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West Vic Mossie Clubs?

Posted By: Anonymous

West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 07/28/14 10:19 AM

Hi all Western Victorian Mosquito Sailors,

What clubs are you guys sailing at?
Posted By: Got Wood

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 07/28/14 11:25 AM

The most I'm aware of is at Derrinallum, currently 5-6 boats.

Ross at Stawell, a couple of boats around Warrnambool although not overly active. A few more spread around in surrounding towns but again, not very active.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 07/29/14 09:40 AM

So what is the name of the club at Derrinalum and where do they sail?
Posted By: Matthew Dawson

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 07/29/14 09:55 AM

Google is our friend. smile

Derrinallum Yacht and Power Boat Club

Deep Lake
http://derrinallum.vic.au/deep-lake
Posted By: Got Wood

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 07/29/14 10:09 AM

Thanks Matthew, Yes, thats the situation.

Although we are in the unfortunate position of requiring above average rainfalls for our lake to be topped up every couple of years at least and this hasn't happened since 2010. We have enough water at the present time, but another hot summer and we may struggle, so we are hoping for a bit more rain by the end of spring. That being said, we have a couple of alternatives should it become necessary.

We are currently the strongest (in numbers) cat club in the region with as I've said 5-6 Mosquitos and 3 Taipans, for the size of our lake this is a great sight to see.

The active Mosquitos are of around the 1100 sail numbers with one in the 1600's and the one I've recently picked is one of probably 3 or 4 others around the town that are mid to late seventies build. So all would be in +65 category.

So, in this tiny little rural town I would guess and I'm sure there are some I haven't discovered there would have to 8-10 Mosquitos, as they were the weapon of choice in the Western District in the 80's and 90's.
Posted By: Matthew Dawson

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 07/29/14 10:24 AM

Are you sailing the mosquito instead of the taipan now Matt? What prompted the change? (sorry if you have discussed this already elsewhere ...)

I am always interested in hearing about people's experiences sailing different boats.
Posted By: Got Wood

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 07/29/14 10:42 AM

Not sure I could give up the Taipan, I spent two years part time building it, it has served me well and I enjoy sailing it, I will no doubt do a few club races with the Mosquito, as I wait for a new design rear beam to be released or replace my existing traveller car, with another from Goodalls which may involve buying a new rear anyway, so I may as well wait for the new release, I'm told possibly 6 months away. I sailed a Mosquito prior, I still have it also, and my brother has one as well at my parents farm, stored away and waiting for renovation.

I bought the Mosquito 'Sticky Finger' as it has history with a very good family friends of mine, I knew it would probably go to waste after it was evited from its shed, I will more than likely sell the Mosquito eventually, hopefully to a local. I need to first make a couple of minor repairs and repaint the decks at least and buy and fitout a new mast.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 07/29/14 10:50 AM

Matt,

the best way to speed up the new back beams is to order 10 Goodall Design 430s, that way they'll use up their existing stock and have to hit the go button on the new beam.

Remember too that even if we get a vote through to allow the new Goodall back beam it wont take effect until the end of next season.
Posted By: Got Wood

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 07/29/14 10:53 AM

I am under the impression the new rear beam will measure for a Taipan.
Posted By: Matthew Dawson

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 07/29/14 10:58 AM

Thanks Matt

Must be frustrating having the a Taipan out of action. It's a challenge when parts are hard to come by.

Matthew
Posted By: Got Wood

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 07/29/14 11:05 AM

Not really hard to come by, but the traveller car I need is no longer made, however Goodalls still have some in stock. Unfortunately due to the amount of cars and beam being similiar they are reluctent to sell one without the other, so do I buy a new car (and beam) and then next time have to replace the whole lot again anyway, or wait for a new design that will suit cars that will be off the shelf? Not sure which way to go.

Anyway, having the Mosquito I will still get on the water either way and thats what its all about..
Posted By: Pirate

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 07/29/14 01:29 PM

I sail at Derri(Sundays)and occasionally at Warrnambool (Saturdays).

There's a Mosquito in the WYC's yard that hasn't been moved for ~2years now and is owned by a guy with the surname of Dawson, don't know much more about him but the boat appears to be in sailable condition although would be rapidly approaching a re-decking from being out in the weather all the time.

