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#90235 - 11/29/06 04:29 PM Re: New boat pics - image intensive (ish) [Re: pdwarren]  
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scooby_simon Offline
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That's very cool Simon - looking forward to seeing it in the flesh. We should try and get a decent F16 turn-out on at least one of the winter warm-up weekends at Datchet (10th/11th Feb or 17th/18th Feb). Can we tempt you?

I'm impressed that you've got the control lines tidied and sorted before the boat's even hit the water. I've had the Blade 8 months and have only just sorted out the mast rotation - have made the line continuous, and so far it's working well...

I'll be interested in how the downhaul tidying works - how much elastic have you got under the tramp? In the past I've doubles the downhaul round a block so that 1" of elastic pulls 2" of rope.

Paul


Maybe on the Feb races at Datchet - but it's filppin cold that time of year !

Not 100% sure lines are in the right places yet, might need longer DH rope as I have a 12:1 and also not sure the rotation is quite right - test it and see.

Still need to sort out how the Kite Up/down will flow and I have not tied off the Spi pole bridals yet as there was too much wind (and too little time) to put the kite up today. Also need to put the mainsail up and sort out battens. Hopeing for a chance to sail on Saturday.


F16 - GBR 553 - SOLD

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#90236 - 11/30/06 12:47 AM Re: New boat pics - image intensive (ish) [Re: scooby_simon]  
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Berny Offline
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Where does that spanner line go after it goes back under the tramp?

#90237 - 11/30/06 02:13 AM Re: New boat pics - image intensive (ish) [Re: scooby_simon]  
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johnfullerton Offline
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johnfullerton  Offline
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Geneva, Switzerland
Hi


The downhaul is a one rope system if I remember right.
I think you just got it pulled to much to one side.

I only had a couple of goes on mine before I put it away for the winter. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

So I did these drawing of the ropes.
[img]https://sam.home.cern.ch/sam/sail/stealth/downhaul.bmp[/img]
[img]https://sam.home.cern.ch/sam/sail/stealth/kite1.bmp[/img]
[img]https://sam.home.cern.ch/sam/sail/stealth/kite2.bmp[/img]


Bye


Sarah and John
Stealth 551
RS400 871
#90238 - 11/30/06 12:12 PM Re: New boat pics - image intensive (ish) [Re: Berny]  
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scooby_simon Offline
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Where does that spanner line go after it goes back under the tramp?


to the side where the block on the tramp eye is.


F16 - GBR 553 - SOLD

I also talk sport here
#90239 - 12/02/06 01:40 PM Re: New boat pics - image intensive (ish) [Re: scooby_simon]  
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Mainsail up:

[Linked Image]

The daggerboard you can see is in so that the bottom of the plate is at the bottom of the hull to give some idea of the depth of the plates.

First sail today in about a F2-3.

Initial impressions are that the boat picks up very well in the gusts (it is considerably lighter than the 17), but the boat also feels very stiff. The boat tacks VERY quickly compared with the 17 (long thin plates must help alot) and I could only get one fully down today as they must be slightly different widths - must take some of the packing off the inside of one dagger slot.

Mainsail looks very good, twists off very well (in the small gusts today) and the kite looks very different when sailng to the 17 kite.

This kite is VERY easy to oversheet and so I'm going to need to be very carefull. Boat tracks well upwind, but I need to move the mast back a little (more rake) as there is not much feel.

Had a good sail around the lake on all points of sail and it all appears to work (telescopic tiller came apart at sone stage, so I need to talk to John to make sure it does not happen again !) Rigging has already streached a little !

Did some wiring with the kite up as well and now decided I need longer kite sheets.

The Ratchamatic mainsheet blocks are a very nice touch too.

Overall a good days first sail and givcen it was only F2-3 was quict pleased to see my GPS give a Max speed of 16.1kts and a few plots at around 17mph.

Just need to sort a few niggles out and get down to some serious sailing over the winter.

(Rolf, Spi pictures to come once I get a day when there is light enough wind to fly the kite.


F16 - GBR 553 - SOLD

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#90240 - 12/02/06 06:32 PM Re: New boat pics - image intensive (ish) [Re: scooby_simon]  
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Mark P Offline
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Mumbles Y.C Wales U.K
Mast rake with the big square tops? I'm still experimenting; From my experienence you don't need alot if any. I know it's early days but did you FEEL the F16?


