Pouring money into old boats

Have two 16's fixing up for the youngsters to race. Most of the hard part is done and getting close to finishing them off. The sheeting systems are next (hence all the money) and my question is on the jib system.

I had decided to go for the jib sheet cleat on the car (ouch!) on both boats. Each boat had the sheet swivel cleat mod (inboard of the track) and figured it was easy to use these as the traveler car cleats. One comment at the Mid-Americas was "You won't like that setup". I've used the lance cleats and don't like that setup, although it's adequate. I saw one boat with a smaller jaw cleat at each corner casting and that seems viable. I never thought to ask the gentlemen why we wouldn't like the swivel cleats (I respect his opinion).

What are the pros and cons of various traveler control (for racing), knowing the lance cleats (to me anyway) are difficult to use. Don't know, position and angle may have been wrong. Comments?

Take a look at the fifth post.

http://www.catsailor.com/forums/showflat...;o=&fpart=1

Lance cleats on the castings will put a lot more stuff acros the tramp to tangle up the crew. They worked very well for me on two boats.

I try to setup the old beach boat as much like a new stock boat as you can. The lance cleats are a pain and hard for newbies and kids to use. The small Ronstan jaw cleats can be put in the same area as the lance cleats and work great. Get the eyelet that mounts with them to keep the traveler line in place.
I took another look at Mikes setup and just noticed that you have the starboard control cleat on the port side. It does clean up the deck and is a good idea. I wonder if this would be confusing to a newbie.
John: Hopefully some of those kids you work with will make it to a Youth championship or something similiar with supplied Hobie 16's. So I would try to copy the new boats as much as the wallet will allow.

I used the lance cleats for over twenty years with numerous crews including kids and had zero problems.

Use colored lines for the easily confused.

I upgraded to Mike's jib sheet system with the trentec car and lance cleat. I have had little problems with the system. Personally, it took a few trips to get used to the lance cleats, but once you get used to cleating to the side versus downward for the cam cleat, his system works like a charm.
Thanks for the diagram Mike! <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

No problem! Glad I could help.

Well, call me stubborn, also on my list of "don't likes" is the trentec traveller car.

Mike,

Thanks for reminding us of your previous post. Definitely an excellent location for the line and cleats.

Pat,

I think we'll use the small jaw cleats in Mike's location and remove the old swivel cleats.

I can see now that my friend may have been suggesting that the swivel cleats may protude too far aft and could possibly interfere with jib sheet control, especially when using on the wire.

ps These "youth" are 20, 21 & 23, I liked Ed Muns' definition of the Hobie youth as "40 and under"!!! ps

What is a "lance cleat"?

This is from the 2006 hobie catalogue.

That's exactly what I'm talking about with position and angle of the lance cleats. Mounting them as shown in the catalogue illustration makes them a bugger to use. Look where the line has to be to get it cleated. The lance cleats are "OK", definitely mount them as Mike illustrates.

Thanks, Vinny. I had never heard the term "lance cleat" before.

They're great little cleats that work very well with small lines. You can get them in red or green which makes them ideal for port/starboard applications.

You can put one of these in place of the lance cleat on what ever setup you use.
I think you will notice a big differance and not go back.
If you want to adjust the jib traveler while trapping the cam cleats are much easier.
I believe all new boats come with the cam cleats and they are available in the Cat Sailor store.

Hmmmmm. Looks like overkill. I'd get rid of the wire fairlead and put a fairlead on top of the cleat.