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U.S. A-Class Association speaks out #143671
05/21/08 12:36 AM
05/21/08 12:36 AM
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Central California
ejpoulsen Offline OP
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Bravo to the USACA for being organized and getting their opinions to US Sailing President and Board. Bob Hodges, et al did a very nice job articulating the multihull point of view.

See http://www.usaca.info/


Eric Poulsen
A-class USA 203
Ultimate 20
Central California
-- Have You Seen This? --
Re: U.S. A-Class Association speaks out [Re: ejpoulsen] #143672
05/21/08 06:46 AM
05/21/08 06:46 AM
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Posts: 12,310
South Carolina
Jake Offline
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I had my head in the sand (literally) last week when all this went down - how DID the US vote last week when things didn't go through?


Jake Kohl
Re: U.S. A-Class Association speaks out [Re: Jake] #143673
05/21/08 07:05 AM
05/21/08 07:05 AM
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For obvious reasons I think they decided to keep votes secret this time.
On a more positive note, the dutch F18 class has been invited to hold their Nationals at the Olympic Classes event which is I guess is great for recognition of multihull sailing.
Website (not yet updated): http://www.opendutchsailing.org/

Re: U.S. A-Class Association speaks out [Re: Tony_F18] #143674
05/21/08 10:33 AM
05/21/08 10:33 AM
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Western Australia
Stewart Offline
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correct me if I am wrong... Didn't Holland vote to scrap the Tornado? If so why are the F18s sailing in an event that makes the Dutch NA look good?
The obvious reasons is to protect their collecting arses..

The only way we will get through to ISAF is to ban any ISAF involvement in any cat class till the results are transparent. Then ban the NAs that voted against the cats.. Banning the ISAF should make them wake up..

Re: U.S. A-Class Association speaks out [Re: ejpoulsen] #143675
05/23/08 09:59 AM
05/23/08 09:59 AM
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LA
Acat230 Offline
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The letter that is posted on the USACA website was drafted by me and reviewed in detail with Pease Glaser. Pease has a lot of experience with the US Sailing and ISAF organizations having been directly involved with many committees.

I sent the letter to Jim Capron and every member of the US Sailing board of directors. I did not receive a single response to the letter, not even a response acknowledging receipt of the letter.

As most of you know, the ISAF committee at the Qingdao meeting voted to not re-affirm the November selection of classes. This lead to a vote to decide whether to reconsider the actual slate of events. The vote (done in secret) required 26 votes in favor to re-start the event selection process again. 21 votes were received in favor so the November selection stands and multihulls are out of 2012 Olympics for now.

I spoke with Pease last week about the vote and the lack of response from US Sailing (we are fairly sure that the US delegates at the Qingdao meeting voted against any reconsideration of the events selection). Pease is typically a very CAN DO and optimistic person and this was one of the few times where she has responded to me that she is not sure what else we can do (at least through normal "diplomatic" channels).

I mentioned to her that at this point, perhaps the best thing we can all do as individuals is for each of us to send a letter or e-mail to the membership office of US Sailing and take the position that we will no longer support them with our membership dues as they no longer serve our interests nor do they take us serious as a legitimate community. Pease did not disagree with me.

I believe I will make my own stand. It's up to everyone else to decide how they should act.

Bob Hodges
USACA
A-Class USA 230
Corsair Sprint 750 9

Re: U.S. A-Class Association speaks out [Re: Acat230] #143676
05/23/08 11:12 AM
05/23/08 11:12 AM

A
Anonymous
Unregistered
Anonymous
Unregistered
A



I agree with you Bob, but i am not and never have been a member. I would be happy to write to them stating i was considering a membership but will not at this time due to that lack of multi-hull representation ... if i knew who to send an email to.

