Whats missing here?

Why no C class chatter?

Big discussion on Sailinganarchy. http://www.sailinganarchy.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=27245


Why so few A cat sailors speaking up?

Why so many F18, F16, Nacra, Hobie fans but not alot of other catamaran opinions/discussions?

I agree with you Bill, it's a shame we're not getting the 'C' discussion here. I've been following it on SA and have to say it looks to me that there may be a resurgence of interest in the 'C's again (and very welcome too!)

I remember the early C class races at Thorpe Bay in Essex when I was a mere nipper! Boats like Lady Helmsman, Snark, Opus and Miss Nylex. Wonderful boats, exciting to watch (even better to sail I would guess).

It's a travesty that the yachting media haven't started drumming things up yet. I hope that they jump on the bandwagon soon......

In Toronto a local sailor has bought a C class..Patient Lady VI and is giving a seminar tomorrow night for us. Should be good.

http://www.cat-alist.com/notices/2006/c_class_022806.pdf

probably because the C class is far from "working class" or corinthian.

Its hard for me to relate to sailing at that level of $$$.

So we should change the name of this forum to "Working Class Catamaran sailor?"

I just think that its a shame that for some reason this forum is avoided by some very bright, interesting people that are in the catsailing world. We could all learn volumes if Steve or guys like him attended these discussions.

Its not just the C Class, this forum doesnt seem to get much input from the A class world either. Bob Hodges posts our of courtesy, but most of those discussions go on elsewhere.

Bill

OK I'll bite. some of you know my handle from SA and some don't. For those that don't I'm on the Toronto C-class team.

We've been at it now for over a year and are making some good progress and learning a lot about the boats and the technology.

For those that don't know we have designed and are presently building a new boat. This followed the aquisition of Patient Lady VI by Fred, the team captain, last year.

So we've had some good on the water experiences and incorporated those learnings into our deign build process.

I'll answer any reasonable questions about the boat and the campaign etc, but I won't answer every question for a bunch of reasons, not being rude, simply prudent.

Cheers

Good to have you here! Remember, this is not SA...things are usually a bit more calm around here. Could you just keep us updated on your progress? I'm sure Rick and Mary would welcome any submissions for Catsailor Magazine (the printed version).

This is a coastal beachcat centric forum. It's eighteen feet or less at the local beach. Global multihull news is not widely followed here. It's a mystery.

Welcome aboard Blunted. I seem to remember an article about C Class in Sailing World last year sometime. Are they raced anywhere other than at the Little America's Cup (or whatever they call it now)? The big scene for them is Rhode Island right? People say they're expensive - how much did this guy pay for Patient Lady? Are they more or less expensive than a Volvo 40?

Are you chumming for sharks!?

The reason it is a mystery is not because there is no general interest about the C-Class. It is because there has been a media blackout on the C-Class for several years. They no longer seem to have a class association (if they ever did), and they are no longer an ISAF International Class, so they do not get publicity through the ISAF Newsletters.

It has always been like a treasure hunt to find out who is working on developing a C-Class cat for an "International" championship, which they are no longer "allowed" to have, as far as ISAF is concerned.

Apparently, no sailors were sanctioned (punished) by ISAF after participating in the last International C-Class Championship in 2004. But, you just never know when ISAF is going to come down with a heavy hand. And that makes it more difficult to get top sailors to participate in an event that might cost them their rights to sail in the Olympics and Pan-American Games and ISAf World events.

None of it makes sense to me.

Well thanks for the welcome.

As for ISAF? Well I think we'd all call it the intergalactic championship if need be, who cares really. It's more important to have other guys show up and race and have fun, even if it's a pretty far corner of the sport.

So why have we not all heard more in the recent past from the C-class itself. A couple reasons that Steve Clark would be far better positioned to speak on but consider the following.

1.It's a small group in the world to start with that would consider getting together to design, build and then sail some really advanced technology like these boats.