MP*MULTIHULLS
#90241 - 12/03/06 03:41 AM Re: New boat pics - image intensive (ish) [Re: Mark P]  
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scooby_simon Offline
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Mast rake with the big square tops? I'm still experimenting; From my experienence you don't need alot if any. I know it's early days but did you FEEL the F16?


I don't really know what to be aiming at for rake. Currently 4th hole from the top on the chain plates as a guess after rigging at John's a lot lower, John said "that looks like too much" so we guessed at 4. It's not enought as there is not much feel going upwind. Going to move down to 6th hole and see how that goes.

As far as feel goes, it feels good. Picks up well in the gusts, drives nicely with the kite up and all the systems (except one plate not fitting in the slot) all work well, boat points well even with only 1 1/2 plates down. Mast rotation feels simple and efficient. 12:1 DH works well (yet to sail when I was needing to pull on hard and then let all the way off, so we'll see if I go back to 8:1 or not). Mainsheet system is very good and the Ratchamatic is very nice, don't like the actaul rope so I'll be changing this today. Not sure I've got the Kite sheeting angle in the right place, but I'll let everything bed down before I start putting more holes in the boat. Not planning to sail today as I'm off swimming with my son (and it's blocking dogs off leads here as well).


F16 - GBR 553 - SOLD

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#90242 - 12/03/06 04:07 AM You are an F16 sailor now, Welcome to the ... [Re: scooby_simon]  
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Wouter Offline
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You are truly an F16 sailor now, Simon, welcome to the club !

May the winds and boat smile on you each time you go out.

Best of enjoyment,

Wouter


Wouter Hijink
Formula 16 NED 243 (one-off; homebuild)
The Netherlands
#90243 - 12/03/06 04:33 AM Re: You are an F16 sailor now, Welcome to the ... [Re: Wouter]  
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Simon, good to hear you are enjoying the Stealth. I am colleting my new one on boxing day so have been interested in your progress. Maybe we should try and organise an F16 fun sail just before the new year? Compare notes and riggind etc. Anyone up for a day at Datchet an about 30th December or therabouts?

#90244 - 12/03/06 11:12 AM Re: You are an F16 sailor now, Welcome to the ... [Re: davidtugwell]  
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scooby_simon Offline
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Simon, good to hear you are enjoying the Stealth. I am colleting my new one on boxing day so have been interested in your progress. Maybe we should try and organise an F16 fun sail just before the new year? Compare notes and riggind etc. Anyone up for a day at Datchet an about 30th December or therabouts?


Boxingday, that's a flippin long drive after Xmas lunch ! Hopefully the roads will be quiet. You going down and Back in the day ? I assume yours is No 554 ?

I assume you are not having Carbon Beams ?

Grafham Grand Prix. Saturday 30th Dec. First start 11.00 (I think).

That is where I'll be.

Did not get the mast rake done today, done some work on the plates and hopefully the one that did not fit now will.


F16 - GBR 553 - SOLD

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#90245 - 12/03/06 03:14 PM Re: New boat pics - image intensive (ish) [Re: scooby_simon]  
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ejpoulsen Offline
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Why are the boards so long?


Eric Poulsen
A-class USA 203
Ultimate 20
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#90246 - 12/04/06 03:57 AM Re: New boat pics - image intensive (ish) [Re: ejpoulsen]  
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Codblow Offline
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couldn't resist it
I imagine Scooby has balanced the extra efficiency against the schrs handicap hit * worthwhile, similarily with the longer luffed and more efficient jib he plans to use ,
though I assume when racing in F16 he will be in class rules and no penalty there . There's lenghty debate on
board ratios somewhere in this forum .



* I vaguely remebember when kicking formula about myself , you could get long boards if skinny enough for no relative penalty .

Though I assume he intends to race within F16 class this shouldn't be a concern.

Last edited by Codblow; 12/04/06 04:15 AM.
#90247 - 12/04/06 04:20 AM Re: New boat pics - image intensive (ish) [Re: Codblow]  
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Wouter Offline
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Quote

I imagine Scooby has balanced the extra efficiency against the schrs handicap hit.



If he is smart then he would have done that. I remember him seeing that the aspect ratio is probably 5 and that is the way these boards look. But SCHRS handicap rating is not everything. There are downsides to using very long boards and I mean in the performance department. Such disadvantages may not be reflected in the calculated SCHRS number.

Wouter

Last edited by Wouter; 12/04/06 09:37 AM.

