Spin Clew or clueless?

From the general forum
"We put eye splices in the end, and use an 18" 1/8" spectra luggage tag to attach the the spin clew."

What is the luggage tag referenced above. Does the spectra bowline the eyes together and then bowline onto the clew? I picture more of a leader not a tag.


Assuming that both ends of the spin sheet end up at the clew of the spin how are these attached to the spin for a non-tangling but removable solution?

When I first got my boat, I used a short piece of hi-tech line tied in a LARKS HEAD at the clew. Each end of this hi-tech was tied with a SHEET BEND onto the spin sheets. This was a bit lumpy so I taped the knots to improve the profile.
I know there must be a better way.
Does each end of the spin sheet get a spectra tail? These tails are then fastened to the clew?


When I look at this pic, I can't see any knots/line changes. Is that because the knot is on the tramp? Is this knot the reason that the lazy sheet looks short?



Only two more months before the ice is out!

Now this one looks line mine but the knots don't seem to be as lumpy. How?

I think it really is a leader that Krantz is referring to. I use a piece of spectra- 1/8 or 7/64 with an eyesplice that is put through the middle of the spin sheets then I tie that piece of spectra onto the clew of the spin. The ends of the spin sheets are then tied together on the tramp. I might have a pic sitting around somwhere.
I would like to do it the way Krantz mentions and do eye splices in the ends of the sheets and then use a piece of spectra to the clew but other than apex and maybe that robline he likes there aren't a lot of single braid line that works for spin sheets that you can do that with. I like my set up now other than the knot on the tramp. The benefit of my setup - and krantz- is that there are no knots on the clew of the spin to deform it in light winds and get caught on the forestays during gybes

I apologize for the large size... but it has to be big to see it. You can see my spin sheets at the top of the hoop.

Ronstan Sister Clips

on the spin clew?

Ronstan Sister Clips
Spin clew with 1/8" line to Sister hooks to spin sheet.

I would be worried about the clips catching on the spin.

Here's a similar quick and easy way to do it: Get a 3' peice of spectra, dyneema, or your favorite light single braid. Splice a 3" loop in each end of it. Take your spin sheet, find the middle, pass one loop of the spectra line through the middle of the spin sheet. (I assume you are using a Robline or Mafioli type sheet, which has no cover, so you can easily pass the loop through it.) After you have passed the loop through the middle of the spin. sheet, pass the spin sheet ends through the loop, then run the pigtail back through the loop again, so it won't slip under load. You now have a spin sheet with a spectra tail in the middle, but wait, there's more!

Now, go to your boat, find the clew of your spinn, pass the other loop/end of the spectra tail through the clew, and then pass both spin sheet tails through that loop, so it is now tied to the clew. Run each spin sheet to each side and the spin blocks, and tie them together on the tramp.

So there you go, with only 3 feet of spectra, you can try the pig-tail method on your spin sheets without cutting the sheet, doing any fancy knots or splices, outside of the two 3" loops in the spectra, which is a very easy splice to do.
<img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

I was imagining that the knot on the tramp would require you to have longer sheets.

So, are the sister clips eye spliced in? Do you tape them to prevent disconnects during flogging? Are you using the medium size? Any failures due to shock loading?

Thanks Timbo

What you are describing seems to be what I am seeing on a lot of the F18 pics.

I have been using the ring on the back beam to tame the spin sheets ala Robi and Wouter. So I avoided having a knot on the tramp.

I wish I could avoid the knot on the tramp because I would like a ring at the back also.
As far as Timbo's description. Let me see if I can explain my superior method better <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
Spectra line about 3 feet, put eye splice in one. Take a fid and put it through the middle of the spin sheet. Put the spin sheet through the eye of the spectra. Put fid that is going through sheet THROUGH the spectra of the eye splice and run the free end of the spectra through both the sheet and the spectra itself. Pull tight. Tie the spectra to the clew of the spin. You can see this in the pic. Yes, ya gotta tie it to the spin clew but it is lightweight and easy.
In rereading Timbo's post- I think our methods are similar except for that Timbo takes the extra step of having the second loop and looping that on the clew. I like that too. I prefer, I guess, in the end to have the simplicity of just tying it to the clew. Hard to explain these things.

The top photo is me ... I have an overhand knot at one end of my spi sheet, I then run the other end thru the spi clew grommet... around all blocks ... then back thru the spi clew grommet finishing with another overhand knot. So knots are on either side of the spi clew.

I also use the overhand knot on both ends of the sheet at the clew after passing the line through the gromet.
I ran both sheets through a 1" plastic white ring before tying the knot at the clew.
It doesn't hang up as much and it is still very light.