2. It's not cheap by any means to play in this game these days. You can make up for many dollars with a lot of hard work but it costs you time. That and you need to have people on the team who happen to know a lot about things like aerodynamics, composite construction etc. If you don;t have those volunteers you need to pay the pros to do those bits which can add up fast, very fast.

3. Steve Clark and the Cogito team presently sit at the top of the ladder, by many steps over the nearest competition right now. The Aussie YP team was close but has recently been focused on the 50 knot barrier. In fact cogito's domination has been so complete as to be a deterent to some people getting into the game. You have to see their boat up close to understand how awesome it is. Every last imaginable detail has been really sorted out to weigh nothing and be strong and reliable. This is built on a collective experince of something like 80 years of C-class campaigning by his team.

After the cogito team beat the Aussies ten years ago, the wheels fell off the class a bit. There had been a lot of campaigns that came up with a far out idea that did not go too far and that ultimately dulled interest i think, perhaps too much risk of big failure.

So Steve has essentially BEEN the class for the last however many years. He has been working to get people into the class but again, you don't just put up a booth at the local boat show and try to sign people up.

To Steve's credit he has made a great deal of information about cogito available to any team that asks in essence to allow some catch up time for the rest of the world. A voluntary freeze on development as well on his part to encourage more people to get back into the game.

As for who is working on it these days.

Right now:
Canadian team, that's us in Toronto
US Team, Cogito, Bristol RI
Aussie team, Perth Australia
Aussie Yellow Pages team, Australia, inactive at present
British team, Invictus, UK

There could be more out there but we don't know about them right now.

As for cost: Well PL VI I think went for the cost of 3 new Inter 20's maybe?? Don't know for sure. and a new boat... Mutiply by about 5 to 8 times that again depending on what you're doing with the boat etc.

So you may say, OK that's pretty expensive and you're right it is. Especially when you consider we almost always have a tender riding shotgun with us and storage for the wing requires a 50 foot long tent. things like that take it to a whole other level of sailing. It's much more like a "big boat" campaign.

As for the boat, it's awesome to sail. I used to sail Tornados a lot and this boat is on another level. Going upwind all the time at 12 knots and reaching at 12-20 knots in 10 knots of breeze is awesome. The boat feels really smooth and is very quiet as the wing never luffs pops or even moans at all. With assymetric boards not only do you do 12 knots uphill but you climb away from any other boat on the course.

As for us. We have PL VI and we're hoping to have the new boat in the water within the next 12 weeks, but we'll see how it goes.

Great breakdown, Blunted. Thanks a lot.

What's this about sanctions? Sorry if I'm wandering into a minefield here, but if they're not using the hallowed name of the America'$ Cup anymore, why does the class still have to worry about what the ISAF thinks?

Three new I20s is probably out of range of most of the people on this forum, but I would think that beachcat sailors, especially those with an engineering bent (HELLO WOUTER) would be interested in C class for things that could easily carry over into smaller cats, like asymmetric boards for instance.

Long story on what the ISAF thinks, they say you cannot call it a "World championship" unless they endorse the event. they will only do that for certain classes who meet minimum requirments. In return, you get to use the rules that we all know and love.

As for the "Little Americas cup" moniker. That's another kettle of fish. It was a nickname coined in the 60's that followed the ICCT which was sailed in C-cats. It made sense because the same kind of intensive design development went onin the C-cats as did the AC ajnd they both ended in match racing events so it was a clos analoge.

Well the c-cats didn'r race for a while so Seacliff YC the holder of the ICCT deed of gift chose to run the event in HT18's or whatever boat it is today and "retained" the moniker, "Little Americas Cup". Many would argue, including me, that it's not right and that should be accorded to the c-cats. Now the AC management has wadedin and said nobody can use the Moniker "America's Cup" in anything anymore except for them.

Personally it doesn;t make a big difference to me but for teams who need to raise funds to compete through sponsors the name would presumably help a lot. A positive brand association as they say in the business. ACM would call it a copyright infringment.

don;t ya love politics?

