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Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam

Posted By: TEH

Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/12/11 07:43 PM

This is a pretty (very) minor point, but it always takes me a while to tie my split tail mainsheet to the eyelets on the rear cross-bar and keep the traveler approximately centered. I typically use a bowline knot on each side. The first knot is easy but the second is a bit of a pain to tie without pulling the trav to one side.

I was wondering if anyone had experience with a clip or something that would be easy to pre-tie to the right length, then secure each side while keeping the traveler centered.

I have done some other minor tweaks like this and cut down my rigging time a little.
Posted By: Junior

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/12/11 07:46 PM

I whip out half hitches and am able to balance it that way...
Cheers,
Posted By: TEH

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/12/11 07:47 PM

I used half hitches once and one side came undone. Not fun.
Posted By: TEH

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/12/11 07:48 PM

Does anyone make some sort of clasp that would hold a piece of looped dyneema? Like they do on the lightweight blocks?

I found this thread. A soft shackle is what I think I need:
Soft Shackle
Posted By: Joanna

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/12/11 08:53 PM

We keep ours tied all the time...
Cut the main sheet so that with a knot on the end it goes out the full length of the beam. Then just tie the beam tail and the block tails together. Makes it for easy up and down and helps to keep the traveler in place while on the trailer.
Posted By: pdwarren

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/12/11 09:04 PM

Originally Posted by Joanna
We keep ours tied all the time...
Cut the main sheet so that with a knot on the end it goes out the full length of the beam. Then just tie the beam tail and the block tails together. Makes it for easy up and down and helps to keep the traveler in place while on the trailer.


Same here. Much easier smile

Paul
Posted By: TEH

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/12/11 09:08 PM

I am going to try a couple of these. I found a bunch that were pretty expensive (>$20), but at $8 I thought this one was worth a try. If it doesn't work on the main sheet, I will try them elsewhere.

Soft Shackles
Posted By: pepin

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/12/11 11:20 PM

You don't need a soft shackle. You don't even need a split end to your mainsheet.

On the back of my rear beam there are two eyelets. I attach a small loop of dyneema on one side. I then thread the mainsheet through the traveller, through the loop, pass it inside the other eyelet and make a figure of eight knot. Done.

The first time you do it you need to play a bit with the loop so it is the right length to center the traveller, but then you leave it on board permanently and you don't have to fiddle with anything to rig.
Posted By: Aido

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/13/11 12:28 AM

Originally Posted by Joanna
We keep ours tied all the time...
Cut the main sheet so that with a knot on the end it goes out the full length of the beam. Then just tie the beam tail and the block tails together. Makes it for easy up and down and helps to keep the traveler in place while on the trailer.


Totally agree with Joanna. Doing it any other way would be a pain in the butt and eventually destroy your traveller car.
Posted By: macca

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/13/11 02:45 AM

I can teach a retarded monkey to make a soft shackle in less than a minute!

Just make them yourself, its that easy!!!

But for the traveller to beam connection its hard to beat this setup: Clamcleat

then you can have a one piece mainsheet/traveller with a split tail (easy to do as well) and you dont leave your traveller rope on the boat to get all messed up in the sun for months at a time.

Nothing wrong with your traveller moving around when the boat is on the trailer, its much worse for it to be in one spot with salt and crap all built up inside it...
Posted By: PTP

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/13/11 04:27 AM

Originally Posted by macca
I can teach a retarded monkey to make a soft shackle in less than a minute!


absolutely. I made some and tested them with a 2 ton lift and they held. It is as easy as an eye splice and knot. Am using them various places on my 31
Posted By: Aido

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/13/11 04:30 AM

I was talking about smashing the car into the stopper because you don't have a knot in the rope.

Who leaves there boat in the sun??? Won't be just your traveller rope that's stuffed if you do that.
Posted By: macca

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/13/11 06:58 AM

you can have a one piece mainsheet/traveller with a knot in it...
Posted By: TEH

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/13/11 11:31 AM

When it comes to tying knots, a retarded monkey has a lot on me. I can barely tie a bowline. I did check out several tutorials and it does not look that hard.

BTW, I see two or three other places on the boat where I could use these. Any time I can avoid a knot, I will.
Posted By: TEH

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/13/11 11:39 AM

I could easily do your setup Pepin with my current split tail main.

Where else on your boat do you use the soft shackles?
Posted By: waynemarlow

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/13/11 04:25 PM

Originally Posted by TEH


Where else on your boat do you use the soft shackles?


I Think Peppins set up is the same as mine, Mainsheet to Boom,spinnaker tack as part of the outhaul line, spinnaker uphaul to spinnaker and the list goes on, basically everywhere you have a conventional shackle if you wanted, they are particularly easy if you use D12 for all the lines and the added benefit of D12 is you don't get rope friction burns on the spinnaker.

