the bottom boat to the trailer.

4. Put the 2x4s on the deck of the bottom boat, usually just inside the front and rear beams. You are using the 2x4s as crossbars here. Wrap towels around the 2x4s where the boats will contact them. If you have spare PFDs, place them between the decks of the bottom boat and the towel-wrapped 2x4s.

5. Place the top boat onto the towel-wrapped 2x4s. Adjust spacing of the boards and padding as needed.

6. Tie the boats together (at the 4 corners of the tramp). This is very important, as you don't want the top boat sliding around, which it WILL do if you only tie it straight to the trailer.

7. Tie the top boat to the trailer. If you're going a short distance, one line from the center of the front beam to the trailer would suffice (basically a safety line). For longer trips, I have tied all corners of the top boat to the trailer (although some would say that this is overkill).

8. Double-check the routing of all the tiedowns. You dont' want to overlap any, as they will chafe and may break.


That's basically it. Some other things to consider:

Some folks swear by removing the tramp of the top boat to reduce drag, especially since H16s have raised tramps and curved front crossbars (raising the front of the tramp even further).

You'll need to sort out where to tie the masts. Sometimes you can tie them to the bottom boat, sometimes to the top.

Stop frequently (once an hour for the first few hours anyway) and check all tiedowns for looseness and chafing. Normally, the loosening only happens in the beginning, and once you adjust/tighten a few times, they tend to stay put.

Having a Nacra and a Hobie in such close proximity may cause spontaneous combustion, especially if anyone sees you pull in at the regatta.


Hope this helps.

Mike

Thanks Mike, that does help. What are your thoughts on flipping the Hobie 16 over and double stacking that way?

where do the H16 beams sit on the F18? Do they match up?

That's the way we do A cats (Top one upside down), not sure how that would work with the frame shape on the H-16 though.

Best case is to fab up some uprights for upper crossbeams so the 16 isn't sitting on the 18 at all.





Cheap aluminum struts and galvanized L-brackets secured with U-bolts. Check your trailer's weight rating before stacking, though!

I've seen the inversion method done with identical boats, with non-raised tramps.

Haven't seen anyone try that with a H16. The hulls are wider than the tramp frames, not sure if that would be a factor.

EDIT: One major factor with inverting a H16 would be the curvature of the front beam. If nothing else, that might be the deal-breaker.

Rightside-up makes more sense (to me), especially for different model boats. The crossbeams won't be in the same place, so that might cause an issue when tying them together (if inverted). When rightside-up, they don't need to match up, as the tiedowns will just angle over to where they need to go. Again, watch for chafing.

Mike

John, that is definitely the best way to go, but if someone is only doing this one time (or once every 5 years), I don't see them spending the cash, time or effort.

EDIT: That method will also require the crossbeams of the trailer to be outside the front and rear beams of the bottom boat. Some trailers are not so adjustable.

The ghetto version is simple, cheap, and works. The materials can then be re-purposed for other things afterwards.

Mike

For this weekend we are going ghetto. My long term plans are to buy Kathy a H16 and I'll probably go with a more robust double stack at that time. I will miss my Trailex.

We're not using the Trailex for the double stack.

I built a wooden box to put the a-cat upside down ontop of the 20 and used it to haul to the keys several times. I bought several pressure treated 2x6s, hot dipped lag bolts, and a little carpet. I made the box large enough to span the beams of the 20 fore and aft but narrow enough to be just inside the hulls on the A-cat. I cut the 2x6's to fit the N20 beams and stapled in some carpet. I then eye-balled a center of gravity and cut the length-running 2x6s to fit the a-cat beam (a-cat inverted). A little carpet on there. I then drilled four holes on each length-running 2x6 - two just under the leading and trailing edge of each upper boat beam. I then took two pieces of quarter inch line and stopper knotted each on the extreme forward and aft holes, over the beam, through the other hole, and then put a trucker hitch to tie the two together. Did that for both sides. The upper boat was really firmly connected to the rack. The rack was then secured to the trailer (notches kept the rack tied firmly to the bottom boat).

Worked like a champ...not sure how the H16 beams would interface while inverted though.

Are double trailers out of the question? One towing the other?

Note, I edited my original post to indicate that the 2x4s are crossbeams, in case anyone comes back to this as a reference someday.

I wouldn't have thought that clarification was necessary until I read Jake's last post. I still can't picture that "box" in my head...