There's also one in an open paddock just outside the township of Lake Bolac (its at the first house you comne to as you enter the town on the Mortlake-Ararat Rd).... its condition is not healthy and is fast approaching the point of no-return.

There's a couple of others that are hidden away in farm sheds and one that rotted away under the pine trees not far from me, about all thats left is the trailer axle /springs / part of the drawbar / and a mangled mast from cattle stomping all over it.

The owner died a long time ago and the son just left everything his dad owned lay where his dad had put it.



Couple of things puzzle me.....

why the interest Gary ???
you moving to a better part of the state !!! grin

&

why doesn't the Derri club and the mozzie numbers get a mention here ??

http://www.theracingcat.com/index.php?page=clubs-with-mosquitoes


confused
Posted By: Pirate

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 07/29/14 01:45 PM

Originally Posted by Got Wood
... having the Mosquito I will still get on the water either way and thats what its all about..


Quick count......

Mine (Shy or Karp when its done)
Yours (Sticky fingers or the other one)
Al's (Scorpion)
Mark's (imperfectus)
Phill's (DengueFever)




I think Mr. Lane is a member too and he has one (although still in the pull it apart and put it back together for the umpteenth time mode) crazy


Posted By: Al_scorpion1101

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 07/29/14 08:10 PM

There is another two in town that are members
But just don't hit the water, all be it lack of time
Or lack of motivation.
Tickle your fancy and Eccles I think it's called.
Got wood could confirm that I think?
Al scorpion
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 07/29/14 09:46 PM

Originally Posted by Got Wood
I am under the impression the new rear beam will measure for a Taipan.


New beam is wider, basically a semicircle added to the front and back of the current beam. So assuming we can get people to accept the new beam (you know hard it is to get the Taipan class to accept rule changes), you'll need to modify the beam landing to fit it. Personally I'd get a beam and car from Goodall while they have them.

Old Rule:
11d. Rear Beam

i. The rear beam shall be made of extruded aluminium of square or rectangular section.

Minimum wall section:
Sides 2mm.
Top and bottom surface 3mm.

Maximum Minimum
Height 60mm - 50mm
Width 55mm - 45mm

ii. Total height of beam and the traveller track not to exceed 80mm.
Corners may be radiused to a maximum of 6mm. The track for the traveller car may be extruded on to this section. A track for the trampoline deck may be recessed into the lower surface.

Proposed New rule (based upon info from Brett G)
11d. Rear Beam

i. The rear beam shall be made of extruded aluminium.

Minimum wall section:
2mm.

Maximum Minimum
Height 60mm - 50mm
Width 70mm - 45mm

ii. Total height of beam and the traveller track not to exceed 80mm.
The track for the traveller car may be extruded on to this section. A track for the trampoline deck may be recessed into the lower surface.
Posted By: Got Wood

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 07/30/14 12:39 AM

Re: Beam, gotten off track there a bit, my fault..

Mosquitos, Al's got it right, they were two I thought of, Steve McA got one as well, built and sailed by Dr.Ivor Scott of Warrnambool, who bought me into this world....., although I'm not sure it salvagable now. It was one of the original kit boats, same as Sticky, Eccles, and the one I have at home.

I know where there is still an original kit, with a brand new, as new, pristine, dacron trampoline made at the time (early to mid 70's) although its not at Derrinallum.

These kits were very popular around here, Warrnambool, Portland and Hamilton, there would be heaps around these areas.
Posted By: Got Wood

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 07/30/14 12:46 AM

Keep in mind, this is all from memory sitting here....

Sticky Finger (formerly El Gato 3), Portland
Blood, Sweat and Tears, Portland
(I thought of another, and lost it.... Portland
The Stinger, Stawell
Mr.Bitchy, Stawell
Froggy, Stawell
Alien, Stawell
The Sting??, Stawell
Eccles, Derrinallum
The Cats Whiskers, Derrinallum
Gary Lane, (A few boats) Warrnambool
Ian Lane, Kerri Anne?? I think, Warrnambool/Colac

Break over...I'll have to come back to it.....
Posted By: Matt_Stone

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 07/30/14 12:59 AM

To get back on track, Gary us doing thus so he can update the website and membership, and to join the mosquito cat class, to support the class and keep it going, so if you own a mossie and love it should join and support us

Matt
Vic mosquito President
The joker 1826
Posted By: Matthew Dawson

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 07/30/14 02:59 AM

The boat in Warrnambool belonging to 'Dawson' is not mine ... and no relation as far as I am aware.

smile

Make sure you join the association. If I start sailing a mosquito I will join. I have been a member of the State Cobra association since I had the boat and it has been worth it many times over. smile

Join if you haven't already.
Posted By: Pirate

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 07/30/14 09:22 AM

Originally Posted by Got Wood
Keep in mind, this is all from memory sitting here....