Wouter Hijink
Formula 16 NED 243 (one-off; homebuild)
The Netherlands
#90248 - 12/04/06 05:31 AM Re: New boat pics - image intensive (ish) [Re: scooby_simon]  
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Dermot Offline
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Dublin, Ireland
Congratulations Simon !
Looking at the side on view of your Stealth, a question comes to mind: You have lowered the bridle fixing points on the hulls to accommodate the long luff jib, but the spinnaker pole seems quite high, will this be a problem when you get your jib kit ? Or does the pole just seem high because the cat is on its wheels.


Dermot
Catapult 265
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#90249 - 12/04/06 06:15 AM Re: New boat pics - image intensive (ish) [Re: Dermot]  
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pdwarren Offline
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I was wondering the same thing. The pole does look a little higher than on the Blade: http://www.formula16.org/component/optio...ageViewsIndex=1

I can't really see how your pole is mounted to the bridles, but it looks pretty close to where the bridles meet, whereas on the Blade it's about a foot below that (with a compression strut to lower the tack of the jib).

I don't really know the pros and cons of pole height, but my instinct is that you want it as low as possible to reduce the heeling force for a given sail power.

Paul

#90250 - 12/04/06 03:19 PM Re: New boat pics - image intensive (ish) [Re: pdwarren]  
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scooby_simon Offline
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Re the plates.

Yes They are longer than is normal, having sailed the inter 17 (which also has long plates) I decided that long plates were worth expirementing with - If at a later date I feel they are too long, I can always get the hack saw out. As for SCHRS, the rule currently only hits plates up to a certain aspect ratio. I agree that I'll need to be raising them when it's windy (and also light), but I'll live with that for now.

Quote
Looking at the side on view of your Stealth, a question comes to mind: You have lowered the bridle fixing points on the hulls to accommodate the long luff jib, but the spinnaker pole seems quite high, will this be a problem when you get your jib kit ? Or does the pole just seem high because the cat is on its wheels.


Bridal position is the standard for the 2006 boat.

Pole was just "thrown on" so I could go sailing, it will be dropping a fair bit more On Friday. not sure how-low-to-go, so I shall drop it so it's another 100mm lower and see how that is.


F16 - GBR 553 - SOLD

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#90251 - 12/04/06 03:32 PM Re: New boat pics - image intensive (ish) [Re: scooby_simon]  
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Wouter Offline
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Wouter  Offline
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Pretty much the rule of thumb I use with respect to pole height is that the setup needs to be in the windshadow of the luff hull when that hull is just kissing the water. I "feel" that this is more efficient aerodynamically them having the snuffer setup stick out above the hull and thus increase surface area.

Apart from that a lower pole allows a longer luffed spi and that is always more efficient. But the pole should not be so low that its tip will hit the water when the bows dive down. I think on my boat this means that my spi pole tip is 450 mm above the horizontal line coming off the bows.

Wouter


Wouter Hijink
Formula 16 NED 243 (one-off; homebuild)
The Netherlands
#90252 - 12/04/06 04:13 PM Re: New boat pics - image intensive (ish) [Re: Wouter]  
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scooby_simon Offline
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Apart from that a lower pole allows a longer luffed spi and that is always more efficient. But the pole should not be so low that its tip will hit the water when the bows dive down. I think on my boat this means that my spi pole tip is 450 mm above the horizontal line coming off the bows.

Wouter


I asssume that is the tip of the pole Wouter ?


F16 - GBR 553 - SOLD

I also talk sport here
#90253 - 12/04/06 04:52 PM Re: New boat pics - image intensive (ish) [Re: scooby_simon]  
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GeoffS Offline
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Atlanta
Quote
...having sailed the inter 17 (which also has long plates)...


FYI: The Inter 17 plates got shorter. PC even provided a template for cutting existing boards. See attached figure.

http://www.nacraclass.com/northamerica/dagger_mod.jpg

Attached Files
92147-dagger_mod.jpg (179 downloads)
#90254 - 12/15/06 08:37 AM Re: New boat pics - image intensive (ish) [Re: scooby_simon]  
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Mark P Offline
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Mark P  Offline
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Mumbles Y.C Wales U.K
Having scrutinised the photo's for an unhealthy amount of time , i) how have you run the kite downhaul ii) where have you attached the end of the snuffer iii) two rachet blocks for each kite sheet (you poof) wont this be annoying in light winds iv) what's your mainsheet purchase v) are there going to be any more photo's/sailing reports.
I will be checking the Grafham website over the Christmas period for your results!!( I can't bear to watch the Wizard of Oz again)


MP*MULTIHULLS
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