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#250671 - 07/10/12 10:46 AM Hobie 16 Hull creak  
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 50
David_Nolte Offline
journeyman
David_Nolte  Offline
journeyman

Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 50
Severna Park, MD
So I got the boat all tuned up the season, had a couple great sails, then the derecho storm June 29 deposited a large limb on my port hull and sidebar. Crunch! I found nearby and bought an oldie (1984) with solid hulls, no soft spots for parts and replaced the hull and side bar. Put it all together, tightened the tramp, and then lifted the hulls to test for stiffness. The boat seems decently stiff, but the "new" port hull creaks whenever I lift and lower it. At first I thought the creak might be the pylon, but it is definitely coming from INSIDE the hull. I talked to someone who just told me that lots of hulls creak, but I am concerned that I cannot see the cause. Does anyone have any knowledge or experience with this? Has the pylon structure possibly separated from the hull inside? Has anyone seen a hull fail for this reason? Thanks for any input.


David Nolte
H16, H14, Nacra 5.0
-- Have You Seen This? --
#251907 - 09/03/12 11:39 PM Re: Hobie 16 Hull creak [Re: David_Nolte]  
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 493
Jeff Peterson Offline
addict
Jeff Peterson  Offline
addict

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 493
Minnesota
Hmm..., no one seem to be answering your question!

I don't have strong expertise with your problem, but if it is creaking, something must be moving, even if just a little. I'd keep sailing it, and see if it stays the same or slowly gets worse. Keep asking the question of other sailors as opportunity allows in the meantime. I have seen the inside of Hobie 16 hulls. If the pylon attachment has a problem you will have to open up the hull to fix it. So if it is a minor annoyance that doesn't get worse, I'd live with it.


Jeff Peterson
H-16 Sail #23721
Big Marine Lake, MN
#252154 - 09/10/12 11:22 AM Re: Hobie 16 Hull creak [Re: David_Nolte]  
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,879
mbounds Offline
Pooh-Bah
mbounds  Offline
Pooh-Bah

Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,879
Detroit, MI
Originally Posted by David_Nolte
Has the pylon structure possibly separated from the hull inside?

Yes.
Originally Posted by David_Nolte
Has anyone seen a hull fail for this reason?

Yes.

Two possible things:
1) The pylon shoe has become detached from the hull skin. You would notice a depression in the deck around the pylon fairing and possibly bulges in the hull sides directly beneath the pylon.
2) The pylon shoe is broken - the sides are still attached to the hull and the creaking you hear is the two halves rubbing against each other. This is most likely what's going on.

The solution involves major surgery - an access port needs to be cut in (behind the pylon is better structurally) and be prepared to be up to your shoulders in glass and epoxy resin as you reinforce the pylon shoe.

Unidirectional carbon fiber tows laid in an "X" pattern across the pylon shoe and along the hulls works well, but it's nasty work.

#252303 - 09/13/12 10:08 PM Re: Hobie 16 Hull creak [Re: mbounds]  
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 493
Jeff Peterson Offline
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Jeff Peterson  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 493
Minnesota
But,if it is just making some light noise and there is no visible distortion, do you think he should fix it now. or wait?


Jeff Peterson
H-16 Sail #23721
Big Marine Lake, MN
#252763 - 09/26/12 11:40 AM Re: Hobie 16 Hull creak [Re: Jeff Peterson]  
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,879
mbounds Offline
Pooh-Bah
mbounds  Offline
Pooh-Bah

Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,879
Detroit, MI
It's not going to get better by itself, and it will get worse. Maybe much, much worse.

You don't have to fix it now if you're not going to sail the boat, but you need to fix this before sailing the boat again.

#252920 - 10/01/12 05:44 PM Re: Hobie 16 Hull creak [Re: mbounds]  
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 1,252
mmiller Offline
veteran
mmiller  Offline
veteran

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 1,252
California
One source of creaks is sidebars in corner castings. That can transmit sound and maybe ... just maybe down into the hull? We suggest beveling the ends of sidebars and lubricating them. This is a bigger issue with french made corner castings for some reason. Harder anodize maybe. But as Matt Bounds says... if it's broken fix it before sailing. Even a short distance out in the water can cause big issues if the hull fails. Not worth it.


