F16 "Global Challenge" - Singapore

This communication just received from David Adams at Changi Sailing Club, Singapore:

[color:"brown"] " [color:"blue"] The F-16 Global Challenge [/color]


We will be holding a major F-16 international sailing event in Singapore on the 7th to the 11th of February, 2007. This will be hosted by the Changi Sailing Club and is expected to attract an international fleet consisting of sailors from Europe, Australia, USA, South Africa and Asia. Boats that fall within the F-16 class (Taipans, Blades, Stealths, Mosquitoes, Spitfires and G-cats) are invited to join. Key aspects of the event are:

· The event will be held over 5 days with one rest day. It will start on Wednesday the 7th of February, 2007.

· The event will be held at a time of the year where winds are consistent and can be expected to be in the range of 15 to 20 knots.

· Corporate sponsorship is currently being engaged and significant prize money will be offered.

· Changi Sailing Club who will be hosting the event has the largest Taipan fleet in the world and first rate facilities that includes bars, restaurants, swimming pool, accommodation and good boat storage.

· The event will be held during the northern hemisphere “off season”. Conditions are warm in Singapore and offer a respite from the cold.

Singapore has an outstanding modern infrastructure, is a major transport hub and offers efficient and fast boat clearance. The costs of shipping boats will be significantly reduced if sailing clubs or individual sailors group together to hire shipping containers.

If you are interested in competing in this event or require further information please contact David Adams at dadams@kraftasia.com

For information on the Changi Sailing Club please visit our website:

www.csc.org.sg " [/color]

Having just returned from Singapore a week ago, I can thoroughly recommend the club, the people and the sailing!

We need to start getting some idea of who wants to go, and costings for containers/shipping so that we can get an approximate cost per boat.

I gather that it is unlikely there will be any charter F16s available so I'm afraid that shipping your own boat will be the only possibility.

I've been asked to post this as well :

Fellow Catamaran Sailors,

On February 7th -11th, 2007 we will be holding an international F-16 event called the "F-16 Global Challenge" in Singapore hosted by the Changi Sailing club. We are currently well advanced in the planning of this event and funding and support to run it has been secured. Further details are contained in the attached.


The main aim of the "F-16 Global Challenge" will be to:

-1- Promote the F-16 class
-2 Provide an international forum where F-16 sailors can compete
-3- Have a good time and enjoy the sailing
-4- Enhance contacts and linkages within the F16 class.


We are now reaching out to catamaran sailors and sailing clubs around the world to notify them of the details. It would be appreciated if you could let me know if you are interested in participating in this event and please pass this communication onto to other F-16 sailors and affiliations so that they are aware of the details.


Best regards
David Adams

Chairman of Steering Committee "F-16 Global Challenge"

Hi all,

I would love to be there, need some other Aussies to get a container together. Who's game?

Regards Gary.

Speak to the Taipan guys. The Taipan association has racks for container shipping so that would be your best bet to help shipping. Should be able to get 6 to 8 cats to a container.

JC

Latest update from David Adams in Singapore:

"The response to the F16 Championships has been excellent. We should be able
to get 20 local boats on the water plus 20 from overseas = 40.

I am currently having very good discussions with potential sponsors. We will
easily cover the costs of the event and we are aiming for S$ 100,000 in
prize money. If successful, I would imagine that the number of boats that
will participate will increase further.

The entry fee for the championship will only be S$100 per boat."

S$100,000 = $62,220 = £35,724 = Eur51,385

How about cutting the price money in halve and using one halve to pay for the US, EU and Aus containers transporting the boats ?

20,000 Euro's is more then enough prize money for my taste. Hell I think 1,000 Euro's to be pretty good prize money. I know that I'm not going to win it so I personally care more for limiting the cost of participation (shipping).


Wouter

Yes - subsidised transport costs would do a lot more for getting me over there than a bigger prize pool.

Paul

Agreed,
However, if the event has good prise money it may help get media attention and maybe this will assist in courting sponsorship from a shipping company for containers from US,Aust and Europe.
If not then consider what assistance can be provided to moving boats between the main centres.
Just a thought.


Regards,
Phill

How will the prize money be distributed -- across how many places?

Just some thoughts of mine:
Big prize money may draw more attention to the event and even more sponsorship, but will it draw more sailors to race in the event? It might draw more of the top sailors, which is good. But it might turn away more of the "ordinary" racers who have the perception that racing for money tends to make the competition more "intense" (read cut-throat). Is that perception valid?

And even if it is not a valid perception, is it setting a bad precedent to have what is basically a world championship (global equals world), with money prizes?

For instance, if this became a trend, would people start choosing the regattas they are going to attend based upon how much prize money is being offered? And will it hurt regatta attendance at major events that do NOT offer money prizes?

At least it would be a way for Olympic contenders to help fund their Olympic campaigns.

On the other hand, maybe Olympic level sailors are not allowed to race in events with prize money (I don't know.) And if ISAF nixes this whole thing ("Global" tied in with money), maybe you will ONLY be able to get the ordinary racers who are not setting their sites on major ISAF events or the Olympics, PanAmericans, etc.

