Respect the Game! Is the fundamental principle still releva

Thefundamental issues in the recent rules thread buries the lede. While looking for something else this AM... I stumbled on this article. This judge speaks to the same issue...... Port pushing the line on Starbord all the way up to soaking their spin sock before measurement... Originally publshed on Scuttlebut in 2011


Is the ‘Fundamental Principle’ Still Relevant?
By Peter Wilson, US SAILING Umpire/Senior Judge

As a racing sailor who is also a coach, judge and umpire, I worry that the ‘fundamental principle’ which is the foundation of our (mostly) ‘self regulating’ sport has become significantly less relevant. As a consequence, our racing rules appear to have less value to competitors, and the behavior we expect these rules to encourage is not as prevalent as it used to be.

Quoting from the RRS, “Competitors in the sport of sailing are governed by a body of rules that they are expected to follow and enforce. A fundamental principle of sportsmanship is that when competitors break a rule they will promptly take a penalty, which may be to retire.” Most of us would agree that this means; 1) If I hit a mark and whether someone sees me do it or not, I should take a one-turn penalty; 2) If I tack to port because I can’t fetch the starting pin and force a boat on starboard to tack when she can fetch, I should take a two-turns penalty whether or not the other boat hails protest; and 3) If a boat fouls me in a way that significantly worsens my position in the race, I should enforce the rules and protest.

However, what I have observed on the race course over the past fifteen years, in the U.S. and abroad, is a growing percentage of sailors who do not enforce and follow the rules. I see sailors break rules with contact between boats and ignore their infraction, even when the other boat protests or the infringing boat gains an advantage in a flagrant foul. I am not talking about incidents where who is at fault is unclear and no penalty turns are taken or no one is protested. We all do that from time to time. I’m talking about the apparent trend towards an obvious level of clear infractions with no action by either party. What seems puzzling is, if it is so easy to exonerate, why does it happen so seldom? Why do sailors break rules and keep on sailing if no one protests? Why do sailors use kinetics when there are no judges around? And a related question is, why aren’t there more protests taken to the room? Are the rules not as relevant in today’s world as they used to be?

Perhaps the best analogy is speeding on the highway. Lots of us drive above the speed limit. But when the radar detector says we are approaching a trap, or we see a cop parked up ahead or coming up behind us, we slow down. But most of the time, the ‘speeders’ speed. Similarly, when there are judges or umpires enforcing Rule 42 (kinetics) on the water, body pumping, rocking, and sculling seem to disappear when the judge boats are close by, but they often reappear when the judge moves on to observe other boats. And, when judges whistle their observation of a foul with the option to protest, competitors usually take their penalty…and when the judges are not around (or don’t whistle/protest), not much happens. Just like speeding, it seems as if one doesn’t break a rule unless an official says we do.

In a recent Laser event, the judges flagged over forty Rule 42 infractions, but observed at least twice as many serious infractions of Part 2 rules (many where boats gained an advantage), and that does not include twice again as many contact incidents observed at the starts with an adequately long line… and fewer than five percent of sailors took voluntary penalty turns. I guess judges can only control the behavior they are authorized to monitor, unless they want to discourage enforcement and compliance by the sailors.

If indeed our racing rules and the ‘fundamental principle’ have become less relevant to many sailors (but not yet the majority) …why is this the case and should we do something about it? Here are some possible reasons for lack of ‘compliance’:

Most of today's sailors under the age of forty have grown up playing a variety of sports where you do not break a rule unless the referee or umpire says you broke a rule (and penalizes you).
Mark roundings in large fleets of Optimists and Lasers have complex situations where no one can figure out who broke a rule, and starts are often so crowded that minor contact is frequent. Both lead to lack of protesting that may well carry over to the rest of the race course.
No harm no foul” is a more practical way to sail. Minor contact or a close incident is viewed as ‘no harm’, so just as going 5 mph above the speed limit doesn’t seem to break the law, neither does minor contact on the starting line.
The protest process most often requires a major time commitment with an uncertain outcome...and the rewards from social activities after sailing are a 'better use of time'.
Protesting is also inhibited by peer pressure, so "you owe me one" can be a more practical solution when you are fouled. Cooperation is far more socially acceptable and productive on the race course.
The rules are complex, particularly for transitions, and only the most dedicated and experienced judges/umpires/sailors understand them well...and most sailors don't take the time to really learn and understand the rules.