Mike

I seem to remember that the 16 just about sits on the Infusion beams almost touching the deck inbetween. i went through all sorts of padding, but found 4 small car tyres to be the best. Not pretty, but if you bag them or wrap then - just the job.
I was towing behing a motorhome so the windage on the 16s tramp was not an issue. you could put the 16 on backwards if you like
I always tie the top boat TO the bottom boat rather than the trailer, this reduces the load on the bottom boat slightly

You are referring to tandem trailers, correct? Not sure how many states allow that. I thought that there was a thread here a long time ago that listed each state's trailering rules. Does anyone recall this?

Mike

I've got some trailex double stack parts(cradles on TX mounts,etc.) if you change your mind for the long run.

If sweetness is going Hobie, who's going to keep you from getting spat out the back of the F18 fleet?

Why don't you just put it on the top rack of your rack trailer?

I believe that the National Laws govern tandem trailers on the interstate system...and it's allowed as long as you're under 65'. When you get off the interstates is when the state laws come into play. Note, however, I believe all require that the first trailer be a 5th wheel trailer (with the goose neck hitch that connects over the tailgate into the bed of the truck...or a semi truck arrangement).

http://www.hitchemup.com/statetowinglaws.htm

Mark "I'm Batman" Herendeen

Thanks, I think that was the link that I was looking for.

Not sure if it's the feds or states (or some combination) that make the rules, but they are enforced by state officials (not feds). Tandem trailers are most definitely not allowed in all states, on or off the interstate.

It's sort of a moot point. If tandems are only allowed on the interstate, how would you get to the beach?

Mike

I have a F250 and a 30' 5th wheel and pull my F18 Tiger behind my 5th wheel. I've been doing this for 6 years and never had a problem. You can't back up both trailers, so if you get in a bind...just unhook the boat trailer. Also, you need to travel a bit slower. The only thing I find is the boat bounces a bit more behind the 5th. Don't worry about turning extra wide...the boat will follow the 5th wheels track perfectly.

Several freight companies use tandem semi-truck trailers (UPS, FedEX, DHL, etc.) I was nearly certain they were allowed to pass through all states on the freeway in that arrangement.

Fla. rules.

link

"Several freight companies use tandem semi-truck trailers (UPS, FedEX, DHL, etc.) I was nearly certain they were allowed to pass through all states on the freeway in that arrangement."

We see them in NY too. But when they get to the MA border, they have to unhook the second trailer before they cross the border. A second tractor has to come out to drive the extra trailer into MA. There are special lots for this on the interstates right near the borders.

Personally, this seems silly to me (if they're allowed in some states, they should be allowed in all, especially if we're only talking interstates here), but politics is what makes life interesting (to somebody, I guess)...

Mike

Pulling a double bottom catamaran setup sucks. Too light, with too much windage.

Well, that helps.... The cape might slow you down though

I believe in FL that doubles are allowed on interstate (but not triples). Once you need to get on smaller highways/surface streets, it's not very practical to pull doubles anyway. Trailer interchange yards make it relatively easy to transition to/from doubles.

But, overall, it's still cheapest to haul stuff by water, then by rail, truck, and air. So just sail those things down and you're all set, right?

Just put some dense foam cushions on top of the F18 and then throw the H16 on top. Works great as you can see from the photo.

Hobie and AHPC trailered together mass hysteria.

Kinda looks like they are mating, doesn't it.

It doesn't get simpler than that. I also have a couple of $$ for you, I'll find you at Tradewinds.

Yeah, we tend to over analyzed these things while sitting at the desk. If you just go out in the driveway and do it, you'll figure it out

Two thoughts:
Did you consider reversing the H16 on top so that the lower part (the rear) of the tramp faces the wind while you are driving?
Go to an electronics dept store and ask around back if you can have some of the large styrofoam blocks that components and appliances come packed in to use to pad between the upper and lower hulls.
Sheet In!
Bob

The foam thing looks like a great option.

I bet the 2x4 idea started way back when there were no cats but H14s and H16s. You know, before foam was invented...

I know for sure that I was using it before using the internet.



Mike

Yeah but then the mast would have to be low in the front and high in the back and would hit the car

"Kinda looks like they are mating, doesn't it."

And after the deed is done the C2 eats the Hobie...lol

Is that a Hobie condom on the end of the mast?

You're exactly right. Nailing a couple of sets of small "risers" to the bottom of the forward 2x4 was necessary to compensate for the beam curvature. Rear cross-2x4 can be a single piece.
Slap some carpet on it and you're done. (note - bottom H16 facing forward and top H16 bows to rear, or you're really popping-a-wheelie!)

I did the packing foam and swim noodles thing to take an H17 & TheMightyHobie18 to NAC's last spring. Cheap and functional.
Found that I needed to tie from the bow tangs of the H17 to the mast stand.
In big cross wind, top boat would eventually work itself off center (no matter how well was tied to bottom boat)