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36th America's Cup
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Re: 35th America's Cup [Re: David Parker] #286956
06/01/17 12:00 PM
06/01/17 12:00 PM
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Spectators in Bermuda will get a decent show today with winds at 265


Philip
USA #1006
-- Have You Seen This? --
Re: 35th America's Cup [Re: P.M.] #286957
06/01/17 12:45 PM
06/01/17 12:45 PM
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I almost laughed out loud when they said FRA was "STRUGGLING" at 17knots boatspeed in 8 knots of TWS

Sure, they were dragging compared to JPN, but sh*t.... 17kts in 8? a tough problem to have


Jay

Re: 35th America's Cup [Re: David Parker] #286958
06/01/17 01:02 PM
06/01/17 01:02 PM
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NZ just sailed a leg 4.5 times wind speed. BAR clearly brought the wrong set up.


Philip
USA #1006
Re: 35th America's Cup [Re: David Parker] #286959
06/01/17 01:11 PM
06/01/17 01:11 PM
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I thought that race from France was a blowout, but I think Ainsle has set the bar, behind by almost a full LAP when NZL finished! They didn't appear to actually finish, did they have a breakdown?

Mike

Re: 35th America's Cup [Re: waterbug_wpb] #286960
06/01/17 01:12 PM
06/01/17 01:12 PM
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Originally Posted by waterbug_wpb
I almost laughed out loud when they said FRA was "STRUGGLING" at 17knots boatspeed in 8 knots of TWS

Sure, they were dragging compared to JPN, but sh*t.... 17kts in 8? a tough problem to have


Todd Harris: "Hey Ken, Todd here, I'm on assignment covering extreme snake wrangling in Sri Lanka. I'll be there next week. Make sure you cover for me and say completely stupid stuff as we don't know what the hell we are talking about."

Ken Read: "Hey Todd, I got it covered. Pycho-babbling as we speak . . ."


Philip
USA #1006
Re: 35th America's Cup [Re: brucat] #286961
06/01/17 01:16 PM
06/01/17 01:16 PM
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Originally Posted by brucat
I thought that race from France was a blowout, but I think Ainsle has set the bar, behind by almost a full LAP when NZL finished! They didn't appear to actually finish, did they have a breakdown?

Mike


They asked RC to retire. Clearly had a problem when they rounded the mark, but Dip Schit Read missed it.


Philip
USA #1006
Re: 35th America's Cup [Re: David Parker] #286962
06/01/17 01:38 PM
06/01/17 01:38 PM
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Barker just schooled JS


Philip
USA #1006
Re: 35th America's Cup [Re: David Parker] #286963
06/01/17 01:52 PM
06/01/17 01:52 PM
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Slingsby read and called a great shift on leg 5. Brilliant


Philip
USA #1006
Re: 35th America's Cup [Re: P.M.] #286964
06/01/17 02:59 PM
06/01/17 02:59 PM
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Originally Posted by P.M.


From America’s Cup Hall of Famer, Mike Drummond – the former Team NZ navigator

"What will the defender achieve from racing with the challengers

Fraternizing with the enemy is no longer a sin in the America’s Cup. Controversially including the defender in the challenger fray - for the first time in 166 years - will definitely benefit Oracle.

First and foremost, they will have gleaned plenty of knowledge of the challengers, and learned much about how their own boat races, before they take a vital two weeks off to perfect “17” for the Cup proper.

But they also want the one point that’s up for grabs, which translates into the first win in the America’s Cup match. Should it be a challenger who tops the qualifier series ending on Sunday, they will have to proceed to the Cup match to make the point count.

The next few days are important for Oracle. They will want to deny Team NZ that prized point. “But it’s just as important for them to learn as much as they can, from sailing against strong opposition.”

Oracle are no mugs – and they have sharp memories of the last Cup where they never stopped developing and improving."

Cup Hall of Famer answers the big questions


It's hard to disagree with the points he brings up. Added to which, I believe I saw where Oracle was running to different port and starboard daggerboard foils on either side of their boat two days ago presumably to test which ones performed better in the same conditions. Their risk/reward formula is a lot different than the other teams in this round robin series.