Re: U.S. A-Class Association speaks out [Re: Acat230] #143677
05/23/08 11:27 AM
05/23/08 11:27 AM
Joined: Oct 2001
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LA
Acat230 Offline
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Sent to Amy Larkin at US SAILING (amylarkin@ussailing.org)



Dear Amy,



As president of the United States A-Class Catamaran Association (USACA), I am writing to let you know that I am making a choice this year to not support US Sailing by non-payment of my membership dues. I have been active in sailboat racing for over 30 years racing such one design classes as Finns, Lasers, Snipes, Thistles, Lightnings, various sailboards, and for the last 16 years multihulls that have included the Prindle 19, Tornado, A-Class catamaran, and a Corsair Sprint 750 trimaran. Since the early-1980’s, I have been fairly consistent paying my annual US Sailing membership dues. There are two specific reasons why I choose for now to not support US Sailing:



The unanimous vote of US sailing delegates at the November ISAF meeting to eliminate the multihull event from the 2012 Olympic Games despite a position previously stated by the organization to support such an event and contrary to the specific recommendations of the ISAF events committee that included a multihull event(s).
The total lack of response from Mr. Jim Capron and the entire US Sailing board of directors to a letter written on April 21, 2008 by me on behalf of the USACA (see www.usaca.info) to ask the organization to reconsider its position on this issue going into the ISAF mid-year meeting in Qingdao. To our knowledge, US Sailing was not among the ISAF member national authorities that requested re-affirmation of the November selection of events and at this time we believe that US Sailing delegates did not support any consideration of a change in events.


US Sailing (by its actions) continues to send a message that it does not consider the multihull community in this country or the world to be a legitimate branch of the sport. Until I see change in the organization that leads me to believe otherwise, I will continue to boycott the organization with non-payment of membership dues. Further action I will take will be to send this letter to the membership of the USACA and other multihull organizations.



Sincerely Yours,



Bob Hodges

Re: U.S. A-Class Association speaks out [Re: Acat230] #143678
05/23/08 11:34 AM
05/23/08 11:34 AM
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Posts: 3,116
Annapolis, MD
Mark Schneider Offline
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To
Bob Hodges, (A Class) Bob Merrick (Hobie Classes) Jack Young (Nacra Classes)(Shark, Isotope F16, F18 commodores)

US Sailing will mandate that all skippers be members of US Sailing.... no more regatta surcharge that stays with the YC.

Will your Yacht Club honor that US Sailing demand and deny your sailors entry in your NA championship regattas.

(My clubs have their head in the sand and are hoping this does not actually happen).

The power that US Sailing has is to sanction a YC for not following the rules and disallow a competitors participation in national and international events.
Do you think this is a realistic threat?

(IMO, I don't think they could enforce this penalty but they could make a few high profile examples out of some sailors.)

The multihull council has the backing of the $$$ for the Alter Cup championship... Do we want to leave that $$$ on the table if most of us walk away from US Sailing and build an independent organization.

Do the class leadership have the energy to build a US Multihull organization and what would be it's goals? Do we need a multihull organization?

Assuming the 2012 Olympics are toast...
What could US Sailing do for us multihull sailors to earn our support back?

(IMO, I would insist that US Sailing pay for coaches and their expenses for a series of mulithull clinics throughout the country for junior sailors 21 and under for the 8 years that it will take to rejoin the 3 ring circus.)

Mark


crac.sailregattas.com
Re: U.S. A-Class Association speaks out [Re: Acat230] #143679
05/23/08 12:10 PM
05/23/08 12:10 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 12,310
South Carolina
Jake Offline
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Why is this so difficult?


Jake Kohl
Re: U.S. A-Class Association speaks out [Re: Mark Schneider] #143680
05/23/08 12:18 PM
05/23/08 12:18 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 1,459
Annapolis,MD
Keith Offline
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on the sailing anarchy front page is an article under the heading of "Post of the Week" which details Capron pushing his case for mandatory membership with CBYRA. Very interesting read. For the multi community on the Bay this may put us in an interesting quandary - do we potentially give up the starts we've worked hard to get to make our point with US Sailing? Assuming CBYRA ultimately supports USS...