Just some things I wonder about. (I hope ISAF is not monitoring this forum.)

We have strong interest expressed by about half a dozen UK sailors for this event, so I think we could get a container from the uk.

Hi all,

interest is strong in OZ also, looks like a container of boats from Australia.

Regards Gary.

We are still trying to reach the Swiss and Southern German Taipan sailors and the two new German F16 sailors who just received their boats.

But some of us here in Netherlands are serious considering coming out. I can't be specific in the way of names and I won't make garantees. But I know personally of 3 crews seriously looking to come out to Singapore. If anything these will drive over to UK and jump in with the UK container. If we find 2 more crews willing to go then a seperate container will most likely depart from Rotterdam.

With the promising reports from the UK and Australia it looks more and more attractive to go.

We're just missing the US sailors at this time ?

Say guys, any chance of finding 5 crews/boats to make the container from the USA (Florida) affordable ?

Wouter

How much? Bottom line: container, airfare, hotel & food?

Wouter,

I see it highly unlikely that any of the F16HPs from Florida will be attending. It is difficult to get them to attend regattas in the region let alone half way around the world. Most barely have the financial resource to buy a boat let along travel. If it isn't money, then it is family or work obligations. There seems to be lot of talk about racing the F16HP in Florida, but it is just that - talk.

Jennifer Lindsay

Ouch! I think Jen is calling you guys out! Jen, are you racing the JPOR? If so, which boat? Money is always an issue when you have 4 kids, 6 show horses, 5 dogs and a wife that thinks money grows on the trees out back...

Hi Tim,

I will be at JPOR but it will probably be with the Tiger. My prospective crew and I will weigh in around 360 lbs and that is too heavy for the F16HP. Contrary to previous post about racing the F16HP with that much weight, you can do it but you just won't be competitive. Also, I'm not too keen on launching either the A-Cat or FHP16U off the beach through the surf by myself. I have done it before but if there is a lot of surf, the F18 with 2 people is more appropriate for the conditions.

If my prospective crew can't make it and I find lighter crew, then I might sail the F16HP otherwise I'll sail F16HPU or A-Cat.

Jennifer

Any thoughts about why that is? I can understand that other obligations sometimes interfere, but when it is constant, it seems to me more of a smoke screen.

On our side were are looking at :

Container : 500 Euro's the boat
Airfare : 750 Euro's the person
Hotel : I haven't got a confirm quote on that but I typically estimate 50 Euro's a night
Food : It is singapore ! 20 bucks a day !
Regatta fee : 100 Euro's per crew

When doublehanding : about 1540 Euro's per person.

Wouter

Do they have any charter boats available down there? That would save a bit on the shipping.

It's tempting! Anyone else from the U.S. interested?

From Ft Lauderdale to Singapore round trip with a hotel offer via travelocity.com comes out to roughly $1,700.00

This does not include food, or container cost. Maybe I can use my miles, or timeshare?????


I sent out a quote request to this company:
http://www.rinkens.com/
http://www.omegashipping.com/
http://www.ablecargo.com/

I will keep searching around.

Robi:

How many boats do we need for a container?

Well the containers measure 40ft long by 8ft wide by 8ft tall.

As many as we can fit in. I will fireup my vector software and I will return with that information.

Our boats measure 16ft long and the masts are 28ft long. As many as we can squeeze in.

I do not have inmediate access to my boat, can anyone give me a rough estime of the dimensions of the blade, taipan. All I need is width and height.

A 40ft container fits 12 boats including masts, beams, cattrax, etc.
You stack the hulls and masts with a four layer pipe structure as used in construction.

hmmm, so far I have been able to fit 16. I am nore sure if I have my measurements right though. I am going off a drawing, I have never shipped a boat anywhere so do not take my word for it. Although even TWELVE boats is a lot.

If anyone can give me some rough guestimates of how high the blade and taipan are in inches or milimeters I can get a better picture drawn out.

Daggerboard head on Taipan is 450 mm and I think the blade daggerboard head is 500 mm.

Width at max point is less then 400 mm for both boats. Probably between 320 mm and 350 mm

Wouter

If we are talking about the standard Taipan 4.9 (with spi) then I agree with you, however the never F16 designs like the Blade and Stealth do really carry weight noticeably better. I probably should have underlined this difference more clearly in my previous posting.

Last time I "raced" against a VWM Blade F16 I could barely keep up while they had at least 160 kg on board (= min. 353 lbs); my combined weight on the Taipan F16 was max. 147 kg (= max 325 lbs). One of that Blade crew owned a Taipan 4.9 at the time and decided right after that test sail to sell it and buy a Blade. He just picked his new boat up 3 days ago.

They were competitive alright; at 160+ kgs. We both hit 18 knots under spinnaker that day during a gust, but they slowly walked away anyway. We were single trapping upwind so the wind was not so strong as to direcly favour the heavier crew.

Wouter

I think it was the person steering who made the difference

(just kidding of course)

Hi Robi,

Greg Goodall suggested 13 F16's would fit in a container, I assume this is based on his experience with shipping assembled Taipans. So if boats are full width F16, this would mean dissasembly required, so it may be possible to fit in more if they are dissasembled?