What can we do about the problem? Is it practical to fully referee our sport? Of course not...although we know umpiring works pretty well for all concerned in team racing, match racing and medal races. And there is good evidence that having judges or umpires on the course with authority to signal by whistle their observance of a foul, and protest if they want to, can work in big fleets when the judges are positioned at the starts and mark roundings where most incidents occur. However, there are clearly not enough judges or umpires to implement broad scale on the water judging.

So what do we do? Should we abandon the fundamental principle? I would not because the majority of races sailed each year have to rely on it. Should we accept the sailors ‘no harm - no foul’ principle? I would not because clearly it is leading to some ‘no protest - no foul’ behavior where some sailors gain a big advantage. Perhaps we need to change the incentives to protest and at the same time the incentive to exonerate on the water and to avoid the protest room. For example:

1. Give more power to the protestor. Allow a protested boat to take a 25% scoring penalty any time prior to the hearing (unless there is damage or injury or competitive advantage claimed in the protest). However, if the protested boat does not take a scoring penalty before the protest hearing (either voluntarily or as a result of arbitration) and is deemed to have broken a rule by the protest committee, the penalty is a DNE.
2. Make it easier for a protested boat to exonerate on the water. Change the alternative penalty for immediate exoneration to one-turn except within the zone or when there is contact, where it remains two-turns.
3. Require on-the-water judges with Sailing Instruction permission to protest at all national championships, ladder events and international qualifiers. An on-the-water protest by a judge/umpire is an automatic three turn penalty (two more turns than a voluntary penalty, except at a mark or with contact), and can still be taken to the protest room if there is damage, injury, or competitive advantage is gained, for a possible DNE.
4. Increase the penalty for a breach of rule 2 (fair sailing), perhaps a DNE and a DNC for the next nearest race in the series.

Some may feel that the direction (and it is only that) suggested above is draconian, and perhaps it is. However I believe the issue needs to be addressed with big changes if we want to reverse the decline in adherence to the ‘fundamental principle’.





March 17, 2011

IMO... he nails the problem.... Less convinced about the solns.

Well written but the bottom line is the sailors are in control. It doesn't matter what the rules say if the two parties involved in the infraction make a deal on the water or have an unwritten understanding how they will handle the situation.

Didn't there used to be a rule that if a third party witnessed a foul and no action was taken by either party the third party could protest those involved and they could both be flicked? HUGE D!CK move but if you really feel the game is suffering with how it's being played now that is one rule that could force the actions you're looking for.

It's also been my observation that it's the youth sailors that will file a protest and will happily sit in the room to make their case, maybe because they are too young to drink. Maybe we should ban adult beverages at regattas. Probably not a such a great idea to boost attendance though, on the bright side we'd get more protests (maybe).

This gentlemen also made a good point about the sailors not knowing the rules. If a sailor gets fouled and doesn't even know they got fouled then as far as I'm concerned it is shame on them for not making the effort to learn the rules.

Another reason protests are often not filed... there is a significant lack of rules knowledge and those that know and understand the rules simply are not interested in sitting in a protest room while the party goes on without them.

It's not perfect but the system works as far as I'm concerned. If I'm fouled I'll protest. I've been in this game way too long to expect people to do the right thing so it's on me to protest or not. I've accepted the fact that there is no way you're going to legislate morality.

I think that if the sailors don't have an issue with it, you don't need to do anything. I'm not going to get upset on a club race day if another boat is fouled lightly by another boat and they don't end up in the protest room or screaming at each other but, instead, one says "you owe me" to the other.

I liked it better the other way Jake, short and to the point.

could it not be argued that in said club race scenario, you noting a protest on the offending boat might be an opportunity to encourage (or educate) that boat on rules knowledge?

I know many a keen sailor who protested me was nice enough to educate me on whatever rule I was afoul of. In some cases, Ding even told me how to avoid the infraction or move to block the other boat's ability to put me in a fouling situation.