I'm still not totally against the defender getting to partake in the round robin but it's hard for me not to have a tinge of bias. Besides my obvious regional bias, this defender has had the vision and insistence to beat back a lot of opposition to the entire idea of multihulls in the America's Cup and has brought us these incredible boats.

Lastly, I suspect that most teams have kept some developmental things out of sight and off the water. This isn't just a day to day race on the water. Also key is the pace to your development because development WILL happen as the race progresses. You need to peak with that development at the right time in order to win the cup. Peak too early, as New Zealand did in the last iteration, and your competition has a chance to discover, develop, and catch you. Peak too late, and well, it's over before it starts. Rest assured, these boats will continue to get faster and faster.


Jake Kohl
Re: 35th America's Cup [Re: P.M.] #286965
06/01/17 03:33 PM
06/01/17 03:33 PM
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Originally Posted by P.M.
Originally Posted by brucat
I thought that race from France was a blowout, but I think Ainsle has set the bar, behind by almost a full LAP when NZL finished! They didn't appear to actually finish, did they have a breakdown?

Mike


They asked RC to retire. Clearly had a problem when they rounded the mark, but Dip Schit Read missed it.

As stated in the interview, Sir Ben said they had a systems failure and could not control the daggerboard


Philip
USA #1006
Re: 35th America's Cup [Re: David Parker] #286966
06/01/17 03:40 PM
06/01/17 03:40 PM
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Philip
USA #1006
Re: 35th America's Cup [Re: P.M.] #286967
06/01/17 04:01 PM
06/01/17 04:01 PM
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Maybe we need Jobson back. I don't recall Kenny making so many odd comments last time, Jobson had the market cornered.

Mike

Re: 35th America's Cup [Re: David Parker] #286968
06/01/17 04:07 PM
06/01/17 04:07 PM
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I'm trying to watch replays, as I missed everything after the second race today. I'm viewing on the NBCSN site on a PC. It SUCKS that you're forced to watch 3+ minutes of commercials every time you try to click ahead in the replay!

Mike

Re: 35th America's Cup [Re: brucat] #286969
06/01/17 04:08 PM
06/01/17 04:08 PM
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Originally Posted by brucat
I'm trying to watch replays, as I missed everything after the second race today. I'm viewing on the NBCSN site on a PC. It SUCKS that you're forced to watch 3+ minutes of commercials every time you try to click ahead in the replay!

Mike



but it's free, so.....


Jay

Re: 35th America's Cup [Re: David Parker] #286970
06/01/17 04:13 PM
06/01/17 04:13 PM
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I can't wait to see all the tech that is spawned at the conclusion of the AC cup and the 'secrets' are revealed.

The Phadeo program seems amped up on foils for the most part and they're sending it... Ofshore even...

How is the Phantom F18 foiler doing?

Did I read the next generation G4 cat has some of this hydro adjusting foil tech already?

Did the UFO foiling cat get under production?


And I know Jake's already trying to hack ENTZ database to copy their carbon layup schedule on the foil package.... wink


Jay

Re: 35th America's Cup [Re: David Parker] #286971
06/01/17 05:03 PM
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NYYC says they're going to buy drone marks, mostly because they can, I'd imagine.

For a slow race, that GBR/FRA race was a nail-biter! Cammas late to the entry didn't help, but he made a great recovery on the first reach. Ainsle got a better shift/puff on the top half of the last beat, and positioned himself well to take full advantage and win. I'm sure luck was a major factor, though.

Mike

Re: 35th America's Cup [Re: P.M.] #286972
06/02/17 03:08 AM
06/02/17 03:08 AM
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Originally Posted by P.M.

As stated in the interview, Sir Ben said they had a systems failure and could not control the daggerboard

Do you think they would have asked the RC to abandon the race if they were a lap in front? confused
IMHO Ben's gybing was the only failure cool

Was a bit disappointed that the French did win the last race against BAR, they sailed a better race.

Re: 35th America's Cup [Re: Tony_F18] #286973
06/02/17 07:16 AM
06/02/17 07:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Tony_F18
Originally Posted by P.M.

