Forum Index |  Albums |  Classifieds |  Catamarans For Sale |  Coming Events |  Submit Events
Announcements
Can You See Me Now?
by Damon Linkous. 03/25/17 10:24 PM
Board Status
by Damon Linkous. 03/23/17 01:43 AM
Forum Interruptions
by Mark Schneider. 03/18/17 03:09 PM
New Discussions
Graphic Pro Volunteer? Florida 300
by Damon Linkous. 03/22/17 06:51 PM
Altona
by Greg/Debra. 03/18/17 04:42 AM
RainX for the window?
by rehmbo. 03/17/17 01:52 PM
Can You See Me Now?
by Damon Linkous. 03/17/17 12:26 PM
A Cat fleets, foiling vs floating?
by Timbo. 03/14/17 04:12 PM
2017 Tommy Whiteside Memorial Regatta
by dave mosley. 03/13/17 09:26 AM
F18 Class at Midwinters E/N April 7-9 Ocean Springs MS
by Andy Humphries. 03/12/17 12:20 PM
Midwinters E/N in Ocean Springs MS April 7-9.
by Andy Humphries. 03/12/17 12:11 PM
Forum Interruptions
by Damon Linkous. 03/09/17 03:10 PM
No Trapezing In Maryland Or Florida?
by hobie1616. 03/08/17 02:31 PM
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate This Thread
Hop To
Page 1 of 2 1 2
#198828 - 12/11/09 11:30 AM F14 home-built plans available?  
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 4
Peter F. Patel-Schneider Offline
stranger
Peter F. Patel-Schneider  Offline
stranger

Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 4
New Jersey, USA
I'm looking for plans for an F14. Are any high-performance plans available?

Peter F. Patel-Schneider

--Advertisement--
#199102 - 12/17/09 12:55 PM Re: F14 home-built plans available? [Re: Peter F. Patel-Schneider]  
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 695
Seeker Offline
addict
Seeker  Offline
addict

Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 695
Ft. Pierce, Fl. USA
Peter....as you can see there is no mad rush by designers climbing over each other to entice you into buy their cutting edge F14 design.
The F14 has pretty much been still born. The two designs we hear about on this forum ( Bernieís 430 and Darrelís A&O) have failed to get any traction in the market place. You would think a designer would throw their hat into the ring selling just plans. Although the designers might scream foul I wonder just how much effect there would be if you reduced a set of cutting edge F16 design plans by 15% to build an F14?
We are no longer handicapped by the limits of what can be built with plywood. With the strip foam/female frame/mold method there really isnít a hull shape on the catamaran landscape that cannot be built one off by an individual builder in foam and glass.
Selling plans to a cutting edge F14 may or may not be as profitable as designing/building/selling a turn key boat but it sure beats not selling anything. If the market isnít there to sell a completed boat at least you could get some ROI (time/money) by selling the plans. Itís a lot more practical to send a cardboard tube full of plans from Australia to the United States for $20 (shipping cost)than to ship a finished boat. It might be just what is needed to get the party started.

Regards,
Bob

#199147 - 12/18/09 07:45 AM Re: F14 home-built plans available? [Re: Seeker]  
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 4,451
Rolf_Nilsen Offline
Rolf_Nilsen  Offline

Carpal Tunnel

Joined: May 2003
Posts: 4,451
West coast of Norway
Building to plans is the way a lot of classes have been started.
I think Gato mumbled something about doing a F14. Perhaps even this winter?

#199156 - 12/18/09 10:38 AM Re: F14 home-built plans available? [Re: Rolf_Nilsen]  
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 432
Gato Offline
addict
Gato  Offline
addict

Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 432
Finland
Yep, I did and Iím still thinking about it. I have the permission of Ncik to stretch the Tabby to 14 feet, still that will not maybe be the latest state of the art F14 cat. Still I think that if we throw in a little bit of money we could maybe get Ncik or Scarecrow to have a go at a F14.

#199189 - 12/18/09 05:50 PM Re: F14 home-built plans available? [Re: Gato]  
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 4
Peter F. Patel-Schneider Offline
stranger
Peter F. Patel-Schneider  Offline
stranger

Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 4
New Jersey, USA
Hmm. Just what is a Tabby? (I'm guessing a 12' cat.)

Last edited by Peter F. Patel-Schneider; 12/18/09 05:52 PM.
#199190 - 12/18/09 05:52 PM Re: F14 home-built plans available? [Re: Peter F. Patel-Schneider]  
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 4
Peter F. Patel-Schneider Offline
stranger
Peter F. Patel-Schneider  Offline
stranger

Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 4
New Jersey, USA
It is too bad that the F14 is not going well. 14' seems to be a good size for a cat that is easy to make and transport, but still a good size for a regular adult single-handed. There are some 14' cat plans available, but they all seem to be rather wimpy.