A quick update folks, we had Patient Lady IV back on the water this past Saturday for a few hours.

Conditions were "spicy" for us out there with gusts over 25 knots on the odd occassion. Our chase boat pegged us at a sustained 25 knots boat speed on a few runs across the harbour. As a rule we don't go out to race in more than 20 knots wind speed.

We had a few scares with the boat getting a little wild on us.

Unfortunately on what was to be the last run of the day we blew up our camber control in the middle of a very large puff, when we were already going about as fast as we could. When the camber control broke we went from as depowered as we could be to as powered up as we could in about .02 seconds. I instantly blew the sheet off to slow up down but by then we had already broken out #3 element on the wing and poked numerous holes in the skin.

So we'l lbe back on the water hopefully within about 2 weeks.

A most exciting day all around.

some more

Very nice! It must have been an awesome days sailing, glad to hear that your breakage wasn't more serious <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Thanks for posting, seriously cool stuff!
Please keep them coming..


How are the curved daggerboards working out for you?



Rolf
PS: Nice ruddersystem!

Sorry, credit to Rob Patterson 49er guy in a tender for the awesome photos.

And yes for my first time on the water this year it was more than a little exciting.

getting rigged

downhill in lighter air

assembly of a wing

assembling the wing

Blunted,

please say that you and your boat is OK!

Ref: http://www.sailinganarchy.com/fringe/2006/images/C-Class%20awsome%202.JPG

The boat is OK but the wing has had better days. I would expect we could be back on the water in about a week.

It was quite the ride launcing the entire boat into the air out of perfectly flat water.\

The foils really do generate a lot of lift at 20knots. Have to be careful about the angle of heel as well or it's all vertical lift and not horizontal lift to windward.

I am familiar with hydrofoilers and what I call "leaping and crashing". The flying hydrofoiler gets a puff, wants to come out of the water at quite a high angle of attack, leaps up then slows while losing lift, and crashes- straight ahead. My catamaran hydrofoilers don't generally want to pitchpole! <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> So far, never! They don't capsize either, as the lifting element wants to keep the boat right side up. And they don't break readily. but, you DO have to pay close attention to the mainsheet.

see my webpix: fastsail.com/catcobbler

Blunted,

could you say some words about how the twist mechanism in Cogitos wing is set up (if it is not secret..)? It would be fun to know how they do that. If I ever get around to playing with a mini wing or RC model it would be another touch.

Good day gang.

Just a quick update from C-class land.

The Canadian team is pleased to announce we have taken delivery of all of the "Big bits". This includes, the hulls, beams, foils and most importantly, the wing.

The entire boat has been moved to our island base for final assembly and testing.

Work is proceeding on the final rigging of the wing as we speak and the hulls are all but put together and ready to go at this point. We would hope to be on the water within two weeks.

Two boat testing will commence immediately upon launch of CAD 05.

To date we're quite happy with the build qualtiy of the entire project and it has passed the bench tests so far but the real test is obviously on the water.

We will keep you posted on further developments

from Toronto

Blunted

Rolf, re: twisting wing.

The front prt of the wing twists (elements 1 and 2) and the back part,#3, twist independandtly.

#3 is a bit floppy and has essentially stays running up inside the rig and out to some horns up by the hounds. If you ease the control line the "leech" twists off.

As for the font half, it's more complex. there is a carbon tube up the inside of the LE and it is fixed to a major rib at the hounds. above the hounds the ribs are all gfixed to the tube and turn with the tube if it turns.

Below the hounds the ribs and boom box are free to rotate about the spar. There is a control arm at the bottom which limits the twist and allows for control of twist. think of curtain rungs all free to turn on a curtain rod.

Between these two functions you cover almost all wind gradient conditions encountered, allowing for a flexible, always powered up and not stalling rig.

B

Do you actually "climb" upwind with assymetric boards?

