F16 Crash course

I will be stepping onto a cat rigged F16 (Blade) for the first time this weekend <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> and looking forward to experiencing one up spinnaker racing and hopefully pick up a bit from the other F16 guys at the event.

Anyway, keen to here about the techniques used by the solo F16 guys when it comes to setting and dropping the kite as well as gybing. What sequances do you follow and how do you each steer when setting / dropping i.e. Where do you hold the tiller extension. Also techniques used for a clean fast gybe of the spinnaker.

Let the crash course begin <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Keep the boat upright. Uni, under spin, that's more difficult than you might think. Especially first time out.

Steer straight down wind when setting or retrieving the spin. That isn't the most efficient way to do it, but in the beginning, it's probably the only way to keep the boat upright.

Be prepared to go deep. If you're sailing the spin "hot", there is little time to react to a puff, you must anticipate.

Be sure to have a righting line and understand the righting procedure thoroughly.

Most importantly, have fun! <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

For hoisting and dropping the kite, used to stay on my knees near the back of the tramp facing forward and steer with my feet on the crossbar. Would drop the traveller down too.

For gybing, have both sheets in the one hand. Hard to explain, but I would hold it so the old sheet was easy to flick out and then you can pull through on the new sheet as you gybe. By using this technique I could keep the old sheet tight going into the gybe and I wouldn't have to pull too much for the new sheet. As you crossed over the tramp through the gybe you could easy change over hands too.

Probably confused you now.

Thanks mate. That is what I am after



Very interesting. I was thinking about kneeling on the tramp facing sideways and sticking the tiller extension between my calf / hamstring. Will give your method a try as it will allow for stearing instead of just holding the tiller.



Both sheets in one hand was what I was thinking, but good advice about having the old sheet possitioned to easily flick out. Better to learn from those who have already gone through the newbie process, then to slowly pick up things through trial and error.

I don't steer at all when I hoist the spin solo. I drop the traveler all the way out coming around A mark, steer deep so the boat will go straight, then in a flurry of hands and elbows I get the spin up asap, 3-4 fast long pulls usually it's up, mark your halyard at the clete so you know when it's up, then I grab the tiller, steer up, pull up the traveler to about 1 foot out, grab the spin sheet, trim in and hold on, be ready to bear off quickly if it fills in a puff. I dump the mast rotator off and the downhaul off when I have time.

You MUST drive looking back over your shoulder for upcoming puffs when it's blowing and gusty, and you MUST start your bear off well before the puff hits you, so as it hits you can accelerate with the bows up, instead of trying to bear off in the puff and driving the bows under, which is slower, and swimming is slower yet.

Hopefully it will be light to medium air for your first solo ride, but if it's blowing, just dump the spin when things get crazy. You can pull the daggers up half way, that will help you bear off quicker without stuffing the bows under. If it's light to medium, you can sit well inboard to fly a hull, and just steer to keep it up.

For the take down, prepare for it well ahead of the C mark/gate, I just dump the sheet, then the halyard, ease the main and steer down a little more, maybe ease the traveler too, but haul in the snuff line ASAP, again, 3-4 big fast pulls, then set up for the rounding, boards down, downhaul on, rotator in, traveler up, main in, etc.

When it's blowing, I hook into my trap wire even if I have no intention of trapping, as if (when) you get thrown over the handlebars, you want to be attached to the boat. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />

First, you will do some swimming...

As you know, the F16 is light and so you need to balance more carefully than a bigger heavier boat.


To start with; don't bother wiring down wind, there is enough to worry about.

Putting the kite up:

1, Dump some mainsheet and round the mark and head off, cleat the mainsheet.
2, some people also drop the traveller right out.
3, Either drop the tiller (if the boat will track on its own - this is why some drop the traveller); or kneel on the tramp and then put the tiller on top of your legs and then gently sit on it so you can steer
4, pull like feck to get the kite up!
5, Once up (Mark the place, or when you cannot pull any more) grab the spi sheet and get it driving; at the same time get the traveller back up and grab the tiller
6, Once driving, hook on (if enough wind) and go out.

