An Introduction

It dawned on me that i was posting replies on this Forum without having the good manners to introduce myself so here goes !
My name is Mike Young, i'm a 50yr old (this year) Cat Sailor. My home sailing club is Port Edgar Yacht Club near Edinburgh, Scotland. I sail a Stealth (F16) which i've owned for 41/2 years. We have only 12 cats at our club of which 7 race regularly, our racing is mainly on Wednesday evenings but we can do some short course racing on Monday nights. In Scotland we have a 6 race series which visits various venues in Scotland and the North of England. We average about 24 boats at each event which comprise of Hurricane 5.9's, Dart 18's Spitfires and Stealths. I really only race for enjoyment and the after event sociality. I dont know what its like in other countries but in the UK in general catamarans are considered to be "old mens boats"but with the introduction of the F16 (which is how i refer to the Stealth now)we're able to demonstrate to the "Young Guns" that cats are great fun.
So having introduced myself i look forward to "meeting" the rest of you.
Regards Mike Young F16 GBR 513

Hey Mike,

Photo taken mere moments ago surrounded by some of my sixteen's ( a seventeen or two also) - very few have F's - all are High Performance !

Paul Kilkenny

Hi, Mike, nice to meet you.
You can click on my name to the left of this post to do my background check.

You said: "...in the UK in general catamarans are considered to be "old mens boats." So my question is, at what age does one become an "old man" in the UK? Maybe all the monohulls there are Lasers and 49ers and International 14's? Those can make you old pretty fast.

In the U.S., the average age of cat sailors is about 40. Is that considered "old" over there?

Hi Paul, Hi Mary, man 40 not just old its "over the hill" (smile) I have some fun with the "youngsters" who are used to monoslugs - i dont know what you sail but one of the Stealths many redeeming features is that you can get it all wrong when going downwind bury it with the water half way up the tramp and "pop" up she comes and off she goes although since i've fitted "T Foil" rudders she doesnt go down but it was enough to make the kids appreciate that modern cats are pretty exciting compared to RS's, Laser 4000s and Int 14s - mind you i learnt to sail when i was 9yrs old and i've learned that if your capsized you aint going forwards. What kinda Cats do you sail ?

Mike GBR 513

So you have had your Stealth for over 4 years and you have never pitchpoled? Your description of it diving in and then "pop" back up reminds me a lot of my early sails on a Tornado.

How long ago did you put the T-foil rudders on? Are they class legal in the Formula 16 class? Do they think they really do the job as far as preventing nose-diving?

Maybe it is not a problem in your area, but in some of the areas where we sail there is a lot of grass floating on the water that gets caught on the rudders. It seems like that would be even a bigger problem with the T-foils. Have you ever encountered that problem? If so, is it harder to get the grass off than with regular, plain-old straight rudders? I assume it would be.

Hey Mike, welcome to the F16 forum. Here you will learn as much about people as you do about sailing !
Nice to have a Stealth sailor on board.
Now for the correction. You ain`t old until you see the report on the 74 year young sailor in the Asian F16 challenge, and he ain`t old either !
And the question : I assume from your statement that the T-foil rudders do their job well. Are they not difficult to pull up or push down when launching through surf and when coming in at a slipway launch in a queue of boats ? They look great and if they really do keep the nose from going in and allow you to carry more power with more confidence, they might just be the next logical step in making more catamarans more pitchpole-friendly. I suppose John Pierce has a patent out on that idea ?

Cheers
Steve

Hi all,
thought Mikes intro was a good idea here's mine.

I am 44 y.o. started sailing at 5 y.o., racing my own boat at 7 y.o. sailed fist cat at 13 y.o. Have sailed everything from 8' to 60' spent most of my time on mono's but cats are catching up now. Started sailboarding in 1980 and still have 5 in a trailer that see light of day occasionaly.

Am totaly addicted to speed have been sailing assymetric spinnakers on multis for at least 8 years, can't stand sailing without the wind blowing in my face, find it difficult now to sail boats that don't work apparent wind. Currently own only one boat Altered oneup F16. F16 has totaly reinvigorated my interest in sailing just can't get enough of it, drive my friends and family mad talking about it and of course posting on the forum.