Perhaps the current culture's view of "rubbin' is racin" and our promotion of "bad boys/girls" who gain notoriety by pushing limits and rules might have something to do with this behavior?

Definitely. We do hold each other to a particular expectation of fairness and I don't have any hesitation to talk to someone about a situation on the course to either increase my knowledge or theirs (even if it is to help them understand they are being an butt). We have a lot of campfire rule review sessions after racing in our local catamaran and club fleets. In almost every case, if one of us feels fouled and promptly notifies another offending party, they'll take the penalty turns even if they're not sure and we'll talk about it later. I'm quite happy with the level of honesty and our ability to discuss things at just about every level of our sport.

I can't say that I see the same level of people considering that a rule hasn't been broken if they haven't been called out on it that the article is written about....but, there is a well functioning judiciary system in place for the sailors to self-police. You can not like what you see on the water if you want, but you can also protest it if you are racing. If the sailors have a clear and accessible method to stop the existing practices that the author doesn't like, is it really a problem if they choose not to act?

"Didn't there used to be a rule that if a third party witnessed a foul and no action was taken by either party the third party could protest those involved and they could both be flicked? HUGE D!CK move but if you really feel the game is suffering with how it's being played now that is one rule that could force the actions you're looking for."

I don't always see this as a D!CK move. There are time when a foul leads to an advantage to the boat but does not really effect the boat fouled. The person fouled may say no problem but an advantage was gained over a boat that was not fouled. If the person does not withdraw see no problem with a 3rd party protesting. Under the rules the person should withdraw but if not should be held to account(even if by a 3rd party).

You do potentially get into a situation where if a boat in position #1 or #2 creates a foul and isn't held accountable to it by the other boat, that boat #3 may have a worse result because if the offending boat had performed it's penalty turn, boat #3 would have had a better finish.

So, yes, you also need to be considerate to this.

You're in front, you see a foul behind no action is taken you protest... d!ck move.

It's moot anyway looks like it got pulled from the rules in 2001.

Hey, I was pleased to see that I was not alone in standing for the fundamental principals. (I could have said a lot of typing had I stumbled on this POV)

I am very curious how you guys see the "mild rules infractions" on the water... AND the F18 class noise about paint, and sail reinforcement panels, etc etc, AND finally how you think it relates to some guy soaking his snuffer sock before measurement...

To me... they are ALL THE SAME... There is no difference between these fouls.... all could involve some rule 69 allegations.

But, when the game is one of... OK... YOU call me on my foul... You better be an a hole or you will not be playing the actual game on the water..... I may be better off just going sailing.... who needs the aggravation on the weekend.

Is it?
Let's say you have to beat a boat by 2 boats to be in the medals. You have the boat pinned to the layline. The boat ducks you but fouls the boat behind you doing it. The boat behind does not call a foul because that boat is not effected.
Just because it happens behind you does not mean it does not have any effect on your regatta.

This is the problem with the "you owe me one". You really owe everyone one.

<****.

he he..

I am not arbitraging the rules here.. I will take any objective violation... then apply this minset

No harm no foul” is a more practical way to sail. Minor contact or a close incident is viewed as ‘no harm’

you mentioned this kind of behavior in the other thread... So.. the least of the situations is not one of bending the rules for advantage.. just doing... the no harm no foul thing. You simply don't call your own foul.

Where does this mindset lead you?.....
to me.... it leads to... "what the hell... Make the measurement guy on the scales call me on my soaking wet spinaker... If he misses it... I save a kilo. if not... i put my dry spin in the sock and then head off to sail measurement.... I have the day allocated for this crap...."

I think I am failing to persuade anyone that the old game was best.... Maybe I have to look at his alternatives...

Is it? Not if the butt that you are protesting is the same sorry SOB (d!ck) that T-boned you last year and cost you the regatta.



So who's the d!ck? Just sayin' . . .

I always call my own foul. I mean ALWAYS. It doesn't matter if I'm three miles away, I hit a mark, I do turns. That's how I sail. What I think you confuse is that there are situations where you can't always accurately determine if you made a foul. This does happen periodically and I rely on the other boat to indicate that I did.

Just because you do it out of revenge, anger or payback doesn't make it any less of a d!ck move... just sayin.