Last edited by Keith; 05/23/08 12:23 PM.
Re: U.S. A-Class Association speaks out [Re: Keith] #143681
05/23/08 12:39 PM
05/23/08 12:39 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,293
Long Beach, California
John Williams Offline
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Here's a letter from my old fleet on the same subject.

I cannot remember a time when only a handful of people were the focus of such discontent.

Attached Files

John Williams

- The harder you practice, the luckier you get -
Gary Player, pro golfer

After watching Lionel Messi play, I realize I need to sail harder.
Re: U.S. A-Class Association speaks out [Re: John Williams] #143682
05/23/08 12:50 PM
05/23/08 12:50 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 12,310
South Carolina
Jake Offline
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I actually made this for a work situation yesterday...but it seems to apply just as well here.

[Linked Image]

Attached Files
146323-lOGIC.jpg (20 downloads)

Jake Kohl
Re: U.S. A-Class Association speaks out [Re: Jake] #143683
05/23/08 01:02 PM
05/23/08 01:02 PM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 395
LA
Acat230 Offline
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Quote
Why is this so difficult?


Jake,

This is a decision I make on my own in an effort to change what I and others percieve as a chronic lack of respect for the multihull community at the highest levels within US Sailing. I made a very focused effort to contact and engage US Sailing regarding this issue on behalf of the class I represent. US Ssiling's president and its board of directors have chosen not to acknowledge or respond.

Therefore, I see no other way to get their attention than to deny them the use of my membership dues. I believe the USACA will handle a mandatory US Sailing membership requirement for racing in its own way if and when that becomes an issue.

I would appreciate no preaching to me about how I am potentially hurting the Alter Cup or the Junior Multihull Championship. An economic boycott is typically quite effective when change is required and IMO a major change of attitude is long overdue at US Sailing.

In fact, I believe it would send an incredibly strong message to US Sailing if both the 2009 Alter Cup and the 2009 Junior Multihull Sailing Championship were boycotted by the US multihull community.

Bob Hodges

Re: U.S. A-Class Association speaks out [Re: Acat230] #143684
05/23/08 01:48 PM
05/23/08 01:48 PM
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Posts: 12,310
South Carolina
Jake Offline
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Jake  Offline
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Quote
Quote
Why is this so difficult?


Jake,

This is a decision I make on my own in an effort to change what I and others percieve as a chronic lack of respect for the multihull community at the highest levels within US Sailing. I made a very focused effort to contact and engage US Sailing regarding this issue on behalf of the class I represent. US Ssiling's president and its board of directors have chosen not to acknowledge or respond.

Therefore, I see no other way to get their attention than to deny them the use of my membership dues. I believe the USACA will handle a mandatory US Sailing membership requirement for racing in its own way if and when that becomes an issue.

I would appreciate no preaching to me about how I am potentially hurting the Alter Cup or the Junior Multihull Championship. An economic boycott is typically quite effective when change is required and IMO a major change of attitude is long overdue at US Sailing.

In fact, I believe it would send an incredibly strong message to US Sailing if both the 2009 Alter Cup and the 2009 Junior Multihull Sailing Championship were boycotted by the US multihull community.

Bob Hodges


Bob,

I'm sorry - I see that my short reply was easily misinterpreted. That was directed at US Sailing as to why something so simple and so clear is so impossibly difficult (multihulls in the olympics - mandatory membership that affects local organizations). Bob, I have the greatest respect for you and everything you do for multihull sailing and meant you absolutely no disrespect. Though I will continue my US Sailing membership because I believe in the championship that I work for, I do not find any fault in your position.


Jake Kohl
Re: U.S. A-Class Association speaks out [Re: Jake] #143685
05/23/08 03:52 PM
05/23/08 03:52 PM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 395
LA
Acat230 Offline
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Quote


Bob,

I'm sorry - I see that my short reply was easily misinterpreted. That was directed at US Sailing as to why something so simple and so clear is so impossibly difficult (multihulls in the olympics - mandatory membership that affects local organizations). Bob, I have the greatest respect for you and everything you do for multihull sailing and meant you absolutely no disrespect. Though I will continue my US Sailing membership because I believe in the championship that I work for, I do not find any fault in your position.