I love racing and will travel anywhere for a reggatta, often 8 hrs. for a weekend. Have driven 20 hrs. for a 3 day reggatta. I live in regional Victoria on one of the best lakes to sail on in OZ, but there are not alot of other cats around lucky if we get 4 sailing at once. Closest city is Melbourne 3&1/2 hours away, some clubs there have 20+ cats racing regularly.

Regards Gary.

Gary,
Have you ever held a regatta on your home lake? If it is one of the best in Australia, I would think sailors would be willing to drive the 8 hours or whatever to get there. We have to drive 6-12 hours just to get to regattas in the State of Florida. And one of these years we are going to drive to Australia!

G'day All,

Primarily my background is cat racing (prefer to race than just sail around). I am 37 years old now & started racing (when 10 years old)an 11 foot cat called the "arafura cadet". Over the years raced arrows(14foot ply cat)& mosquito. The arrow was my passion for many years wining one australian championship & many junior titles & have been racing tornado for the last 4 years with the spinnaker with varied results. These days I get just as much satisfaction preparing my own boat & sails as I do racing ( I especially enjoy beating my competitors that have purchased the latest & greatest of everything & get beaten by a "back yard" builder!!).

More recently a long time friend (Chirs Dean) & my self built the Blade F18 with interesting results.

Plans are to now continue developing the Blade F18 & to build 2 Blade F16's cat rigged for my self the Tornado crew & have some fun.

The main reason for my interest in the F16 is the material freedom, as we currently make our own sails, foils, hulls, stocks, trampolene, suffer tube & poles. The F16 rules now allow us to build our own mast & beams out the material of our choice. I cant wait.

Marcus

Hi Mary,

yes we do hold reggattas on home lake, but have not had much luck attracting other cats in recent years to mixed fleet reggattas, although in recent years we have held National Titles for 3 different cat classes.

Regards Gary.

Hi Marcus,

great to have you on board, we need more Aussies, am wrapped to hear you talking of sailing one up, this is my option on the F16 and I think it's most outstanding feature. Unbeatable power to weight ratio!!!!!!!!!!

Met some guys that know you at Arrow nationals sailed at my club. Quizzed them about Blade F18 and S.A. racing. May have been able to make Goolwa Milang race held recently, but only found out about it from Glen Ashby the day before, he's hard to beat isn't he.

Let me know if you have any events coming up with good fleet size suitable for spinnakers, I would love to come over and show you my project, might give you some ideas for your one up F16's.

Regards Gary.

G'day Gary,

Looking forward to seeing your boat in the flesh. We have raced the T in 25-30knots at Sail melb the year before last & we ended up breaking the mast after a massive nose dive.!! You have probably missed all the major long distance races here for this season. There is a race out of Victor Harbor thats called "Rum race". The event is in June & its a winter's mad dash & marathon race rolled into one. Yes, Glen is a hard one to keep up with.!! We jumped the start in the Goolwa-Meningie race a fortnight ago & it took us over an hour to actually get within striking distance. Wind conditions then controlled the destiny of the race & we lucked out. Never mind Chris Dean & myself won the race hands down the year before (conditions seem to allways determine the placings).

Looking forward to building & sailing an F16 & will be starting hulls after easter.

Keep you posted.

Regards

Marcus

Hello Everbody,
I have a standard 4.9that i have recently set-up as f16.
I have made a new mainsail and spinnaker and have been racing the boat at the Southport yacht club over the last few months. i have checked this forum from time to time and now i am in for good i guess!
I look foward to reading further and adding my bit.

Cheers,

Ben.

Ben,

Welcome to the class.

I would like to use this opportunity to invite you to become a F16 class member with voting rights.

For more information on that go to :

http://www.catsailor.com/forums/sho...ge=1&view=expanded&sb=5&o=14

In summary :

Membership is free of charge and 2005 will be given to any-one sending the following data to

Formula16class(at)hotmail.com

Full name (First name , sir name and additional initials)
E-mail adress (of one that you look into and will keep for some time)
Sail club name (when one is a member of a local club)
location sail club = town + nation

Boat type
Boat name (optional; write in "no name" when your boat doesn't have a name)
Sail number
Year of build


In order to retain your membership for coming years like 2006 and so on you must at least once participate in a F16 event during 2005 or participate in an open regatta once of a minimal total of boats racing. For you guys there are 2 F16 events coming up. One in NSW (fun event of very long (spi) course and one in Victoria (the VC state titles). Otherwise an event as Foster or something is enough to renew your membership for 2006. Of course you'll have to sail as a F16 in such an open regatta. That is all, once a year.