Interesting position you're taking here Mark. Were you not advocating giving those a pass on a cut and dry F18 measurement violation at the 2011 Worlds?

+1,000,000 Jake!

Like the discussion.

What I see as another point in the enforcement and application of the rules is...The concept that only sea lawyers and A-holes protest.

We have a pretty competitve week night series, lots of nat level sailors. Needless to say, we often end up in the same vicinity of each other in groups at the marks. Now we are all pushing and there are times that you may get caught out of position. If you have been racing long enough, you've been there. There is no shame in commiting a foul or calling someone on a foul. It's not personal, it's all part of the game. For the most part circles are done and if not we set up a mini protest hearing and we decide on it. It makes for a great learning tool for rules and hearing prep.

We can compete at other sports (I use Hockey as an example) You trip, slash, etc someone you take your penalty, it's over you move on. An infraction on the water should be the same way. To play at a higher level you have to put it out there sometimes, and you just don't always pull it off.

It doesn't make you an A-hole, it make you a competitor. JUST do your turns if you know it was wrong.

Are you saying “cheating” is getting worse because of the rules? I don’t agree. Are you saying it’s getting worse because the sailors today are less honorable than they were back in the day? I’m not buying that argument either.
Bottom line cheaters exist and there are mechanisms currently in place to deal with those situations and again it’s up to the sailors to exercise the option.

Are you suggesting that hockey players check themselves into a penalty box when they make an infraction?

Are you saying they shouldn't?

+1 to both Tom and Jake.
Rules are rules.

I've been playing hockey for 15+ years, in my opinion sports such as hockey are governed by the refs. If a ref decides to not enforce a rule, full advantage is taken of it without question. If one of my team members behaved the way you suggest, they would be finding a new team each season.

Should sailing be that way? I am nt suggesting that.

not that I follow hockey, but if someone pulled a Nancy Kerrigan on someone and the ref didn't see it, that's okay?

Do they allow this behavior in the youth hockey?


edit: so the reason referees exist in the first place is that the competitors can't trust each other to play fairly?

That's an interesting comparison...the same is true of most team sports where you have active refereeing. Sailing, for the most part, is a self-policing sport so I think that carries a different expectation.

I would bet, however, that the collegiate team racing follows a similar penalty behavior as hockey and other team sports...it probably has more to do with the individual competitor aspect. I can't think of another individual competitor sport that has the need for a similar degree of rules and limitations as sailing other than automotive racing and the under-way rules there are a bit more simple.

[GOM]We could also blame it all on video games. In my youth, you had three lives in a video game and once you screwed those away, you had to start over FROM THE BEGINNING. Kids today get to restart 5 feet from where they died and continue on - endlessly [/GOM]

I am NOT saying that.

What I am saying is that I can foul someone on the ice and for the most part can have a beer and laugh about it and move on.

When you protest someone, they seem to take it as a personal attack, then you become mortal enemies for the rest of your sailing life. Rather than just something that happens at every race at all levels of sailing.

I have been involved in protests at local, National and World levels. The higher you go up the more civil and professional the incident, protest, arbitration, hearing, decision procees is.

One of the difficult aspects is that many times, the perception of the situation, which both parties manipulate to defend themselves.

I have sat on MANY juries. It is usually pretty obvious who has a legitimate protest and who is trying to wiggle out of a penalty they know they committed.

YMMV!!!

Played, coached or officiated hockey since 1966. Damn I'm old!!!!

If your in the Northeast we have the Madslapper drop in HOCKEY the Friday before Madcatter Regatta

Tom

Do you guys ever use mediation....(or is that what you mean by mini protest committe)

Mediation is one guy who meets with the two skippers and goes through the incident... no witness's.. He then makes a non binding call. If the skippers don't resolve it then... you go to a full hearing with witnesses. (and you feel that you have to be perry mason.... legal eagles, law and order... pick your generations ace legal beagle to pretend)

Second question... Sounds like your miniprotest committe is open to the fleet to listen and learn....Does that work well for you guys?

How can we change the perception that Protest hearings (if we could get sailors to be responsible to call them all out) are NOT the chance for you to suffer a sea lawyer or require you to be one.