Sticky Finger (formerly El Gato 3), Portland
Blood, Sweat and Tears, Portland
(I thought of another, and lost it.... Portland
The Stinger, Stawell
Mr.Bitchy, Stawell
Froggy, Stawell
Alien, Stawell
The Sting??, Stawell
Eccles, Derrinallum
The Cats Whiskers, Derrinallum
Gary Lane, (A few boats) Warrnambool
Ian Lane, Kerri Anne?? I think, Warrnambool/Colac

Break over...I'll have to come back to it.....


The Sting??, Stawell .....
formerly from Camperdown Aquatic Club => sail number 245
wink
Posted By: Pirate

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 07/30/14 09:35 AM

Originally Posted by Matt_Stone
... Gary us doing thus so he can update the website and membership ...

grin grin grin grin


Originally Posted by Matt_Stone
... and to join the mosquito cat class, to support the class and keep it going, so if you own a mossie and love it should join and support us ...

blush
its on my list of must do that
just haven't gotten around to it as yet..... I even had the cash in my pocket at the states but completely forgot all about it...

Gary.....
I'd send you a PM but ...... thricebitten is over their Private Topic limit
cool
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 07/31/14 10:17 AM

Hi Kingy,

WOW I had no idea all that history was there, made me feel old going back to delete it all. cry

Plenty of space for PM's now, but if it's about VMCA you can allways contact me through the racingcat.com website, go to vmca.
Posted By: Greg/Debra

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 07/31/14 12:03 PM

Quote
its on my list of must do that
just haven't gotten around to it as yet..... I even had the cash in my pocket at the states but completely forgot all about it...


Bite the bullet man, it's only $25!

Do you think any of those other Western District Mossie sailors would come to the State Titles if there was a Division for old boats?

I'll put out a challenge to you Western Victorians... I will come to next year's Vic States if you come too. It's a lot further for me (Grafton NSW) than you.
Posted By: Pirate

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 08/01/14 08:34 AM


Originally Posted by thricebitten
..... Plenty of space for PM's now.....


PM sent wink

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Originally Posted by Greg/Debra
Bite the bullet man, it's only $25!

Do you think any of those other Western District Mossie sailors would come to the State Titles if there was a Division for old boats?

I'll put out a challenge to you Western Victorians... I will come to next year's Vic States if you come too. It's a lot further for me (Grafton NSW) than you.


Yeah yeah yeah..... I'm getting onto it ..... (still flat-out building Rome wink )


I went to the state's but sadly only as a spectator although I did at the time have every intention of sailing.
I hope to get around to a lot more events during the coming season so the states are on the list to do only as a COMPETITOR (probably not much of one but I don't quit that easily)
grin

As for the classic's class, I think there's a possibility we could attract older boats to the tittles with the right combination of incentives and "fair sailing" when it comes to the actual racing..... I've touched on that before where the older girls need a 'head-start' and the skinny boats can play catch-up cool

no-one wants to finish last even if their gear or ability places them there, you'll soon loose people if they aren't in a group as such so a fairer system needs to be 'designed' so we can all have company throughout the entire race and we can all finish within a leg of each other, not easy to do but not impossible either
smile


Back in my youth, the local club had a great handicapper and racing was always close in the points department, twice a year we had a stern chaser which 'tested' the handicap, there was even a set of scales for boat weight and crew weight and that was worked into the handicap system as part of the formula for racing.....
Our stern chasers were always damn close, I remember one in which every boat ( ~20 odd ) finished within a 2minute time frame of each other, the field was a cross section of a brand new A-class to a Hartley Traler sailor with 3 very big blokes and probably the same number of boxes of Melbourne Bitter long necks
sick

it can be done...... I just don't know how to do it !!!
confused
Posted By: Got Wood

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 08/01/14 10:01 AM

I dont really know the answer, but rather than...by the way..such and such was the first heavyweight boat, but possibly a complete seperate divison for +65kg boats, cat and sloop?