I was told that there would be lots of parasite drag when foils are "climbing" the boat upwind.

I was also told that with asymetric boards upwind the boat actually heads lower while sailing the same course over the water of a symetric board boat. The advantage of heading lower is that the hull would not be generating lift, only the boards - their lift is generated with aproximately zero angle of attack, so the hull is aligned with the flow.

Since the boards are more efficient (long span, etc.) generating lift than the hull, the drag increases slowlyer with speed and the boat sails faster with the same power.

Maybe you are climbing due to other features, like the wingsail? Please let us know - and thanks very much for the great photos and info.

We were out training the other day and making close observations of the climbing in different conditions.

Our goal is to point the hulls straight through the water at zero degrees angle of attack and let the foils keep us in that direction, no higher, no lower, at least upwind. The foil shape, a NACA 64 series foil has a definite drag bucket, meaning an narrow range of angle of attack where the foil generates great lift at very low drag. Even at zero degrees for the foils they generate ample lift to make the boat go straight without leeway. You never realize how fast most boats go sideways until you sail a boat with assy foils.

The boat is pointed a bit lower and just seems to climb to weather, in fact the other guy is just falling away.

Downhill its easy to go to weather with the foils so we pull them up until we're going mostly straight with them or slightly to leeward.

As for the wing, it's just got low drag for the amount of power it generates so that also simply allows you to point higher.

"Little Americas Cup".. lose the name.. Call it the "Fast Americas Cup"

What about 'Intl. C Class World Titles'.

Are the C-class cats an ISAF class? (I don't think they are) If not, use of the word "world" is prohibited too. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" />

Call it "Too Quick to be the America's Cup" <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Prohibited by who??

C-Class is no longer an international class. Therefore, they are no longer allowed to hold world or international championships or use the words "world" or "international" in any of their events.

Who says so?? The International Sailing Federation (ISAF) says so. Does anybody dare to question ISAF's authority to govern and control sailing in all its forms throughout the world? <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" />

The threat is that sailors participating in a non-ISAF sanctioned "worlds" will be banned from ISAF sanctioned events for some time period in the future. Funny, yes. I don't know if it's actually ever been tested but it did come up when the Hobie Wave guys put together a "worlds"...they changed the name to something like Inter-Galactic championship or something. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Actually, the regatta was held by the Turks & Caicos, and it was the Wave World Championship. As far as us promoting it in the United States to get people to go to it, we were under intense pressure from ISAF and from US Sailing to change the name to something that would not imply in any way that it was a world championship. They suggested "Intergalactic," because, thankfully, ISAF has not yet extended its governing authorities beyond this planet.

The only reason we knuckled under and briefly changed the name to Intergalactic was because we had a youth sailor coming to the event, and we did not want him to be disqualified from being able to race in ISAF youth events just because of participating in the (illegal) Wave Worlds.

As it turned out, he came to the event and won the whole thing. And his trophy says "Wave Worlds."

that story warms the **** of my heart.

Maugan,
What exactly are ****?

From World Wide Words.

It’s one of the more lovely idioms in the language, isn’t it? Something that warms the **** of one’s heart induces a glow of pleasure, sympathy, affection, or some such similar emotion. What gets warmed is the innermost part of one’s being. It’s not that surprising that it should be associated with the heart, that being the presumed seat of the emotions for most people. But what are the ****?

We’re not sure. We do know that the expression turns up first in the middle of the seventeenth century, and that the earliest form of the idiom was rejoice the **** of one’s heart.

**** are a type of bivalve mollusc, once a staple part of the diet for many British people (you may recall that Sweet Molly Malone once wheeled her wheelbarrow through Dublin’s fair city, crying “**** and mussels, alive, alive oh!”). They are frequently heart-shaped (their formal zoological genus was at one time Cardium, of the heart), with ribbed shells.