On the split stay at the back I simply put a wire eye in the short line and then the sheet goes through without any problems every time, very simple and I'm not sure why people go to the bother of creating a split tail on the sheet.
Posted By: Dlennard

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/13/11 09:48 PM

I use the split tail and take it off the boat after sailing. I don't know what the knot is called but it is just a half hitch with a knot tied on the tail. You leave the knot tied on the tail and it should pass through the eye strap then just tie a half hitch. The knot you leave in the tail is your reference point.
Posted By: macca

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/13/11 11:19 PM

its called a skiff knot, because its so simple even a skiff sailor can do it smile

Posted By: Matt M

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/16/11 12:09 PM

Originally Posted by macca
its called a skiff knot, because its so simple even a skiff sailor can do it smile


I've always heard that knot called an Australian bowline. wink
Posted By: David Ingram

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/16/11 12:27 PM

Originally Posted by Matt M
Originally Posted by macca
its called a skiff knot, because its so simple even a skiff sailor can do it smile


I've always heard that knot called an Australian bowline. wink


Do you two think it's wise to F!@# with Aussie skiff sailors?
Posted By: pgp

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/16/11 12:51 PM

http://www.animatedknots.com/double...og.jpg&Website=www.animatedknots.com

I had been using a figure 8 with an extra turn on the standing end, but have changed to the double overhand. The text explains the reasoning.
Posted By: Karl_Brogger

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/16/11 02:09 PM

Originally Posted by David Ingram
Originally Posted by Matt M
Originally Posted by macca
its called a skiff knot, because its so simple even a skiff sailor can do it smile


I've always heard that knot called an Australian bowline. wink


Do you two think it's wise to F!@# with Aussie skiff sailors?




BAAAWAAAAA!

Their in Aussie land anyhow.
Posted By: TEH

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/19/11 05:56 PM

By the way, if anyone is interested in doing their own soft shackle, this is a good site to visit. You input the size and it tells you how much line you need, where to make your marks, etc.

Making Soft Shackles
Posted By: pgp

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/19/11 06:27 PM

Nice!

Anyone have a similar site for splicing?

I've gathered a small number of reference sites, maybe we should all compare notes someday?

This is my favorite: http://www.animatedknots.com/indexb...og.jpg&Website=www.animatedknots.com

I think I got it from JW.
Posted By: TEH

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/19/11 09:03 PM

Here is the new england ropes splicing guide:

New England Ropes
Posted By: pgp

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/19/11 09:48 PM

Thanks. There was a long thread some time back about splicing and fids.

Do you happen to remember what the final verdict was? Is it necessary to buy an expensive set of fids or is there a more inexpensive alternative?
Posted By: TEH

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/19/11 10:04 PM

I don't remember that thread. I'd like to know because I'm going to be splicing some lines.
Posted By: pgp

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/19/11 10:12 PM

The jist was that fids can be expensive and not all sets work as well as others. So, you could be out $100 and still not have the correct tool.
Posted By: PTP

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/19/11 11:29 PM

get several sets of knitting needles from walmart. cut them shorter. BOOOOOOOMMMM!!!! fids... cheap too
Posted By: pgp

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/19/11 11:35 PM

There's an idea! You've actually done this?
Posted By: PTP

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/19/11 11:48 PM

yep. key issue is cutting them and then filing down the rough spots. they are hollow aluminum. Work great... but I am so unorganized I keep losing them.
Posted By: davefarmer

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/20/11 03:00 AM

I've used solid, small dia knitting needles for splicing 1/8" vectran 12 strand, taping the line to the needle. I remember Brian Toss Rigging having the quality fids. Search that and see what you get.
Posted By: pepin

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/20/11 10:13 AM


Don't bother buying a fid: For the size of lines we work with you probably have all the needed parts in your toolbox already.

Pick a length of thin wire (60cms or 2 foot), bend it in two in the middle, twist the ends together, cover the twist with tape and slide a plastic ball to cover the tape. If you want to be really fancy use stainless steel wire and bind the two ends with a nicropress sleeve instead of just twisting.

That's all you need to do all the splices you will ever need to do on your cat.
Posted By: pgp

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/20/11 12:19 PM

Thanks. What lines do you splice?
Posted By: pepin

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/20/11 02:41 PM

My weapon of choice is 3mm Dyna One HS from Gleistein. It is perfect for any lines you don't have to handle while sailing. I bought a 50 meter spindle for a very very good price and used it to replace lines on the trampoline, trapeze, pole, first stage of the main downhaul, spi downhaul and various soft shackles all around. There is not one knot on any of those lines, everything is spliced.

Most of the control lines are 4mm Excel Racing from Marlow tapered where needed and with splices or integrated soft shackes at the end as dictated by the place it is used (downhaul, spi halyard, main halyard, mast rotation, outhaul).

My tapered main sheet is Salsa from New England joined with some 4mm single braid dyneema of unknown origin (Marlow?).

I used 5mm Gleistein Discover for the line holding my trapeze dogbone, with a splice on both side and that was a mistake, I need to change it. This line is too slippy for that usage and my stopper keep sliding at the most inopportune moment. I need to replace that with something with more grip.

And I'm currently evaluating what to get to replace my spi sheets. I'm leaning toward a single braid dyneema/polyester blend like the Discover, in 6 or even 7mm with a tail to connect to the spi clew. I haven't decided what to get yet, suggestions welcome.
Posted By: pgp

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/20/11 03:31 PM

That's a lot of splicing.
Posted By: PTP

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/22/11 12:27 AM

once you start splicing and realize how easy (and cheap) it is to do you will find yourself doing what he did- everything gets spliced. If I lived next to my boat, everything would be 7/64 amsteel spliced
Posted By: pgp

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/23/11 07:49 PM

Ok, what's the easiest place to start?
Posted By: Karl_Brogger

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/23/11 08:20 PM

making eye's in 12 strand dyneema
Posted By: pgp

Re: Mainsheet Tie to Rear Beam - 05/23/11 08:34 PM

It's on the "to do" list.
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