Forum Index |  Albums |  Classified Ads |  Catamarans For Sale |  Calendar |  Submit Events
Announcements
New Discussions
Adding a Jib to a Mossie
by Gary Fleming. 12/07/17 11:29 PM
F101 finally in production
by Jake. 12/05/17 06:49 PM
Tradewinds Regatta?
by samc99us. 12/05/17 04:30 PM
Easy way to really learn the Racing Rules
by Mike Fahle. 11/28/17 07:30 AM
Dynema trap lines diameter?
by mmadge. 11/25/17 08:10 AM
foiling chasing UFO
by northsea junkie. 11/23/17 03:12 AM
New Mystere 4.3 in Central Florida
by Mike Fahle. 11/22/17 04:46 PM
36th America's Cup
by waterbug_wpb. 11/21/17 12:10 PM
Fatality During Clipper Race
by Redtwin. 11/20/17 07:56 AM
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate This Thread
Hop To
#209423 - 04/24/10 12:55 AM More rules questions...  
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 20
NickoPen Offline
stranger
NickoPen  Offline
stranger

Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 20
SE Qld, Aus.
Hi everyone.

I'm still debating whether to build one of these as I save up the pennies, but have some questions about the rules.

1) Why the detail in the rig restrictions? I like the safety points and luff length restriction, but why then further detail half-mast girth measurements etc when the standard IYRU (now ISAF) sail area measurements take this into account for you and give certainty to how to measure things like tapered masts? I don't want to end up in the situation with a tapered wing mast that measures under IYRU (as the local sailmakers are happy to conform to), but might not measure under these rules due to ambiguity.

2) Did I miss something, or can I put the rudder on a nice gantry, faired into the hull to efectively extend LWL?

3) is the 50kg all up weight still effective - somewhere I read that it might be under review?

As I see it (from the persepective of an old moth and 12ft skiff sailor) there is a lot of room for flexibility in the rules (they are almost as open as A-class!) and I've been doing some sums and can't seem to get a boat I'd really like for under $5k AUD (still using a glass sandwich hull and conservative rig materials!). A fair bit of the cost is in the rig and fitout (about 3.8k). Then on top of this I have to buy a trailer, covers etc... Sure, I can take shortcuts, but I might as well push the rules and make the fastest boat I can.

--Advertisement--
#209424 - 04/24/10 01:03 AM Re: More rules questions... [Re: NickoPen]  
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 20
NickoPen Offline
stranger
NickoPen  Offline
stranger

Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 20
SE Qld, Aus.
Oh, also - the statement about not being able to adjust spreader rake whilst racing - Is there any restriction about changing it whilst on the water? Can I have a system that allows me to capsize and adjust, and then just rely on someone protesting me if they see me doing it whilst racing?

I'm thinking of adjustable spreaders that don't require tools here.

#209462 - 04/24/10 09:51 PM Re: More rules questions... [Re: NickoPen]  
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 1,333
JeffS Offline
veteran
JeffS  Offline
veteran

Joined: May 2006
Posts: 1,333
Kingston SE South Australia
You hit the nail on the head about the rules being the same as A class, I copied the A class rules and modified them to fit F12 in an effort to get my boats built before the kids out grew them, unfortunately my girls got crews and got big before we could tie the rules down but Iím still building one for my young lad. Personally I think if you canít do what you want within the existing rules you canít do it. Youíre welcome to open up the rules for debate if you want with the people that are building them now but the spirit of the rules is really to encourage kids to take up sailing and keep sailing by keeping the boats low in price, accessible to anyone, keeping older ones competitive with new ones and not to grandfather any that are built to the existing rules.
regards


Jeff Southall
Nacra 5.8 1667 Ram Raider
Nacra 18 Square
Taipan 5.7 134
Mosquito 404
Arrow 1576
#209570 - 04/26/10 04:05 PM Re: More rules questions... [Re: JeffS]  
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,305
Luiz Offline
veteran
Luiz  Offline
veteran

Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,305
Asuncion, Paraguay
Originally Posted by JeffS

Personally I think if you canít do what you want within the existing rules you canít do it...

...the spirit of the rules is really to encourage kids to take up sailing and keep sailing by keeping the boats low in price, accessible to anyone...


The spirit of the rule is even more important than the class itself. One may not like the rules but still like the spirit, in which case he will build or buy another cat for his kids. This would not help the F12 class, but would still help catsailing and sailing.


Luiz
#209594 - 04/27/10 05:26 AM Re: More rules questions... [Re: Luiz]  
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 20
NickoPen Offline
stranger
NickoPen  Offline
stranger

Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 20
SE Qld, Aus.
I didn't want to open a can of worms or even change the rules - just wanted to clarify what I could or could not do in a couple of areas that I thought the rules were vague.

I'll apologise for not reading close enough - the gantry issue is already covered (don't know how I missed that one, I'm sure I've read these ten times at least!).