This sort of number certainly cuts costs for shipping.It would be great to have some Septics there. I hope this event can be the first Worldwide coming together of F16 enthusiasts, the racing is secondary.

Regards Gary.

Are you MAD!?????

Taipans don't fit inside a sea-container when assembled. I heard that a 2.3 mtr wide A-cat had only 20 mm space on each side. A Taipan is 2.34 mtr. wide meaning it is jammed tight between the sides of the container. So the quote most be for fully disassembled boats.

I'm certainly planning to come out to the event to enjoy myself in a leasurely way. Daniel van Kerckhof, John Pierce, you and the Spitfire boys are definately outside of my class.

Although I've been working on a secret wapon recently.

Wouter

Assembled boats will NOT fit into a container. The inside measurements are 8 ft wide. F16s are wider than 8 ft.

What is the length of a container? Or do they come in different lengths?

There are different lenghts Mary.

You get to choose from
length, width and height
20' X 8' X 8'
40' X 8' X 8'
40' X 8' X 12'

I know there are a few 52' containor out there, but I dont think those containors are shipable. I beleive those are kept within the US.

They do come in different lengths. As I understand it, you need a big one (40ft?) because of the masts, and this is why shipping a small number of cats is so expensive.

One thing that Hans and Matt will tell you is that shipping in a container takes a lot of care, as you can rest assured that the container itself will not be handled with care.

Paul

You are right Paul. 40ft would be the container to use.

And yes packing has to be performed with extreme car and to make sure NO parts or boats move about inside the container.

That would be bad, very bad.

I have talked to Robert Onsgard about this, because for about 12 years he organized groups of boats to go by container from South Florida to various events in the Caribbean. He says they used a 40-foot container, and the boats were always shipped completely disassembled. The number of boats that will fit into the container depends upon the width of the hulls. For instance, they were able to fit 15 Nacra 6.0's but only 12 Inter 20's.

They built plywood racks two levels high for the hulls, and left the floor space open for masts, beams, beach wheels, etc. A few times they saved the racks and re-used them the next year, but usually they just threw the wood away and rebuilt them the next time.

You will be interested in this, Wouter, because he said that the guys who came to the events from the Netherlands were able to get more boats into their container because of some kind of telescoping tubing that they used, that took up less space than 2x4's.

If anybody is seriously considering packing up a container of boats to go to Singapore, let me know, and I can put you in touch with Robert, because he could be very helpful.

Hi Guys,

We can (and do) ship up to 12 F18's in 1 40' container. These are packed very snugly and there is not a lot of room to spare afterwards. I suspect you could jam a couple more in but the risk of damaging boats & gear would rise substantially.

The F16's are a little smaller but not a whole lot different when it comes to fitting them in a container.

Tiger Mike

Thank Mary,

Wouter

Hi John,

thought you would have picked up from my posts by now, I never take the racing seriously , us Aussie's are like that.

Regards Gary.

Well, I still have not recieved any information.

What information ?

wouter

I know (John P has already posted an indication) that there are quite a few UK sailors interested in this event, but is anyone actively obtaining quotes, shipping info etc.?

In terms of flying out there, at what sort of passenger numbers might we qualify for a group discount on flights? Anyone know/able to find out?

Finally does anyone in the UK fleet have links with shipping companies or airlines, or know someone who could help?

... or does anyone have any contacts amongst the Aruba organisers? I notice that they get sponsorship from Hapag-Lloyd (http://www.arubaregatta.com/sponsors.asp) which I assume comes in the form of cheaper shipping and also with KLM.

The downside of airline sponsorship is that the flights leave from a small number of departure points at prescribed times. If I come, I will be looking to tack a holiday onto the beginning or end, which wouldn't work with set flight times.

Paul

John, the links I posted are international shipping companies. Give them a shot. Its been over a week now, and I have not heard back from them.

Since the organizer in Singapore has been able to get so much sponsorship for prize money, I would think they would be able to get a container-ship company to at least sponsor free shipping from some countries. Seems to me that the regatta organizer would be the one to coordinate that kind of thing.....at least if they want a lot of people to come to their event.

has anyone heard re to shipping etc from the US? interest still there?

Just heard back frow Swire UK (Shippers) via a good friend of mine. They are
a) unable to assist the UK boats with any form of sponsorship even if we carry their logo/name on hulls and or sails
b)unable to quote for shipping to/from Singapore

They seemed to try to help especially as it turned out afterward that they don't have a route UK-Singapore direct, and genuinely seemed interested.

It was worth a try, I'll now work on some others. Anyone else got a suggestion?

The Fast Boat Race in the Solent is "sponsored by Peters and May, specialists in yacht and dinghy shipping worldwide". Sounds like it could be worth a shot.

www.weston.org.uk/pdfs/FastBoat_08_2006.pdf

http://www.petersandmay.com/

Paul

I sent out over 10 email quote request, no replies. It has been over a month now.

Seing how I cannot afford such a trip, I am not going to follow up on it.