No worries and I don't do near as much as you and John W do for the multihull community. It has just reached a point where if I ask myself if I am going to pay US Ssiling dues that I cannot justify giving them any more money based on their actions. I know it was pretty radical to suggest the multihull community boycott the Alter Cup and the Junior Champs but wouldn't that get their attention!

Re: U.S. A-Class Association speaks out [Re: Acat230] #143686
05/23/08 05:05 PM
05/23/08 05:05 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 733
Home is where the harness is.....
Will_R Offline
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Home is where the harness is.....
I feel like Bob does in this case. Given their blatent disregard, how else are we supposed to feel? I know a couple of upper level cat sailors (besides Bob) that have made their opinions known to USS.

I worry that we will loose some premier events (alter cup etc) but if that's the only thing we really get event wise, there is not much more to loose. (no offense Jake/JW)

As Kris Kristofferson once said, "Freedom is just another word for nothing left to loose"

Maybe this is just a little freedom.....

Last edited by Will_R; 05/23/08 07:03 PM.
Re: U.S. A-Class Association speaks out [Re: Will_R] #143687
05/23/08 06:38 PM
05/23/08 06:38 PM
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,348
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fin. Offline
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Kris Kristofferson.

Re: U.S. A-Class Association speaks out [Re: fin.] #143688
05/23/08 07:02 PM
05/23/08 07:02 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 733
Home is where the harness is.....
Will_R Offline
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Home is where the harness is.....
Quote
Kris Kristofferson.


damn! I feel like a dolt.

Re: U.S. A-Class Association speaks out [Re: Acat230] #143689
05/23/08 08:41 PM
05/23/08 08:41 PM
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 953
Western Australia
Stewart Offline
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Western Australia
Bob,
I would suggest rather than individuals sending off a letter.. Classes vote for a resolution that in effect gives a "vote of no confidence" in US sailing's ability to provide leadership, handle, promote or market catamaran sailing in USA and or dependencies.

Understanding that it will need to be a vote taken according to your constitutions.

This can then be forwarded to ISAF directly with a "CC" to US sailing asking for ISAF intervention and seeking an alternative to US sailing in USA. I would not send directly to US sailing, and there may be merit in only sending to ISAF and letting them contact US sailing..
Secondarily to this is "national" Cat classes could also send voted no confidence motions. These could also be sent to ISAF asking for leadership in setting up an alternative avenue for saling in USA.

This strategy coming from all "International" Cat classes with arms in USA may be noticed more. If nothing is received from ISAF itself then "upping the ante", one can proceed by the "International" classes for a direct no confidence motion against ISAF itself.

Stewart

Re: U.S. A-Class Association speaks out [Re: Stewart] #143690
05/24/08 10:26 PM
05/24/08 10:26 PM
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,307
Asuncion, Paraguay
Luiz Offline
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Quote
Bob,

This can then be forwarded to ISAF directly with a "CC" to US sailing asking for ISAF intervention...



Case 1: Yacht Club Argentino, which was ISAF MNA at the time (as US Sailing is ISAF MNA for the US), had a fight over the MNA status with the Argentinean Sailing Federation, which is the official branch of the country's Olympic Committee. Both asked for ISAF intervention, etc. ISAF never took party or intervened, just regretted the situation. Things were settled after years (decades?) of political fights, without any action from ISAF.

Case 2: same thing in Paraguay, no action from ISAF, took about three years to settle.

Conclusion: it would be a surprise if ISAF intervenes or takes any action in connection to a country's internal affair.

Still, the suggested actions would help in proportion to the publicity obtained, so it would be more useful to communicate the "votes of no confidence" with copy to the press.


Luiz
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