Dropping techique is described here


As with the F18(I assume), you are travelling faster than true wind so you can

A, sail off the front of a gust and this can then catch you up / out as the wind dies, you head up to get drive and BANG, gust arrives
B, You do not look directly upwind for gusts, you look slightly over your shoulder as you can sail into them (I’ve even sailed into the back of a gust and that is most weird, but I do sail on a lake and so it’s a bit odd at times)
C, You will not get both sails right every time; how much mainsheet to let out is a bit of a black art, too much eased and you don’t have enough drive, the slot can get choked and you also risk breaking the mast (but F16 masts appear to be VERY robust); too little and the main is stalled and the slot it too open; it is possible to change mainsheet settings while flying the kite, but this DOES take practice and co-ordination.


If you start doing “round the cans” racing, it’s another game as then you have to also deal with being overpowered when making a mark, but we’ll leave that for another day.




Gybing:


1, Come in from the wire (if on it) and gather up what will become the new sheet; hold this in the same hand as the current sheet.
2, let out a "bit" of the current sheet as you start the gybe; I marked mine just where the clew will go around the forestay when the sheet it tight.
3, continue on a smooth arc and move across the tramp.
4, You now have to drop the tiller for a second having passed it around the back of the mainsail; it should land on the tramp by the back beam. Do't even try and check the mainsail over....
5, Pick up tiller
6, now this is the bit I do differently, I KEEP the tiller in the same hand as it was (so now I am facing across the boat looking outwards, I then let go of the old sheet and pull the new one in
7, change sheet hands and turn around.
8, get the kite driving and heading in the right direction
9, back out on the wire if it's the right thing to do.



I would suggest running thru all this in your mind first (while sitting / moving around the boat on the trolley). It forces you to think everything thru and make the right moves at the right time.


When people ask me what it's like, I usually say "busy" and with any boat, it's about staying one jump ahead of the developing situations, but as you are on your own, more situations develop, and they develop more quickly.


As others have said, best to try it all in light wind first!



Good luck and report back !!!!!

I also put the boat dead downwind with an eased main to pull the kite. Once up I trim the main and don't touch untill I drop the kite again. I find retrieving more difficult (boats starts to head up) then hoisting.

While going downwind I don't bother pulling the daggerboards up (but haven't raced in more then force 4).

I was used to double handed sailing and was steering to low in the beginning. Without a jib you can point a couple of degrees higher.

As Simon said, your weight is very important. 1 step to the front can make the boat lift and accelerate. Certainly downwind when you automatically have speed I had to think about it. Upwind it is more obvious to me.

What other boats will be out there?

Gill

Pull in some retrieval line before dumping the halyard at the drop, don't want it falling in the water. Set and drop as close to downwind as possible. Leave the tiller extension on the tramp and set or drop quickly, if you're setup properly there shouldn't be enough time for the boat to get off-course.

I sailed solo last weekend and it was a blast, but very tiring. 10-15 knots and sitting in a little and was still wild-thinging at a slightly higher angle than a 16' skiff. Any lower was dead slow. Was flying past Hobie 16's and Taipan unis downwind. Just watch out when overtaking, you'll have to bear away a lot in gusts.

As with all sailing, thinking ahead is very important.

Just go out there and sail to have fun!
You have enough experience to souse it all out fairly well in the shortest period of time.
I think you have experienced most of everything before that you need on other cats the only difference now is that there is no crew to yell at if it all goes pear shape (also means that when you do well there is no one else to "steal" part of your credit)
Enjoy!

Personally, I throw the tiller over the back of the boat and let it drag there when singlehanding under spinnaker.

I steer by the tillers. When setting or douching I leave the mainsail where it is required to be for after the set/douce and I steer downwind and do the spi handling in the time that the boat needs to round up to the proper course. Basically, I do my stuff while the boat is rounding up on its own. That is a couple of seconds and when done right you are ready to go right after the set/douce.