It may be that the shape and spiral ribbing of the ventricles of the heart reminded surgeons of the two valves of the ****. But I can’t find an example of the word **** being applied to the heart outside this expression, which makes me suspicious of this explanation. It may be that the shape of the ****, suggesting the heart as it so obviously does, gave rise to **** of the heart as an expansion.

After this piece appeared in the Newsletter, James Woodfield pointed out that there is another possible explanation. In medieval Latin, the ventricles of the heart were at times called cochleae cordis, where the second word is an inflected form of cor, heart. Those unversed in Latin could have misinterpreted cochleae as ****, or it might have started out as a university in-joke. Oddly, cochlea in Latin is the word for a snail (from the shape of the ventricles—it’s also the name given to the spiral cavity of the inner ear), so if this story is right we should really be speaking of warming the snails of one’s heart.

I thought **** were scallops, like on the "Shell" sign.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/****

**** shots...Rum and any **** shell.

B:

Thanks for the description of Cogitos twist mechanism. Sounds a bit complicated to get right, but I suppose that is "the way of the wing".
Your description of the assymetrical foils was most interesting! If you can, some numbers on performance difference between symmetrical and assymetrical foils would be good.

Sorry for the late reply. Have been away sailing.. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Thanks, this is what I expected.

Another one:

Due to the low drag bucket, it is unlikely that the boat has angle of attack adjustment for the foils, so I guess you just raise/lower the foils to achieve the desired lift.

The narrow bucket also requires that the exact board span is kept underwater (at work), least the angle of attack falls outside the bucket, increasing drag. An instrument indicating hull alignment with water flow would improve performance. Do you plan to have something like this or just "feel" the boat?

Foils,

We don't worry that much about keeping the boat in the "bucket". At 25' long she wants to go straight even with the boards up. The drag bucket for the foils is still about 7 degrees wide. As it is we sail the boat at the low end of the bucket most of the time to keep the apperant wind up over the wing. Pinching slows the boat down about 25% for just a few degrees of height, so we simply don't pinch unless we need to make a mark at the last minute.

Yes we raise the board if we need less lift. 6" upwind if we going more than 12 knots all the time. down hill we pull it up until the boat stops sliding to weather, or about 18" if we're doing say 16-18 knots.

Exact board span underwater? Span being the long measurement, what ever is in the water is in the water on the boards. They work with an inch in the water or 6 feet in the water. Span does not effect angle of attack, the rudder effects the angle of attack. the boards are in nice tight gaskets that do not allow for any rotation.

As for a water flow alignement indicator? For one it would weigh more, 2 it's another thing to look at. When we're doing 18 knots down hill and I'm sitting to leeward of the wing covered in spray and then we're both looking around the race course we really only want to focus on staying upright and being in a tactically good place. More toys are very low on our list of priorities.

For tuning issues like trim and angles etc, we look at our chase boat video after the day is over or talk with the coaches while testing on the water. Then we just go back and sail more and get the feel right and then just keep sailing more.

Make sense?

Everything makes perfect sense except (maybe):



When the boat points to a heading but the actual course is to a slightly different one (usually downwind), the foils are not working at zero angle of attack (or their intended incidence angle).

When the submersed span isn't enough to provide enough lift to match the lateral component of the sail's lift, the boat will drift to leeward at a speed that will increase the foil's angle of attack until they (with the hull, as with conventional boards) provide enough lift to match the lateral component of the sail's lift.

When the submersed span is excesive and provides more lift than the necessary to match the lateral component of the sail's lift, the boat will drift to windward at a speed just enough to decrease the foil's angle of attack until they (with the hull - very bad) generate just the necessary lift to match the lateral component of the sail's lift.

If this makes sense, the submersed span directly affects the foil's angle of attack. The angle of attack is arctan (driftspeed / boat speed).

Blunted,

Any word on the new boat?

Wet1

The new boat is in the water and we're really pleased with it. we've had a couple of quick sessions on her and she's generally pretty happy.