Only an idea, I'm not committing to either the Taipan or Mosquito States at this stage.

Where are the Mosquito States by the way?
Posted By: Al_scorpion1101

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 08/01/14 10:16 PM

for me the 65+ class sounds appealing, especially as a seperate series all together. (for my moz might need a bit more). The biggest issue i find with mine is getting speed off the wind, so if anyone has ideas on how to fix that im up for it. compete pretty well with most upwind,
Posted By: Got Wood

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 08/06/14 10:17 AM

So, has the committee got any ideas on this? If you want the heavyweight Mosquitos to pay a membership and attend State Titles then maybe needs a closer a look at..

These boats are just going to stay at their clubs, not travel, and not join the association unless something is bought to the table in my opinion.

What needs to be remembered is at the time these boats were built as close to minimum as they could at the time, given the materials available at the time. The minimum weight in the meantime has dropped, which is understandable, but in terms of being competitive these boats are hamstrung.

I realise its not all about winning, its social, its racing, its a holiday or time away for some, its a learning tool for those new to class. But, I honestly believe if your going to make the effort, then it would nice to know the opportunity would be there to be competitive within reason.

I realise a seperate division or divisions would of course be dependent on numbers, but the idea is there..

None of the above is a critism, or rant, its just an idea and its one that I think is worth looking into, or maybe theres a better idea out there somewhere?
Posted By: Matt_Stone

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 08/06/14 10:52 AM

There is a thread somewhere about this topic. We did have a 65+ section but over the years the number of the old boats have dropped off, or sold for upgrade to new boats. And it came down to only one boat then none, so we got rid of it all together. If we have 6 or more boats interested, then the committee might do something about it, if enough interest!
Posted By: Got Wood

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 08/06/14 10:59 AM

Thanks Matt, thats a good start I believe anyway.

The point of difference before, was the 65+ division wasn't really a division, an award of some description was given to the first heavyweight boat in the series. I think...stand to be corrected on that one, but thats how I remember it.
Posted By: Pirate

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 08/06/14 09:30 PM

Originally Posted by Matt_Stone
.... then the committee might do something about it, if enough interest!


if you build it they will come



Clearly there are plenty of old girls out there, and for the most part some of them are still being actively sailed at club level with a few of us that are game enough to venture off to local regattas.
8 or 9 mozzies showed up at the Easter regatta held at Lake Bolac, the 'fastest mozzie' of the group spent most of the w/end parked on the beach while the heavyweights flogged it out.....

"Shy" has shown that even a over-weight fugly-duckling can bring home the trophies and I have to admit I've had a ball sailing her to her max and pushing her harder every time I've 'fixed' her up a bit better wink so much fun for a dollar outlay that cant be beaten.

With constant numbers of Mozzies going through eBay & Gum-Tree etc, its obvious to me atleast that people either cant afford the wiz-bang carbon setup or don't want to go there because of the ongoing costs or upgrades to stay competitive at the top level, yet these old girls give a VERY affordable bang for buck sailing FUN and a lot of people know this and that's why we see them being sold whilst other classes struggle to sell.

A series for boats in a weighted division ...... where does this proud sailor of a classic mosquito sign

smirk



Posted By: Matthew Dawson

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 08/07/14 12:55 AM

Originally Posted by PIRATE
Originally Posted by Matt_Stone
.... then the committee might do something about it, if enough interest!


if you build it they will come



Yep
smile
Posted By: Got Wood

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 08/07/14 03:39 AM

Its not up to the committee to build it for them to come.

If you want it to happen its up to the owners of these boats to try and make it work.

Finding all these boats and contacting the owners will be the challenge, I think finding 6 sloops would be achievable, I can think of a handful straight off the bat.

Posted By: Matthew Dawson

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 08/07/14 05:54 AM

My point was that you can get into a vicious cycle of sorts in these situations. The association/committee is waiting for entrants/membership and the boat owners are waiting to see what they get for said entry/membership ...

This is what we have associations for ... to take the first step and/or try again after trying before.