I only put the second loop in the tail of the spectra so a knot wouldn't get hung up and/or untied while racing.

Now, as for running the spin sheet through the block at the rear beam, I used to do it that way, but I found myself constantly sitting on the sheet at some point, either while snuffing or raising or gybing, so to keep the sheet up at the front of the boat, I don't run it to the back of the boat anymore.

One other thing; At the Tradewind regatta, I was at the far back of the boat trimming the spin while Andi drove. At that time I had the block on a bungi at the rear beam to keep everything neet and tidy, as you guys have described. BUT, I found when I was sitting all the way at the back of the boat, I ran out of spinnaker sheet, as that block-bungi setup was pulling it sideways and taking up too much of the lazy side of the sheet. So in-between races, I untied the block from the bungi and it was much easier to trim without the block pulling on it.

Now mind you, this was with my spin sheets set up like Terry's above, tied at the clew, not on the tramp as I just described in the pig-tail set up. I don't know which setup I will stay with, but I like to try different things and see if they work. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

The spin sheet is one piece with a loop on each end. Take both loops up towards the clew then take a piece of 1/8 spectra with a loop in one end and run it through the larger loops and back through itself and tie end to clew.

Makes sense to me. No big knots to snag. Do you use a bowline to the clew with the spectra or some other knot? Just curious as that knot could be a bear to untie.

A pet peeve of mine is the chute not snuffing completely - even when fully "snufffed". I see the Layline F18 has the line from the clew to the snuffing line to help get the chute packed away nicely. I gotta do that sometime.....

BTW... the Layline F18 is beautiful. Take a close look if you ever get the chance. I had to check it out while on the beach, as I never got close enough on the water. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />

Agreed ... the graphics on the Layline make that boat REALLY FAST too. Gotta' get some like that!

A bowline works fine. The retrieval line goes through a ring tied to a line and then tied to the clew. This helps pull the spin sheets in the snuffer so they don't drag in the water. Alex Shaffer showed this to me.

Jake Kohl did the design and graphics. Jake is one talented dude. We have something new for the starboard side at Spring Fever <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Pics?

TwiceBitten has posted some pics here:

http://www.catsailor.com/forums/showflat...true#Post123634

It is the green/white line in the picture. The trick is getting the "leader" for the ring the right length, then just run your retrieval line through it before entering the spi snuffing loops.

You can see it in the picture above if you zoom in and look close. I don't think I have any of my own.

Ah, the irony. As I was composing the post I was wondering if I should ask "WWDLD?". Now I know.

This is now how I do it :

Reasons :

-1- Obviously because now the sheet won't hang up in the forestay due to the small line making it appear the line is continious

-2- The sheet knots are still on the clew of the spi and not on the trampoline allowing my bungee setup to tidy the spi sheet on the trampoline. I also hate those spi sheet knots on the trampoline !




How is it used :


The left sheet end stays on the spi, although you can very easily take it off by running it through the eye leaving the figure 8 knot in place on one end.

When fitting to the boat I run the free end through all the blocks and then push this end through the eye in the opposite direct as the "left" end and secure it with another figure 8 knot. Pull both knots tight to the eye and then grap a screwdrive (best a philips screwdriver) or a special sailing tool like shown and widen the earlier stitched opening in the line. Put the small line through it and secure it with a figure 8 knot again. See picture, btw I haven't cut the small line to correct length yet, I'm lazy, doesn't need to be that long.




How is it made.

Basically the small line is inserted into the left end of the spi sheet and stitched into place. Doesn't need to be very strong (no splicing required) as the small line never has to pull very hard. The other end of the small line is cut under an angle and burned off to a firm pointy tip so it runs easily through the whole in the other end.

The permanent hole in the other line is made by stitching. Basically I just grapped my special tool (but phillips screwdriver will also work) and made a hole in the sheet line. I left the tool in and pushed a needle and thread along the tool through the line, wrapping it back on the outside. Thus bundling the line fibres together on wo sides. Then I took the tool out and finished the stiching by making smaller loops and having the needle come out throught the sides. Just to make the bundling up more firm. This hole will want to close up any when tension is put on the sheet which is good as that holds the line. Basically you have the widen the hole again each time you rig the sheet with the phillips screwdriver of some other tool. That is the only drawback of this setup, UNLESS you leave the sheet permanently on your boat. Because you can also just untie both figure 8 knots in the sheet and take the spi off but letting the small line connecting the two sheet end.

Your choice, I personally take the sheet line off and just bring that sailing tool with me each time, it is also my shackle key, you seee!

Wouter