I'm looking forward in putting you down as a F16 class member.

And ohh others like Marcus who are reading this are invited to become members too. Same procedure of course

One more question.

I'm looking at the picture you've attached and I'm quite interested in the size of the square-top you have on there. Is it 700 mm wide ?

If so can you give us a comparison between this sail and the standard Taipan 4.9 mainsail. I know a few of us are really interested in how the larger heads behaves on the AHPC superwing mast. Most of us have gone to 550 mm, but there is some fear that the superwing mast has a too flexible top to feature a head this big (700 mm - 750 mm). I think you are the first with a head this big (of the mainsail I mean)

Wouter

Wouter,

Goodall is developing a mainsail for the aussie Taipan 4.9 fleet that has a foot 70mm shorter than standard with an 850mm head (say's its mucho rapido as well...); course what does he know about wingmasts....!?

Paul

Ohh this is interesting. Especially since the Taipan One-Design class rules limit the head to only 400 mm !

Is the Aussie Taipan 4.9 fleet going F16 ? Or are they changing their One-Design rules ?

Wouter

Hello Everbody,
The F16 mainsail i have designed and built is made using a skiffcloth monofilm material and has triple fibre psa carbon tape adheared to the sail on the load lines.
The head of the sail is 700mm with the same foot length as the taipan class main. The sail simply has alot straighter leech than the Taipan to meet the f16 area with the head size at 700mm. The sail reallly sharpens up the look of the boat don't you think?
I think the head could be bigger still without messing with the mast too much and have an even straighter leech and still work but I think if the head was to be much bigger the sail would become very twichy and become very critical to trim!
I am pleased with the user friendly leech of my new sail, the mast looks as steady as a rock up-hill unlike downwind!
I will attach another photo of the boat so you can see the mainsail better.
Is there any way to attach any more than one photo?
Has anyone put a self tacker on a taipan for f16 without moving the wires foward on the boat, because the headsail will end up way too short in the foot?
i will post a couple of shots of the boat.

Regards,

Ben Kelly.
Proprietor Horizon Sailmakers Queensland.

Photos!
We had a 50mile passage race last month and i have a few shots i will attach!
We had alot go wrong during the race and ended up only beating two F18's home but we did kick butt around the first mark baeting all the F18's including Mitch Booth except one of the local tigers!
We had alot of trouble with the rear beam bottoming out on the swells when we got out into the rough stuff in teh bay!
See Ya,

Ben.

Photos!
We had a 50mile passage race last month and i have a few shots i will attach!
We had alot go wrong during the race and ended up only beating two F18's home but we did kick butt around the first mark baeting all the F18's including Mitch Booth except one of the local tigers!
We had alot of trouble with the rear beam bottoming out on the swells when we got out into the rough stuff in teh bay!
See Ya,

Ben.

photo2

photo3

Ben,

I really like the appearance of your F16 mainsail. I was hoping to get something like that when I ordered a modified F16 main back in 2003. But I got one with the characteristic Taipan leech round despite the fact that my square-top is 580 mm.

Anyways, I think it is very good that you still got the same foot length as well. With this sail the Taipan looks alot more modern again. I really like it; looks sharp indeed.

Also a twichy sail is no good, best is a compromise between speed and ease of trim (forgiveness). I hear AHPC went for 840 mm head and that seems like a lot !



What is your combined crewweight ? Our fears are that the rig will depower to soon with a head that is too large. This can be corrected by moving the hounds up a little but we need to know how much this is needed. If it is alright as it is than that would be be especially great. I'm hoping that increasing the mast rotation just a little will be enough to bring the top back in again; resulting in only increased performance and no need to modify the mast design.

And , what about that top on downwinders ehhh ! We got a scare as well but the mast just took the beating as if it was fully designed to do. When I ran to little leech tension on spi I was told by other sailors that the mast flexed forward by 20 to 30 degrees. But it survived just fine and it is still straight ! But I run a little more mainsheet tension now, when fully powered up under spi.



