shroud tension

I've been restoring an 83' 16 for the last two months and finally stepped the mast only to find that the shrouds and forestay were incredibly loose even when attached to lowest holes in each adjuster(mast swings two feet in every direction). I've been contemplating rigging the shrouds to the upper hole in the mast tang and to take up slack and seeing what will happen. Has anyone done this? Is it safe? Or, should I just buy new shrouds since these are probably more than a few years old and hope new ones fit better? BTW, the forestay is new. Appreciate advice.

Will,

The forestay only holds the mast up until you raise the jib. The shrouds will not be tight until you tighten the jib halyard. The jib luff wire then becomes the forestay and the forestay is no longer in use. There is a small block on the jib halyard that allows you to loop around the cheek block under the jib cleat on the mast. That gives you a mechanical advantage to tighten the halyard. I believe most people keep the shrouds at the lowest hole in the adjusters to provide a lot of mast rake. If the shrouds are worn or have broken wires they should be replaced.

Howard

If you have a new forestay and old shrouds, that'd explain your dillema. Several years ago the standard lengths were changed; forestays became a bit longer and the shrouds became a bit shorter. If you want your setup to work okay you'll either have to custom order another old-length (shorter) forestay or get new shrouds to match the new forestay.
I'd probably go with the latter choice as it's a good idea to replace the shrouds & forestay every few years anyway.

I think Howard gave you the correct answer. When you tighten up the jib, everything will look great. The original forestay will then have slack in it when you sail, and that's the way it's designed to be. Some people replace their shrouds every few years, but my guess is that the majority of H16s are using their originals. Mine were 27 years old when I sold the boat. If the boat has been in salt water much, it might then be prudent to inspect them closely at the ends for any corrosion.

P.S. My nephew is getting married in Hickory this August. We'll be driving down for a couple days.

Jack

I don't disagree that things will shape up nicely when he tightens the jib halyard; but the way he's describing the looseness of the mast right now, it sounds almost dangerous. If he wants it to act *normal* then he'll need matching shrouds for the new forestay.

I agree with Jim's theory... From first hand experience I know that the new generation of shrouds is shorter (2 ") to create more mast rake. I do not now about the longer forestays - but it only would make sence to make tose longer at the same time. I think you have a bad combo of long forstay and long shrouds... I would recommend to get some new shrouds... they are not expensive and you should be in good shape. Patrick

Jim,

Why do you think it is dangerous for the shrouds to be loose with the forestay up? Once the jib is up you could remove the forestay with no effect. Many people worry about the loose forestay wearing on the sail and I have seen a way of keeping it tight with a bungee. I can understand the idea of proper lengths and if in fact they are mismatched it wouldn't be bad to change them.

Howard

Thanks guys, I thought I had read somewhere that the lengths had been changed throughout the years and I initially believed this to be the case by using a new forestay with existing shrouds, however, the old and newly purchased forestay are the same lengths(measured 'em).

So, the shrouds did tighten once I tightened the jib halyard and let the forestay go loose. But with the shrouds already in the lowest hole on the adjusters I cannot tighten them any further and thus the boat seems to be stuck in a loose rig. I haven't done this since I was ten or eleven with my father's 16. I sailed an 18 that was raise and go for a few years and i'm learning all over again by trial-and-error.

I just stepped the mast solo to follow the advice and now having thought about it i'm thinking that if I set the shrouds in the first hole in the adjuster before raising the mast and then tighten the jib halyard once raised, I will gain the ability to then retighten the shrouds by pulling on trap wires. I will eventually try this but thought i'd reply to make sure i'm right.

p.s. Jack you're more than welcome to skip the wedding and go sail on Lake Hickory.

Well, I understand that a bit of wiggle is fine if you're just stepping the mast and then setting up the boat for sailing immediately thereafter. My concern is more with the idea of leaving the mast up for long periods of time with the thing flopping around 2' in any direction. I'd recommend against that.

Will,

I sent you an e-mail about this problem and gave it some more thought. The one thing we haven't talked about is the bridle. If you have the wrong length bridle wires it would explain why the rig is loose even though the shrouds are OK and you can't get a lot of tension with the jib halyard. I measured my bridle wires and they are 44 1/2" long overall- that is end of thimble to end of thimble. I don't know what lengths are available but a friend got me a wire in garage sale that had Hobie parts and it was longer than those on my H-16.

Howard