As stated in the interview, Sir Ben said they had a systems failure and could not control the daggerboard

Do you think they would have asked the RC to abandon the race if they were a lap in front? confused
IMHO Ben's gybing was the only failure cool

Was a bit disappointed that the French did win the last race against BAR, they sailed a better race.


Agree with your first point, GBR totally blew that first gybe, and in the light air, got themselves way behind. But, Ainsle looked morally defeated as it quickly became obvious that they couldn't get back onto the foils, and I think he gave up on the race at that point.

I too wanted Cammas to win, but he didn't sail a better match race, IMHO (it ain't over till it's over, and you can only get one point or zero). He was late for his port entry, and missed some key shifts and pressure changes late in the race. He then set himself up on port for the final cross at the finish line.

I would agree that he generally appeared to do a better job of sailing the cat in "displacement mode" (apparently, this is the new code for FLOATING on a foiling boat)...

Mike

Re: 35th America's Cup [Re: waterbug_wpb] #286974
06/02/17 09:05 AM
06/02/17 09:05 AM
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Jake Offline
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Originally Posted by waterbug_wpb


And I know Jake's already trying to hack ENTZ database to copy their carbon layup schedule on the foil package.... wink


Nah. I'm staying out of all this foiling business until things calm the heck down. I don't need that much more frustration in my life and am happy working on the finer details of rigging/sailing at the moment.


Jake Kohl
Great sailors - abysmal reporters [Re: David Parker] #286975
06/02/17 09:06 AM
06/02/17 09:06 AM
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Hillsborough, NC USA
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Isotope235 Offline
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Great racing so far, and the trends have really begun to emerge.

Dean Barker is the epitome of grace and sportsmanship. He never whines and he never gloats -- even though he probably has the most right of any skipper here to do both.

Frank Cammas keeps putting on a good face, even though it was obvious from the outset that the Groupama boat simply doesn't foil as well as the others.

Nathan Outteridge must be supremely frustrated. Artemis is sailing much better than the results indicate, but they seem to wind up on the wrong side of most setup choices, close calls, and wind shifts. Other teams are able to capitalize on SWE's mistakes, but SWE can't capitalize on theirs.

Peter Burling is learning to present a modest image and is now coming across very well. Couple that with Emirates' outstanding performance so far and it's difficult to imagine them not coming out on top. Team NZL's boat has consistently been the fastest and their boathandling is unmatched.

Jimmy Spithill is doing a great PR job. He's consistently unassuming, positive, and likeable. On the course, Oracle has made many mistakes but has always stayed in the game. Team USA has been lucky with their comebacks so far though. They aren't as dominant as their score might indicate. I'm sure the team must be very worried about NZL.

Ben Ainslie is looking defeated. His many mistakes and Land Rover BAR's inability to foil in light wind have taken their toll. GBR is not as competitive as they were in the ACWS.

All in all, the racing has been very exciting, and I'm looking forward to seeing more.

I wish I could say the same about the reporting. The America's Cup is the pinnacle of our sport -- it's a shame that we can only get second-rate reporters. TV coverage has been lackluster, focusing on images of teams grinding, people running across the trampoline, and the foil tips. They often fail to show the positions of the boats on the racecourse, and usually miss the reasons for lead changes. Gone are the explanations of the course, the rules, and the tactics that made the last America's Cup understandable to the public.

The post-race interviews, videos, and press releases are amateurish. The only recaps worth reading come from Paul Cayard, and they are dry, dry, dry. The skipper press conference reporters ask fluff questions and never follow up - or are pushing their own agendas. The photos and videos are low in production quality. Yesterday, reporting sank to a new low with allegations of race fixing. One of the reporters had the gall to ask Dean Barker if he intentionally threw the race so that USA could win an AC point. Richard Gladwell (Sail World's AC reporter), who has always been biased for New Zealand, repeated the charge in his article, and went on to say that it looked to him like Softbank JPN intentionally chose the wrong side of the racecourse at Oracles "team order". Such unfounded accusations of cheating are appallingly unprofessional. Personally, as someone who believes that sportsmanship is a fundamental tenet of sailboat racing, I find it offensive.

I think Sail-World.com is past due for a new reporter.

Sadly,
Eric

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