Yes and no ;

You can only upload one photo per post, however you can display them all in one post by putting the link (URL) between to mark-up codes

example : (replace the {} by [] )

{image}http://www.catsailor.com/bb_files/46049-DSC_2214.jpg{/image}

You can find the URL by rightclicking on the attachments and select "open in new window"





Yes, Here in Netherlands two crews have done that. I'm one of these. My jib, made by AHPC, was (from memory) 3.40 sq. mtr. big. F16 rules would have allowed 3.65 sq. mtr. in my case by I think 0.25 sq.mtr. different is not worth fuzzing over. The increased luff lengths and such will correct for that. I do thing than a little more area could have been put in. In short a standard Taipan 4.9 can be fitted with a selftacking jib that comes very close to the max allowed in the F16 class. You'll only have the fit the rail and car AND a bridle strut. The last will allow the luff of the jib to come down to the spi pole. You must do that to get the area in. I must say that AHPC supplies a good selftacking kit for the Taipan 4.9 at a reasonable price.

Net result. The boat and trampoline feels alot more roomy and starts to feel like a proper big boat. Also tacks and gibes are WAAAAY easier on the crew as those jib sheets aren't in the way as with the old setup. That really makes a difference. Under spinnaker I wouldn't want to go back to the old setup. Gibes are just way quicker and easier. The crew can totally focus on bringing the spi over without flapping and putting the power on quickly. You'll keep more speed up during gibes and you can enter a gibing duel again.

I really like the selftacker. When I get home I will post a few pics I have of it.

Regards,

Wouter
Proprietor Horizon Sailmakers Queensland.

Hi Ben,

welcome, love the look of that main. Must have been fun putting all that carbon tape on it.

Would love to check it out in the flesh. Why don't you head South and I will head north we could meet somewhere south of Sydney? maybe Port Kembla S.C. for the Drag race 2/3rd. April.

Regards Gary.

I AM A WIFE OF A KEEN SAILOR WHO DOES NOT HAVE THE SERIOUS FUNDS TO HAVE HIS OWN BOAT.I AM TRYING TO PLAN A HUGE 40TH SUPRISE CLOSE TO HOME WITH REGARDS TO THE SAILING COMMUNITY WITH BOATS.MY HUSBAND HAS SOME GOOD CERTIFICATES FOR SAILING BUT UNFORTUNATELY CANNOT USE THEM AS THERE IS NO BOAT.MY HUSBAND SAYS THE FEELING IS LIKE NO OTHER WHEN ON THE WATER AND I WOULD LIKE TO REMIND HIM OF THIS EXPERIENCE FOR HIS BIRTHDAY.I AM LOOKING FOR SOMEONE TO PLEASE RESCUE ME BY HOPEFULLY COMING TO THE RESCUE OF MAYBE HELPING OUT.I STAY IN FIFE NEAR KIRKCALDY AND I AM LOOKING FOR SOMEONE WHO MIGHT NEED COMPANY ON THEIR BOAT FOR A COUPLE OF HOURS I THINK ITS MORE OF A MAN THING THAN WOMEN MIXING.NOT THAT I FRET.I AM MORE THAN PREPARED TO PUT MONEY TOWARDS COSTS FOR TO SEE A MASSVE SMILE ON HIS FACE.I WAS TOLD MAYBE SOMEONE FROM PORT EDGAR COULD POSSIBLY HELP OUT.I HOPE.MY HUSBANDS BIRTHDAY IS CREEPING UP FASTLY AND WITH VERY LITTLE TIME TO ORGANISE THIS I AM STRUGGLING.HE ENJOYS,SPEEDBOATS,STEALTHS,POWERBOATS AND THAT IS ALL I KNOW AS A BOAT IS A BOAT AND IT FLOATS.MOST SAILORS WOULD SAY I WAS ARROGANT BUT BELIEVE ME IT IS LACK OF KNOWLEDGE ON MY BEHALF.CAN ANYONE HELP.PLEASE READ THIS AND TAKE THIS AS A SERIOUS GESTURE AND NOT VIEW ME AS A TIME WASTER.THANKS