The class is in its infancy, so I don't want to be one of those PITA's who take the literal meaning of every sentence in the rules and then make some weird boat that clearly is out of the intention or spirit of the rules and argue about it. BUT I still think the measurement of sail area for tapered masts needs to be clarified (or just made clear to me!)

I'll assume that the min weight was finalised at 50kg and that the spreader rule is as I described above.

Just to raise another possibly contentious point: any comment on a single equipment/configuration per regatta rule? Its always a nice-to-have to keep costs down.

FYI, I'm building this primarily to introduce my daughter to sailing, but I thought it would be a nice way to introduce myself to catamaran sailing until she gets big enough to start sailing!

#209599 - 04/27/10 05:59 AM Re: More rules questions... [Re: NickoPen]  
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 1,333
JeffS Offline
veteran
JeffS  Offline
veteran

Joined: May 2006
Posts: 1,333
Kingston SE South Australia
Your right about the weight at 50kg, your tapered mast is easy as per the rules just divide it in half, regarding regattas theres a bit to do before we see one in Aus but if there was a regatta I think it should be open to anything that meets F12 measurement such as Arafura Cadets etc to build numbers, I don't think single equipment would help the cause.
regards


Jeff Southall
Nacra 5.8 1667 Ram Raider
Nacra 18 Square
Taipan 5.7 134
Mosquito 404
Arrow 1576
#209601 - 04/27/10 06:03 AM Re: More rules questions... [Re: JeffS]  
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 20
NickoPen Offline
stranger
NickoPen  Offline
stranger

Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 20
SE Qld, Aus.
Sounds good! Just got to build this shed so I can start on the F12. Hopefully I'll have something by Christmas...

I'll keep my eye on here so as to not miss anything.

#209618 - 04/27/10 10:50 AM Re: More rules questions... [Re: NickoPen]  
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,305
Luiz Offline
veteran
Luiz  Offline
veteran

Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,305
Asuncion, Paraguay
Have you choosen a design? There are a few available from great designers for a nominal USD 50 contribution to the class.


Luiz
#209681 - 04/27/10 11:07 PM Re: More rules questions... [Re: NickoPen]  
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 1,333
JeffS Offline
veteran
JeffS  Offline
veteran

Joined: May 2006
Posts: 1,333
Kingston SE South Australia
Thats a coincidence I'm building my new 7.5m x 16m shed at the moment and will get back onto finishing my F12 when its up. What age is your junior sailer?
regards


Jeff Southall
Nacra 5.8 1667 Ram Raider
Nacra 18 Square
Taipan 5.7 134
Mosquito 404
Arrow 1576
#209691 - 04/28/10 04:57 AM Re: More rules questions... [Re: JeffS]  
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 20
NickoPen Offline
stranger
NickoPen  Offline
stranger

Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 20
SE Qld, Aus.
My daughter's 2 at the moment. She should be swim-capable by 4 or so and I'm hoping to let her go solo by around 7 or 8 (judging by the neighbours kids riding bikes etc)... but one thing I've learnt in the last two years is that One should never plan more than 5 minutes in advance.

I am only just 70 kg's so the plan is to build, sail, learn about cats, probably modify the design and re-build in the next few years before she is old enough to decide for herself if she wants to join the fun. Her mum is set on getting her into competitive motorcyling, but that is just a bottomless money pit (yes, even more so than sailing).

On the topic of designs, I am looking at the Tabby at the moment, but will talk to Ncik about modifying the design a bit. I'm happy to go through a few hull iterations over the space of a few years: hulls are the cheap part of small cats/dinghies these days, so if things go well, I hope to be sailing something reasonably refined by the time my daughter's old enough to join in.

I'm happy to donate $50 for a sail number... where is the money going? Is there any activity outside this forum (an official website even)?

On a different note (this post is getting long... sorry) I realised there might be some confusion over what I meant by a "single equipment" rule. I don't mean single manufacturer or design, I was referring to some means to stop people having multiple rigs/foils/whatever that they swap out depending on the conditions on the day. What you rig up on the first day of a regatta should be what you use all regatta, barring accidental failure... Just keeps costs down, although I admit I can't see anyone spending that sort of money on a boat like this (yet).



Moderated by  Damon Linkous 

Search

Who's Online Now
0 registered members (), 17 guests, and 300 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
corrinezhan, pussycatcatman, Shotsailor, PointDume, Winsto
7724 Registered Users
Top Posters(30 Days)
Jake 6
Timbo 3
P.M. 2
Forum Statistics
Forums27
Topics22,268
Posts266,189
Members7,725
Most Online554
May 12th, 2017
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.0
Page Time: 0.008s Queries: 15 (0.002s) Memory: 0.8166 MB (Peak: 0.9947 MB) Zlib enabled. Server Time: 2017-12-13 18:57:54 UTC