Hobie Cat Forums
Matt Miller
Hobie Cat Company
#253018 - 10/02/12 10:27 PM Re: Hobie 16 Hull creak [Re: mmiller]  
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 493
Jeff Peterson Offline
addict
Jeff Peterson  Offline
addict

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 493
Minnesota
At this point, I think you need someone else to listen to your "creak". Are you excessively worring about a very small noise, that others would hardly be concerned about? The folks that are "beaching" your boat, might have another opinion, if they actually heard the noise. (My boat creaks occationally, but I know its the sidebar/corner joints.) Get a firsthand experienced opinion from another sailor, before drawing any desperate conclusions.


Jeff Peterson
H-16 Sail #23721
Big Marine Lake, MN
#266483 - 10/25/13 10:45 AM Re: Hobie 16 Hull creak [Re: David_Nolte]  
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 50
David_Nolte Offline
journeyman
David_Nolte  Offline
journeyman

Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 50
Severna Park, MD
Thanks for all the replies, sorry I have been out of touch for awhile. I actually have sailed the boat several times since the post and have not heard any more creaking. I will check it out again on land now and also be very attuned to it when things warm up here again in the spring. Thanks.


David Nolte
H16, H14, Nacra 5.0
#266539 - 10/28/13 11:19 PM Re: Hobie 16 Hull creak [Re: David_Nolte]  
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 493
Jeff Peterson Offline
addict
Jeff Peterson  Offline
addict

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 493
Minnesota
Keep us up to date on this story.

My theory, at this point, is that your new hull from a different boat, has now worn in to the rest of your original boat. If true, then it must have been an aluminum rubbing on aluminum noise. The posts could be slightly out of position from your old hulls, which slightly changed how all the aluminum parts fit together. Once a little wear occurred, it quieted down. Of course, theory is not necessarily fact; so stay a little weary, until the boat proves itself.


Jeff Peterson
H-16 Sail #23721
Big Marine Lake, MN
#268740 - 01/23/14 06:15 PM Re: Hobie 16 Hull creak [Re: mmiller]  
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 5
Psychomn1 Offline
stranger
Psychomn1  Offline
stranger

Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 5
Oregon
This brings up a question that I had about how stiff should the boat be. Specifically, should I be trying to shim the corner casting to hull strut joint to eliminate movement or is a little bit desirable. My boat is a late seventies H16. The frame is very rigid with the trampoline on but there is a very little bit of motion between the frame corners and hull struts.

#270477 - 03/20/14 06:10 PM Re: Hobie 16 Hull creak [Re: Psychomn1]  
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 865
samc99us Offline
old hand
samc99us  Offline
old hand

Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 865
Solomon's Island, MD
Originally Posted by Psychomn1
This brings up a question that I had about how stiff should the boat be. Specifically, should I be trying to shim the corner casting to hull strut joint to eliminate movement or is a little bit desirable. My boat is a late seventies H16. The frame is very rigid with the trampoline on but there is a very little bit of motion between the frame corners and hull struts.


Stiffer the platform the better if you're racing. If not, meh.

Look at the A's, they get rid of as much slop as physically possible. Flex is energy lost.

Last edited by samc99us; 03/20/14 06:15 PM.

F18 Infusion
#270746 - 03/27/14 08:46 AM Re: Hobie 16 Hull creak [Re: David_Nolte]  
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 3,927
brucat Offline
Carpal Tunnel
brucat  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 3,927
Ditto...

If racing, all slop is bad. But, it's a Hobie 16, and there's only so far you can go due to the design. It's almost impossible, even with a glued boat, not to have at least some amount of independence visible as the bows travel across the water, particularly if it's rough.

If not racing, slop is bad if it leads to further damage. You don't want the boat to be wearing itself out as parts rub together. If you see movement, it is best to try to reduce or eliminate it, so that you don't wear away material that may be difficult or impossible to repair without major work or expense.

Hope this helps.

Mike

#273943 - 07/16/14 03:34 AM Re: Hobie 16 Hull creak [Re: David_Nolte]  
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 2
luojie Offline
stranger
luojie  Offline
stranger

Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 2
should I be trying to Aion Kinah[/url] shim the corner casting to hull strut joint to eliminate movement or is a little bit desirable. My boat is a late seventies H16. The frame is very rigid with the trampoline on but there is a very little bit of motion between the frame corners and hull struts.

Last edited by RickWhite; 07/30/15 11:59 AM.

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