I don't think you're ever going to change the perception of a protest hearing. Anytime you put two people who both feel like they are correct in front of a judge/jury to decide one outcome, there will be at least one unhappy person. By nature, this is contentious. Different people approach it differently.

I like the "beach justice" that Tom mentions - the A-cats started doing something like this years ago (and caught flack for it on here). On the small scale, I don't see anything wrong with this kind of action. However, we do need to be careful to honor the system that is in place and, honestly, quite functional. Formal protests lead to learning material and advancement of the rules when they go through the formal system and are documented and/or elevated when the outcome is contested.

Mark, the beach hearing I spoke of are definately used as a learning platform. We often have great discussions as a result of this.

I have been at Big Boat regattas that have used mediation and I think that it is a great way to settle infractions.

We have used it at Madcatter.

Team racing is different from hockey in that we are umpires NOT referees. What I mean by that, is that as umpires we only make a call if there is a valid protest hail from a boat, then a request for an umpire decision. The process goes:

1. Protest is hailed
2. Protesting boat must give protested boat time to complete a one turn penalty
3. If protested boat decides not to spin, protesting boat requests an umpire decision
4. Umpire gives a decision, which can result in a two turn penalty.

The way the penalty system works in team racing, there is still an emphasis on self-policing. If you admit a foul and spin right away, it is only one turn, but if you wait for an umpire you face a two turn penalty. On the course that extra turn is a game changer.

Dave wrote



I have been thinking about this and I have decided that I lost the argument... I have tried over the years to persuade sailors how to read and look at the rules and I nothing seems to be persuasive.

The old system of "Call your own foul on yourself and honor ROW " is now a system... of "let the other guy call foul on me and then deal with it...." (The ...I always do my circle and get out of jail). This is much closer to the other games we play in our culture.

So... in this new culture...
Make your cross and do a circle when the other guy calls foul...
ooching a laser is not a foul unless you are caught.... (do it better the next time and then you won't be caught)...
Soaking your spin sock is a push of the rule at measurement... and no problem if you get away with it... AND you just move to the back of the line if you do get caught.

So, Dave you asked about all of the F18 sail cloth/patch material rule fubar at their worlds a few years ago...
How do you get all of those technical violations with all of those equipment rules at a Worlds?

Well... "In a call the other guys foul world"... You push the rules, and wait for the foul call.... and when half the fleet is basically illegal... you know they will punt and then change the rules. Remember, that fubar only blew up when one faction had a business interest in nailing the other guy and his business interest.

All of the hypocrisy of... a rule is a rule opining at the time ... was too much....Because we are in the "wait for the call of foul" world...... Not a call your own world.

In the Old school world... the sailors would have DSQ'd themselves and asked to have a second fleet and then the owners would reek vengeance on the sail makers who screwed up and screwed them.



Sailboat racing is not about morality... It was just one of call your own foul and honor the ROW.... (a so called game agreed to by gentleman..) I don't think you ever legislate morality.... (the right thing to do ... is the right thing to do.)
Sadly, I accept the fact.... that this era is over.

In reading the posts above, I don't see how you've come to this conclusion. Jake, Tom, Ding and others are all saying that they respect the game and call their own fouls when they can. They also respect their fellow competitors and spin when asked during close calls.

I race the same way, and while I haven't raced with Jake or Ding, I've been racing with Tom, his fleet, and the Hobie class since 1996, and can definitely attest that this is the prevailing attitude and class culture.

I also spend a lot of time at Opti and other monohull regattas. You would be disgusted and appalled at what happens there (think 40+ boats of an 80-boat fleet arriving at a gate at the same time, bumper boats, marks being all but sunk, rarely a protest and never any circles). That, and the callous way some OAs feel about changing class rules for individual regattas makes me cringe, twitch and drool.

Other than some folks in the other thread missing the requirement to retire (rather than spin) if a significant advantage is obtained, all in all my experience is that we are much better at self-policing than most monohull classes.

Mike

Some of the best protest hearings I've sat(as a judge) were at High-School Regattas. The competitors were polite, straightforward, and appreciative. Even when the ruling went against them, they've thanked the PC, shaken hands, and accepted penalty without complaint. The sailors din't dispute the decision but often asked what they did wrong and how to avoid making the mistake again. It's great as long as we can keep the coaches away (we came close to throwing a coach off the premesis once).