When setting the flapping spi balances the boat and a filled spi introduced lee helm so it bears off again. I make use of this feature to stop the boat from rounding off to far. So in my case the whol trick is to point the boat downwind then use 3 or 4 seconds to get the spi up just in time to balance the boat before it rounds up to far. Doucing is almost the exact reverse. I come in hot , let go of the tiller to boat bears away while I put my knee on the spi sheet and pull in the excess of retrieval line and then let go of the sheet and spi cleat and pull the spi in the bag within 3 to 4 seconds while the boat rounds up on me. The boat circles around the bouy and right before I reach beam reach I move up maybe work the main while still steering by the tillers. When the boat is on the new upwind course I grap the tiller extension and go out pulling the main tight in with me. This seems to work well for me in getting out tight at the bottom mark, something alot of boats don't do.

The secret to dry 1-up F16 sailing is to have your procedures work-out very well and be very well trained in them. After a while you'll notice that 1-up spi sailing is not that difficult at all.

Personally I ignore the mainsail under spi and have it gybe on its own. I use the landyachting advice here : always keep lots of speed and the main will gybe as easy as a weathervane on it own. Concentrate fully on that spinnaker and having it gybe smoothly and fill quickly, thus keeping speed up.

Best of luck Stephen. And I wish you the best experience 1-upping a F16. When you do it right it is a hoot !


And I agree with the others, everything happens sooner and quicker in this setup. So try to bear away a little BEFORE the gust hits and head up again before the guts leaves as well. At first this is like riding the edge, but it is the only way to do and be quick. Think of it as training to get better at this on a larger more forgiving boat as well. Because that will be one of the effects of lots of solo training on a F16. You'll sharpen your senses and reflexes.

Best of Enjoyment !

Wouter

Should be a breeze..... 12 races up against Gary, Goodalls and about 18 F18s as well as a mixed fleet. Should be easily in excess of 100 boats.

Forecast so far.

Saturday Outlook: Wind: N/NW 20/30 knots, turning NE/SE 10/20 knots in the south.
Sunday Outlook: Wind: NW/NE 10/20 knots, reaching 20/30 knots in the north.

<img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

I'll be taking it very easy as it is not my boat. If it is too much, I'll wait for better breeze.

I'll be just familurising myself with the F16 this weekend.

Make sure you get photos!! <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />


Good luck with the event. Take care!

NO! NO! NO!

No Crash!
<img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

Hi Steve
Just sail it like you STOLE it,and remember it's not your boat.So if you brake just take it back it,and tell the owner.You where winning up until the accident.That will make it easier to swollow when you tell him the mast is in 2 bits.
They are very forgiving BUT when they bite They do bite HARD

I forgot to add everytime he does lend a boat the main some how gets damaged or the boat does swim,So you do have a reputation to live up too
NOW I'M really going to upset the owner

It must be Phill's boat! <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />

If the wind is up around 20-30, you will want to pull the boards up a bit going upwind to keep the hull from flying up too high, drop the traveler a little too, de-rotate the mast for less power, max downhaul, etc.

Going downwind in 20, pull the boards way up, and drive it deep. I have found when I try to go downwind on one hull in that much wind I usually stuff it to the mast and flip, so now I drive deep on two hulls and ease the spinny when the big gusts come. Try to keep your weight as far back as possible and keep the bows up.

I have found swimming to be slower than a flogging spin in a big gust. It's going to be fun in a gybe in that kind of wind! Just let the spin go and worry about it after you have got the main across. Staying upright is more important than a clean spin gybe. Good luck!

I found going dead downwind wind and 3-5ft waves, the spin popped out of the bag into the bow and went shrimping.
Beach debrief said, use a little heat so spin goes to side of boat.
I went shrimping on take down to, so I will head up slightly, so spin goes over side of bow.
I think wave action caused this, as I have never had a problem on flat water going dead downwind.

Sounds like you were going about the same speed as the wind when you popped the spin out, and it had nothing to fill with, causing the shrimping.

I suspect this happened in lighter air?

Yes, slightly off ddw (dead downwind) would prevent this to a large extent. But yanking that thing up as fast as possible would too.

...3-5ft waves, blowing 10-15.

How did Steve do on his NO-CRASH mission? <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

He has another 10 hours to go until its over!