Certainly lighter than PL and it shows in the acceleration for sure. We've had a few new boat wrinkles to iron out in the time available and it has cost us time to work those out but we feel pretty good about the boats strength and potential performance now.

As of this time the boat is in peices being loaded into her new horse trailer for the trip to Newport next week.

we'll be sailing both our boats against the US team in Newprt RI from the 20th until the 28th of September. You're all more than welcome to come check it out. We'll be sailing out of SAIL NEWPORT at Fort Adams state park.

Oh ya, i forgot to mention, the new boat is just really sexy looking too.

We'll probably have a full article on it next week in Sailing Anarchy, I'll post a link here when it goes up.

Sorry, no pics until then.

Blunted.

Good luck in Newport! Really looking forward to reading about (and seeing) your new beast.

Here's some shots of the new boat from two weeks ago

Enjoy

More

more again

What a beautiful boat!

Are you describing how the wing on Patient Lady works, or another boat?

If another boat, am I correct in guessing that the wing on "Patient Lady" is controlled with the trailing edge acting like a trim on an aircraft aileron in that it goes one direction to make the aileron go the other? Or is the trailing edge like an aileron?

Do you control it by moving the front or the rear or a combination?

I am a bit surprised that the wing does not have an endplate on the top of mast and the same on the bottom although on the bottom it would likely get in the way.

A wild guess is that an endplate on the top might encourage the boat to heel more as it would tend to produce lift which when combined with a heel would tend to pull the wing sideways.

Also where is the boat in Toronto as I pass through there ocassionally? Etobicoke maybe?

That is an awesome looking machine! <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Nice shape to the aft section of your new wing! Looks like a much better planform than the old one. I assume you have run the numbers trough and found an advantage compared to the old one..
It looks like you have a new platform as well? Good looking beams!

In the pictures you are sailing with both boards down. I tought you used assymetrical boards, and banana boards also. Dont you raise the windward board anymore?

thanks for the comments.
We do still pull up the weather board, but if the shock cord holding it up breaks it's tought to keep it up all the way as seen in the photo.

no banana boards on the new boat, no need. she rides much happier than PL. Borderline planing. The rig is a bit further aft and much more raked so overall less pitching moment, edspite a slightly taller wing.

Frozen. The aft section, or 3 as we call it, is a simple NACA section. The front is too essentially. think of the front section as the jib and #3 as the main, the slot is, well it's a slot. So the real foil shape is the combination of the two foils. The main sheet pulls the bottom of 3 to windward and the whole wing wants to go to leeward. So the whole wing wants to fold in half vertically like a piano hinge from tack to tack, so it inverts like a soft sail. This depth to the wing is called camber. Or as I call it on the boat, power.

The deeper the wing the more power and drag it creates. Upwind we flatten it for less power and less drag, same as soft sails only way more efficient.

The angle of attack for the wing is controled by mainsheet.

Endplate, we have thought about it but it adds to our measured wing area without a direct increase in lift.Mostly a reduction in induced drag. good endplates are also sensetive to angle of attack etc. 40 feet in the air pitching around and heeling over the angle of attack is pretty variable. finally it simply adds weight. The best way to go faster in this boat is to toss things overboard or not put them onboard in the first place. 1 pound equals one second per mile advantage. Every ounce is scrutinized.

one more

Yes all new boat Rolf, from top to bottom. New platform is a big difference on top of the new wing. The whole package is lighter, stiffer and more powerful than PL.

fascinating!

About the wing...does the top half of the flap (rear)section operate independant of the bottom half? It looks exactly like an airplane wing, and of course an airplane wing has an aileron out there at the end, to control the roll axis. In this application it would help control the heal angle in a gust. Is that how you sheet it upwind in a gust?

Can you provide more details on the 20-28th in Newport?

Timbo.

There is the front #1,2 and the back or #3 as we call it.