The most combative and least mature competitors often come from PHRF (big boat) racing. I worked a very large regatta once that spawned two Rule 69 hearings.

In adult dinghy racing, there seems to be an aversion to protesting. I think people view a protest as an accusation of cheating (which it is not). It's simply enforcement. Also, there's a desire to avoid filing a protest on shore because it delays the party (particularly for cat sailors), especially if the regatta outcome is not affected.

Personally, I don't believe that the "good old days when people followed the rules" ever truly existed. Human nature has not changed - nostalga has simply clouded our memories. For the most part though, I think sailors at the club level generally show great personal integrity when it comes to following the rules.

If, however, competitors witness rule infractions and don't protest, then they don't deserve to complain. They are (how shall I put this politely)... not part of the solution.

Regarding class rule changes, see RRS 87. Sailing instructions may change a class rule only when the class rules permit the change, or with written permission of the class association.

Sincerely,
Eric

AS THEY UNDERSTAND THEIR RESPONSIBILITY AND ACKNOWLEDGE IT..
fixed it for you.. now it fits the world I see.

and that is the problem for the current rules. For example, The laser sailors and their ooching behavior either simply don't see the problem the way the rules are written or have low personal integrity... hmm that is a problem when so many violate the rules... the problem is similar to the sails issues at the F18 worlds..


what has shifted is the understanding of honor and responsibility to call your own. It shifted to... Wait for the foul call/protest.

Certainly, nothing was perfect back in the day... but the norm has shifted and the Judge's POV in the OP acknowledges the change and looks for solutions. I have been unwilling to accept his premise. sigh...

There is no argument that the ROW boat must exercise their responsibility to the fleet and hail protest.

The problem of no protest is bigger then the platform on which they get to stand and complain.... the problem gets to safety and enjoyment of the game by the fleet....

Do you think the rules were pushed less, the same, or more when the penalty was a DSQ/retirement?

Don't personally remember that world.... So, around the bar... the old guys will tell you... boats crashing into one another is expensive and just not acceptable...
This is YACHT racing after all... not Car racing.

DSQ would certainly create a different game.
Just like the shift to WL racing from the point to point or big triangle races I sailed as a kid.
The change in the rules mindset correlates with the change in the kinds of sailing we do.

The country club sports, sailing, golf, tennis share some history... I think golf is a call your own foul sport as well... I don't play... but do you call foul on your partner.. of are you just playing the course. Has that sport changed?

Check the Basic Principle of Sportsmanship and the Rules. It states:
"Competitors in the sport of sailing are governed by a body of rules that they are expected to follow AND ENFORCE" (emphasis mine).

How can you bemoan demise of the "fundamental principle" if you won't follow it yourself? If you don't enforce the rules, don't complain when they are broken. Don't expect Race Committee or Protest Committee to enforce the rules for you. Don't expect that changing the penalty for an unenforced rule will change anybody's behavior on the water.

And no, I don't accept the assertion that the "norm has shifted". Sailors broke the rules 50 years ago and they didn't DSQ themselves (the only penalty available at the time) without a protest hearing. I don't see how ooching and sail material affect safety, but if rule infractions are affecting your fleet's enjoyment of the game, then enforce the rules.

Eric, didn't mean to say it's all bad in mono-world, but at the average regatta, we're much better. College sailing is a notable difference as well.

You made my point with RRS 87. But, just because the rule is in the book doesn't mean they don't ignore it. I push back every time I'm asked to review as a judge or PRO, and point out that rule. I specifically mention that I'm sensitive to it because of my Hobie racing, militant enforcement of class rules, background.

One of the most common (and absolute stupidest) examples: removing the requirement to carry a whistle (one of maybe three safety rules) because the OA thinks this would require them to supply them for free to the sailors. With the number of certified judges and ROs available for these particular regattas and OAs, this one just blows my mind.

Mike

John Craig, the AC PRO spoke about the rethinking of the rules for the cup compettion at a talk i attended. The accuracy of the data collection on the AC45's changed the culture of the fleet with respect to their using the AC version of the RRS. All of the sailors started out with the mindset of ... Let the other guy call foul.... Push the line etc. ...Standard operating principals here.. So, they pushed the rules. (They were long past the standard of call your own foul.)

