Pole position

Is there an optimum position to place a spin pole relative to the height of the deck or other way to measure?

Hi Eric

thanks -

Noted the use of the Fox size spin which is 270 , luff length is the important aspect in determining the coresponding pole length and distance of hoist measurement available , 4 main things you can adjust -pole length -mast tang or spin lead location ,-mast rake {increasing luff distance }-or pole height.

On the earlier W-1000 N-6/0s with huge 450 spins trying to max them out , a 14 ft pole was used ,--an extreme mast rake was used ,-lead location set as high as structurally possible ,--and {to finally get to your question} we pre-bent the spin poles down as low as possible ,without having them stick into waves or larger seas,-{thugh mine sometimes did} -
The I-20 is set extremely high ,-this due to large end pole type snuffer that if submerged into surf or waves could lead to a capsize ,-when we use bare poles most bend them down abit ,--though {class rules} do not allow too much ,--which seems counter productive speed wise .

Hope that is helpfull -

I guess I should just attach it up against the forestay bridle wires. That is the limiting factor. I will start with the pole at 14' and shorten it if needed. Spin tang is already set at 28' from the bottom of the mast.

Do you know if I should drill into the tips of the bows in order to attach the spin bridle? or should I share the forestay bridle two feet back?

Hi Eric

Say ,what sq ft is the typical sq top H 20 main ,
and mast height also?

One really nice retrofit for the H-20 would be a C F replacement for the comptip ,weighing half evan though longer ,with a sq top main ,-great mid pole spin snuffer package with 270 or 300 spin ,-
more technical ,-reseat the crossbeams in an expoxy mix
{Wax paper}for release ,-but 4 or 6 degrees of cant added ,
simple to do though bolt reallign tougher .
Then add a little fairing stern extention -foam core epoxy to lengthen it to a full 20 .
If refinish of hulls is required ,take it in and have all excess fg ground out and hulls lightened by 25 lbs or so then repainted with colorfull {F-20 } graphics and team boat name ,--whew .
sorry ,got carried away !

Think you,ll end up with a very high spin pole , suggest dropping a lead wire down with holder from the bridals .
Would add a spin pole bridal wire and strut support and then use 2 sets of pole wires --one intermediate and one to the ends to transfer some loads from the jib bridle wire location attachment .
Some N 6/0s drilled a hole thru both sides of the hulls near the bow tips for spin pole wires or non stretch line but they have the forward foil the spin pole attaches to transfer some of the spin loads , which are significant at times .
Not sure about the bow drilling ,-best to check with other H-20 spin catsailors if that is your preference,

Interesting response....Hmmmm....

Mast = 32' The fat head is custom made by Smyth (I don't know the sq ft) came with the boat when I bought it from Dave Ingram.

I am intrigued by the thought of increasing waterline in the fashion you suggest, this is entirely do able. I would have to change the name of the boat from "Breakin' Wind III" to "Ill Eagle". but F-20 is more interesting to me, especially after I got my butt handed to me by a Dart and a ARC 17 based on PN#. I would rather cross the line last and get the DFL trophy that comes with it, drink my Busch Lite and do it again.

Arbo,

I would not rest the H20 pole against the bridle wires. It really needs to be down about 1-1 1/2 feet to keep the pole low. I try to rig mine so that the pole has a good amount of bend in it. The tip is about 1 foot above the plane of the top of the hulls.

I rig the pole to the bridle attachment point because I couldn't bring myself to punch holes in my bows. However it is perfectly exceptable to drill a small hole at the bow if you prefer.

I run lines from the tip of the pole to the bridle attachment point. I also run a line from the bridle up around the pole and back to the bridle to keep it lower than the bridle.

Mike Hill
H20 #907

Thanx Mike, what is the length of your pole?

That didn't come out right, did it?

My pole is 15 feet. I bet it's longer than your's

you got me there. mine is only 14'. Butt, who ever complained about the lack of a few inches......

Eric,
We have 2 H20s w/ Inter 20 spinakers at the club ... Soon to be 2 more. What we found is that the tip of the pole (only 13 1/2 feet long with snuffers) sits about 16 - 20 inches above the horizontal plane of the decks with probably 2-3 inches of prebend only. "Tip of the pole" = attachment point of the spi tack on the snuffer ring, afterall this is what is important.
The bail(sp?) is roughly 37 inches from the top of the mast(standard H20 31' mast). The trick is to hoist the spinaker up to its desired height(all the way :-) for an I20 chute) and adjust the pole height such that you can grab the luff with your fist and give it a half a twist.
Hmmm, not sure if this is clear enough ... I'll look for pictures I can send/post.

Do you need a snuffer ?

Another thing DON'T put holes in the bow, attach to the bridle chainplates.

To Mike... Mike, you have years experience on H20s over me but I think a 15 foot pole is enough to throw the ballance off on any 19' beach cat. My concerns are more with the strength of the Comptip. Have you sailed in 20+ knts with the chute up on your H20 ?

Marc

Thamx MArc,

I have the bail in the right place. I then took the distance from the bottom of the mast and divided by 2 to get the pole length.

I understand the rest of your post but please post a few pics if you can. Thanx.

Eric

You are right the balance is way off. But it is still fast. I have never been out in anything over 12 knots with the chute up on the H20. I don't want to break my boat. I think it would probably hold if the waves were not too bad. Get into some bad chop and you would probably be sorry. I also use running backstays with my chute. The backstays are a pain but they give me more confidence. I wouldn't rig one again without using a snuffer.

Mike Hill
H20 #907

Hi Eric.
Looked everywhere for any of the Snuffer/Spi setup pictures I have but couldn't find any on my troubled computer.
I also made an error on the spi bail height. We have them set at 31 inches down from the top of the mast ... Not 37. I noticed in your pictures that you are roughly 36 inches from the bottom of the comp tip ??.
As our boats are under two feet of snow I cannot verify this but it would seem to me that your bail/block is probably about 18-20 inches lower on the mast. This would certainly not suit an I20 spi as we are already pushing the lower limit with our setup.
I understand you may have picked up an older style H-20 spi. My suggestion would be to return it to Hobie in exchange for the more modern Tiger chute if that is an option. You may not lose nor gain any speed but will have an easier chute to handle... And snuff!

Sheeting angles would also be more to your likings.

Marc

Thanx Marc, I never thought about trying an exchange. Good idea!