For what it's worth, I would suggest a +65 division (but don't call it that) that is part of the usual events. If boats are slightly under 65kg they can choose to add some weight and enter into that division. If not enough boats just sail a combined fleet. Would be fun to see if some of the 'best' +65kg boats could beat the 'under 65kg' boats around the course ... that would add some interest!

Perhaps +65kg boats could be eligible for both classes?

(If there were more '+65' boats around, perhaps us Cobras would be able to keep up!) wink




[... just in case people are wondering ... I am a member of the VIC Cobra Association and have sailed in every National and State Championships except one since I purchased my boat in 2008. I am a passionate advocate for class association membership and regatta participation.]
Posted By: Got Wood

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 08/07/14 08:23 AM

65+ is just a number, and it sounds better than heavyweight in my opinion. Most of the boats I'm refering to are probably more like 75-80kg in reality.

65+ is roughly half way between minimum class weight and the average weight of the heavier boats. Actually if it were 70+ I don't any of the era boats I'm referring to would be eliminated or forced in the lighter division. If I had to take a wild stab in the dark, I would say most boats pre sail number 1200-1300 would be a heavyweight.
Posted By: Got Wood

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 08/07/14 08:27 AM

Oh, and I paid a membership last night too.
Posted By: Greg/Debra

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 08/07/14 10:25 AM

Good on you for joining the Association.

I agree with you that 65kg is probably too low. I would be in favor of 70+ or maybe even higher.

Posted By: Matthew Dawson

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 08/07/14 10:57 AM

The reason why I suggest 65+ is not the best name is because it is not immediately obvious what it refers to. Age of boat (pre 1965)? Age of skipper? You are trying to attract new/inexperienced sailors and many of them may not actually know how much their boat actually weighs, or should weigh. They just like sailing ...
Posted By: Pirate

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 08/07/14 01:40 PM

Originally Posted by Matthew Dawson
... 65+ is not the best name ...


simple solution.....


Classic class

Most forms of motorsport actively encourage older cars into the fray, classes such as, vintage, veteran, classic, and post classic, motorcycle racing also actively supports these types of classes and have even more 'classes' for your bike to fit within the guidelines, they even go as far to have classes that strictly limit the value of the bikes, the Bucket Rcing class does NOT allow bikes to be bought OR sold for any more the $500 and the bike MUST be for sale 24/7 / 365 days a year...... but you can spend as much as you like on it....
So if your racing one of these bikes and I think its better than mine I simply buy it and race it, if you refuse to sell it then the bike is instantly illegible to EVER race again in the class !!! (at one meeting many years ago I owned 3 different bikes in one day)

remember......

it may only be a name but it should reflect the boats without being negative

wink



Posted By: Tim_Mozzie

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 08/11/14 10:56 AM

Just to clarify a few points.

There has always (for 15 years at least) been a box to tick on entry forms for states and national titles for boats over 65kg. There are separate prizes for the heavier boats and they can also win overall (and sometimes have done).

The heavyweight prizes were actively raced for but the numbers of boats over 65kg has continued to drop to the point where there is only one or less turning up. In that case no prize is awarded.

The minimum weight of the boats hasn't changed, only the method of weighing (and even that was 25 years ago). The heavy boats are heavy because they were built that way or have absorbed water, been repaired and got heavy over the years.

Posted By: Got Wood

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 08/11/14 11:07 AM

What was the method of weighing previuosly please Tim?
Posted By: Tim_Mozzie

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 08/12/14 05:29 AM

I wasn't there (it was a long time ago!), but I am told they used to weigh everything and this was changed to just weighing the bare platform. From what I've read this was just done to make it easier to do the weighing rather than reduce the overall weight, and they based the platform weight on the ones that were around at the time.
Posted By: Got Wood

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 08/12/14 08:29 AM

What would a modern Mosquito such as yours weigh all inclusive?

Also because I am a hoarder of boat plans, brochures and the like, I can confirm through an early brochure from the Victorian Mosquito Catamaran Association, which states the weight as being 60kg or (130lbs).
Posted By: Tim_Mozzie

Re: West Vic Mossie Clubs? - 08/18/14 05:02 AM

It's been a while (10 years or so) since we tried weighing them complete, but from memory I think they come in around 88kg to 95kg depending on whether they are cat or sloop rigged.

Someone else may have more definite numbers in mind.
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