Weather report
3 races yesterday 4/10(aust).Wind started at 10-15 knots,went to 15-18 knots then built up to 25 knot gusts
Steve did swim,and brought in by rescue boat,Don't know if there was any damage

Now Stephen knows which cat REAL men are sailing ! <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

F16 with spinnaker 1-up in a blow; there is nothing like it.


Don't let it beat you Stephen, get back on that horse as soon as you can and bend it to your control !

Wouter

What are you going on about???

T_A, are you still there? You are usually so quick to give feedback that I have to wonder how you are doing after the event. Hope you are OK and that the event was fun and not "fun" or even worse, "interesting".

T_A,

Hope you are OK, Will you get the chance to have another go?

It is worth putting the effort in; I sailed my Inter 17 for 6 years before getting the F16 that helped, but I still did a fair bit of swimming to start with.

I'm sure even Wouter swims now and again....

Forster is a great spot for sailing, but for Internet it is a bad spot. Plus it is a public holiday there today (ie NSW) so they would be caught in the massive traffic jam trying to get back to Sydney.

Folks,
Over the weekend I have spoken to both Gary and Steve.
I would suggest that James knows Steve better than some others on this forum hence his earlier response to Wouter.
When the dogs had blown off the chain I understand that Steve was still pulling the kite.
This is not my story to tell so I suggest a little patience would be in order. In a couple of days maybe Steve or Gary or hopefully both can spare the energy to tell the story.

BTW- I expect if Steve was towed in as claimed it was a precaution as the boat was a loaner. I understand that the damage to the boat was a broken cross arm.

I still think it bad Karma to ask for a "Crash Course" <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" />

Dear Wouter went swimming 6 times on the third day of the 2007 GC in only 2 races !

The only glory I can lay claim to that day is that I righted my boat singlehanded and unaided all times and finally sailed it back to safety without any help (or crew). Boy was I beat ! Muscles trembling ! And yep it was blowing dogs off chains then as well and I did pull the kite in all. Actually I never flipped in teh kite manouvres but always later on when tripping over a wave.

But going swimming is not the point. Just as with rodeo, the true character is to be found in finding the strength to get back on that horse and continue. Once the skills has been mastered you have got alot of fall-downs to further glorify the achievement !

Wouter

I've been sailing F16's since 02 (well Stealth R originally) and I still end up swimming more than most!! Guess I must be crap <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />

Maybe you should ask the horse's opinion. He might have good reason for wanting you off his back.

BTW- I expect if Steve was towed in as claimed it was a precaution as the boat was a loaner. I understand that the damage to the boat was a broken cross arm.

I still think it bad Karma to ask for a "Crash Course" <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" /> [/quote]

I thought my comments would stir up the owner,Besides i think we have been sailing to-gether long enough now to know that mean no harm to himself or his boat.
However i still stand by the claim that the boat can't go out without capsizing
<img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />
Now i really am LMAO

Bah! If I don't get into double figures nowadays when going for a sail I know I have had a good day.

LOL, relax Wouter, it was a joy to sail. I have been a bit quiet lately because my girlfriend’s parents have been in town (from NZ) and I guess it would have been bad manners to ignore them to keep you up to date.

Initially, I was wondering how you cope around the cans setting, gybing and dropping the kite solo but jumped in and realised it is actually a piece of cake. Setting and dropping I just tucked the tiller extension between my calves and hamies whist on my knees and rocked side to side to make any necessary directional changes. This was minimal as the boat tracked very straight. Gybes, well picking up the lazy sheet , dropping the ex loaded one after the gybe and sheeting the new one was very quick. I also found all the sheet and halyard loads very light after stepping of the F18s and Tornadoes. Hardly surprising with smaller sail area, less weight and less load on the boat.

Before the race in about 8 to 10 knots I set the kite heading out to the start and went through a few gybes then a drop. Rounded up and headed upwind until I met up with Garry steaming down under kite, turned around and ran alongside on a few gybes.

Race 1, I left my start watch on the beach so ran with the fleet on the line. First race I was over with several others and a General is called. 2nd start and I get a good start half way down the line trying to avoid some of the fun and games people were playing at the boat end. Garry got smashed on the start at the boat end and left in irons as the fleet took off. Those who started down the line sailed into a filthy header whilst a few late starters on the boat end (including Garry) found themself on a healthy lift all the way to the top mark on a single tack.