The twist in #1 can be controled between the foot/bottom/boom, whatever you want to call it and the hounds 25' from the bottom. There is essentially a torsion rod inside the wing, the more we ease it out, the more the front twists. above the hounds, 25' plus, the wing does not twist in #1,2

As for #3, we can also control the twist between the base and the hounds and above. The control arm is integral to #3 at the 25 foot mark so it effects twist above and below that point.

Roll? Well we call it heel angle and yes we do use #3 twist to control the heeling force, or moment, on the boat. We don't adjust it by gust, we simply set it up right for the conditions on that leg of the course and forget about it. If there's a gust we simply ease the mainsheet (Angle of attack if you are stuck in aircraft mode of thinking).

The twist in #3 is opened up in big breeze as it reduces the load generated by the top part for the wing and in turn moves the heeling moment lower, closer to the axis of rotation for the boat, which allows us to carry more power for less heelinig moment, and in turn go faster.

Generally we set up twist for a leg and forget about it. After that everything is crew position and mainsheet, and of course good steering.

The event in Newport.

It's pretty casual. The boats leave this Sunday for Newport in the trailer and will start to be set up on Monday I would hope.

the rest of us arrive Monday eveninig and get to work on tuesday AM setting up the camp, wings and boats.

Venue is SAIL NEWPORT at Fort Adams State Park in Newport RI.

We will try to sail / race from Wednesday the 20th until Wednesday the 27th.

28th is tear down and pack day.

29th we travel back North.

As for the racing, I have no idea what the plan is so far. i would imagine we'll spend some time racing outside in the ocean and probably spend some time "indoors" in Naragansett bay where you ould see the action from the bridge I think.

Visitors are more than welcome on shore. On the water? Well we have a tender but it's full up already. So if you have a fast boat you could come watch the racing up close, or hang out near a mark and watch us go by every once in a while.

Sorry, that's all I know.

I would imagine we'll post updates at Sailing Anarchy as well as the week progresses.

go fast

MC

I saw you guys out sailing on Monday afternoon off Newport at about 5:30pm, man you go fast.

What are you going to do with the boat you bought from Steve? Sell it me cheap and I'll race with you in Newport.

Any used C Class for sale cheap?

Seeing them sailing off Newport makes me want one.

How about a homebuild kit? Plans? How about it? Pretty please?

Bill

Gahh, what would the budget be for a homebuildt??? And where to store the wing(s)? But..ooooo soo cool!

I came home from sailing the $200k Lightspeed 32 and told the wife I wanted to sell the house. She didnt think it was funny.


Bill

see Maugan...told ya.

Thread Linky

Yes we had a fun time down there in Newport. too bad we could not sail over the weekend due to the Gale in progress.

We learned lots and steadily improved our speed over the course of the week.

In short, Cogito is beatable for sure. So now both teams will spend the winter making more mods to find more speed and power.

either way we were very happy with our new boat and PL VI for that matter, the young guns sailed the crap out of PL and even beat both new boats one day.

Fred will sell PL to someone who really wants to seriously race C-cats and can show thay have the will and budget to do so. He doesn't want to see a boat end up in a barn collecting dust at this point.

Home build plans? Well again think budget first. Cogito without paying for labour still had at least $ 50 K in materials in it. 4000 to 5000 hours of labour.

These days you could cut that down a bit if you know how to use CAD files and can order CNC or Water jet cut parts.

Yesterday I asked our designer how heavy Cedar strip and carbon hulls would be and he figured about 110 pounds a peice, which isn;t bad. Beams could be made from CST carbon tubes from Australia.

You could do a wing with 1/8 marine ply, a bunch of carbon, a whole herd of arrow shafts and you could make a half decent wing comparable to PL VI which is still not a bad boat.

If someone ponies up the dough, I will design you a good wing for a case of beer, OK 4 cases of beer and a bottle of scotch.

It can be done. you won;t beat us but you'll destroy a soft sail boat and never stop smiling.

Keep in mind, PL is 20 years old, and still is a competetive boat.

Do you have any pictures from Newport to post as well as race results?

How much?