Craig reports that he was surprised at how quickly the AC guys adjusted when they figured out that the computer did not lie... They could not BS anyone and they recognized it... With no chance to game the system or their opposition they adjusted ... So... they reset and sailed by the rules. The on the water judges had less to do... They still make errors on the water but he said it is different. He noted that they had not anticipated this outcome on the game.



Of course people broke the rules, that is a silly argument.

We disagree about the shift.. and your POV is in the majority.

How sailors view the responsibility inherent in the rules has a huge effect on the game.... (see Craig) The pro's shifted to an exact standard of the rule. ... They don't call their own fouls on themselves with on the water judges but the reset was demanded by the accuracy of the on board data on each boat.

I try to get OA's not to write new rules (and sailing instructions are rules). When they insist, and a protest arises, I have declared SI's invalid.

It's a mistake to draw parallels between America's Cup rules and RRS fleet racing rules.

First of all, the America's Cup is run in an umpired format founded on match racing. If you read the RRS match racing rules, you'll see that one boat must protest (by flying a "Y" flag) in order for the Umpires to impose a penalty. The culture of self-penalization never existed in match racing.

Secondly, The America's Cup does not use the Racing Rules of Sailing. It uses a completely separate and independent rulebook. There are many differences between the two sets of rules. Differences in how protests are lodged is a small portion.

Thirdly, you're comparing a small group of professional sailors competing in a high-stakes event to a large populace of amateur sailors racing for fun. The professionals are supremely skilled and intimately familiar with the rules. Of course they're going to push the rules to the utmost. That's their job.

@bacho-This is what I was trying to say!!! Quoted from Isotope42.

In adult dinghy racing, there seems to be an aversion to protesting. I think people view a protest as an accusation of cheating (which it is not). It's simply enforcement. . For the most part though, I think sailors at the club level generally show great personal integrity when it comes to following the rules.

If, however, competitors witness rule infractions and don't protest, then they don't deserve to complain. They are (how shall I put this politely)... not part of the solution

Stop looking at the trees of this debate.

Of course the rules, skills, etc differ and that is not the point of the AC anecdote.... the fundamental rule has not changed

The point is that BEHAVIORS CHANGE...

Ideally everyone who is incurring a penalty does their turn. Unfortunately the sport involves people and sometimes they don’t or wont. It may be from being a dick or just ignorance of the rules, it does not matter.

At a high level like the AC or Olympics, these will be called for sure as there is something more at stake. Most of the lurkers here are attending local fleet stuff and the various ad hoc race. No money, sponsorship etc involved, just bragging rights over 4 people who should be your friends. At these races the protest committee is often more random than anything else. Taking a protest into a local event in my experience results in a big part in why more people do not do it. I have seen way too many protest results that were based on favoritism and such to make it a crap shoot to even bother. For me a local event always was as much and maybe more about the social aspect than the racing. I am not likely to take hours of my social time to run something in front of a protest committee (unless there is damage or injury)
I will typically approach the other racers about it on the beach, and I definitely realize the fact that I cannot bitch about it if I do not file a protest. For the most part, you all know the others at an event. You also know who pulls the stunts to their advantage. Take the extra effort to avoid them and the race experience will be more positive.

If behaviors changed in AC racing, it is because enforcement became automatic, not because of any change to sailors' ethics.

I don't understand where this idea that only the boat breaking a rule is responsible for enforcing the rules. That has never been the case under any version of the Racing Rules of Sailing. All boats are expected to follow the rules. All boats are expected to enforce them.

If sailors are not willing to enforce the rules themselves (as expected under the Basic Principle of Sportsmanship and the Rules), then I have little sympathy when they complain that others don't.

I beleive that the solution to the problem that Peter Wilson wrote about lies not in pining for the good old days, nor in a different penalty system, but in changing the attitude that enforcement is somebody else's responsibility. If you want to discuss why people don't protest, and what might be done to encourage them, then I'm happy to participate. Otherwise, I'm tired of repeating myself.

Sincerely,
Eric