The breeze at this stage started to gust up to 15 knots and swung a long way to the right. The reach across the top mark to the clearance mark turned into a square run with the downwind leg being too tight to hold all the way under kite for the solo F16s. I swam twice at the clearance mark as I set on the run across to the clearance mark, attempting to gybe immediately, before gathering enough boat speed to execute the gybe safely and got knocked down exiting the gybe. I quickly learned to go into the gybes aggressively with max boat speed to avoid this..... Not much weight to hold the boat down on a solo F16, especially when you are still fairly central on the tramp. On my second swim, Garry joined me in the drink after finding the bottom whilst strung out on a downwind. I guess he will tell you more. Course completed but finished down the back of the fleet.

Second race came in fresh with some big bullets coming down the course. I tacked of fairly soon to the right to take advantage of the lifts along the shore line and extra pressure. I found myself at the top end of the fleet and did not think twice about setting the kite. It was time for a bit of redemption. Some of the F18s and Garry elected not to fly the kite in this race which was probably a very good move. On the 3rd and final downwind, a big bullet hit and I stuck both bows in. I folded the kite but found this to be a bad move as the main without kite rounded the boat up and over I went. With thoughts of going through Phill’s main sail in mind, I jumped behind the main but managed to break the tiller cross bar in the process.

I kicked up one rudder and righted the boat but could not steer it into the wind and over it went again. I elected to play it safe and drop the main sail, right the boat and get towed in. Unfortunately after 3 swims and climbing onto the hulls about 8 times, my back started to give me some trouble. I went into the regatta recovering (and starting to look good) from a back injury which I have been suffering from for the last 6 months. I decided not to risk it any further and spend some time up there with my girlfriend and her parents. The rest of the regatta forecast looked spectacular and tailor made for the F16s with what looked like about 10 to 15 knots on Saturday.

I am yet to see the regatta results, but I know the Goodall’s on the Viper were really giving it to the top of the F18 fleet. On the A class, Steve Brewin was leading a healthy fleet of about 20 boats with some big names on board with 3 wins on Saturday.

In the end, I managed to experience the F16 in a range of conditions from 8 to 25 knots and really enjoyed it. The boat was fast, responsive, had very well laid out systems and was very manageable solo. I could very easily see myself on an F16 in the future and the search for my new boat will begin after I move down to Melbourne.

Stephen,

8 climbs back on board ! You are my hero !

Did you do some trapezing under spi as well (Not something I do regulary myself though)

Brilliant report, thanks

Best of luck and enjoyment,

Wouter

Is there any other way to sail them <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Ha ha ha ! Good return !

I respect that !

Wouter

Hi all,

haven't you all been having fun while I have been driving and sailing (in almost equal quantities), all this stirring I have been missing out on, not fair. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Wouldn't want to go off topic, so I will post a brief report on the Wildcat thread I started before the event. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Mate, if you didn't do that, I would have to come back and kick your butt! <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Glad you enjoyed the rides!!..

Stop teasing and get your a$$ back over here and on the water...... Rather than in it as you seem to do a lot of now. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" /> Perhaps the water up there is so good too swim in, you had to buy that new toy to give yourself excusses.

A little war wound from the weekend. Guess if you are going to swim, you should really have something to show for it <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

NICE, better than any of mine.

I reckon I used to end up more bashed in a mono.

Another good reason not to sail one.

Centeboard or sidestay!! <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

I have got no idea <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Did not notice it until I got back to the motel.

Hey Kathleen, I think he's trying to beat your record on bruises! Does he sail with Gilo too?? <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />

Damn!
I know I can do better, but I won't show pics here.

Could be that he sailed with Gill. I sailed with another guy this weekend, on an Infusion (double cheating) so maybe Gill was in Australia in the mean time?

Holy S**** sailing a F16 single handed in 25knts with the kite up, that must have been pretty frantic in the gybes, hoists and drops no?

It's fun in a scary kind of way...

Haha, no the water aint too good to swim in, but it is warm.

Enjoying it in the sun and warmth and the palm trees.