Last edited by Peter F. Patel-Schneider; 12/18/09 05:59 PM.
#199201 - 12/18/09 11:33 PM Re: F14 home-built plans available? [Re: Peter F. Patel-Schneider]  
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 432
Gato Offline
addict
Gato  Offline
addict

Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 432
Finland
Yes, it's a 14 feet version of the Tabby 12. and it would be good enough to me. I agree with you, for me it seems the perfect cat to sail single handed. 30 kg lighter than the top F16 makes a lot of difference, it would be possible to car top.

#199205 - 12/19/09 06:45 AM Re: F14 home-built plans available? [Re: Peter F. Patel-Schneider]  
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 1,323
JeffS Offline
veteran
JeffS  Offline
veteran

Joined: May 2006
Posts: 1,323
Kingston SE South Australia
Originally Posted By: Peter F. Patel-Schneider
There are some 14' cat plans available, but they all seem to be rather wimpy.

14 foot can look wimpy on the beach but when the wind comes up they're the bees knees. I now have three 14 ft Arrows, my 12yr old daughter and 12yr old crew sailed today in 18 knots on hers. Every time we went near them they were screaming and laughing.

Attached Files Jeff2.jpg
Last edited by JeffS; 12/19/09 06:46 AM.

Jeff Southall
Nacra 5.8 1667 Ram Raider
Nacra 18 Square
Taipan 5.7 134
Mosquito 404
Arrow 1576
#199209 - 12/19/09 10:25 AM Re: F14 home-built plans available? [Re: JeffS]  
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 4
Peter F. Patel-Schneider Offline
stranger
Peter F. Patel-Schneider  Offline
stranger

Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 4
New Jersey, USA
I was referring to plans for home-built 14' cats. I've found a few - the best of the bunch appears to be the Quattro 14 http://www.sailingcatamarans.com/quattro14.htm.

I'm not particularly convinced that a catamaran with a publicity shot showing it being sailed while sitting on a beach chair is going to be high performance, as was the case for one plan I came across.

#199210 - 12/19/09 10:40 AM Re: F14 home-built plans available? [Re: Peter F. Patel-Schneider]  
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 432
Gato Offline
addict
Gato  Offline
addict

Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 432
Finland
We have a home built Pixie 14 from Woods, it's sailing all right, but the Tabby 14 will be a lot more fun and also ligthter and faster
http://www.gust.ax/gallery/pixie/08-06-04/

Last edited by Gato; 12/19/09 10:40 AM.
#199215 - 12/19/09 04:05 PM Re: F14 home-built plans available? [Re: Gato]  
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 117
engineer Offline
member
engineer  Offline
member

Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 117
Cairns FNQ
Is it the one on the right in the first photo?
They look really nice, and great colours as well.
My wife is fighting me all the way on an F14, one day perhaps.
If I could only buy one off the shelf, but I can't afford the Alpha.
Are the plans available for the F12 boat?


Nacra 430 Rocket
#199225 - 12/20/09 01:18 AM Re: F14 home-built plans available? [Re: engineer]  
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 432
Gato Offline
addict
Gato  Offline
addict

Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 432
Finland

The one at the right is the DS12 designed by Scarecrow and this is the Tabby12 designed by Ncik
http://www.gust.ax/images/Tabby.jpg
The plans for those and the Vudu 380 are available at the F12 forum, just send a PM to the designes.
Here you can find some building hints
http://www.gust.ax/gallery/f12/
http://www.gust.ax/gallery/f12/2/

Last edited by Gato; 12/20/09 01:21 AM.
#199228 - 12/20/09 05:33 AM Re: F14 home-built plans available? [Re: Peter F. Patel-Schneider]  
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 1,323
JeffS Offline
veteran
JeffS  Offline
veteran

Joined: May 2006
Posts: 1,323
Kingston SE South Australia
I misunderstood what you meant earlier about 14 ft cats. I wouldn't call the Quatro a high performance design, the 14ft Sundance that Darry Barrett used to make was nearly identical in hull shape 20 yrs ago. The Quatro wont go up wind that well without centre boards, won't tack too well and it's not a high aspect rig I'd condsider all of these important to call it high performance. The hulls are only a small part of the cost and the rig will cost the same whether you buy the same as a 40 yr old hobie rig and look dated straight away or a modern high aspect rig like the DS12 that Gato built.
just my thoughts (I'm building a DS12 as well)
regards


Jeff Southall
Nacra 5.8 1667 Ram Raider
Nacra 18 Square
Taipan 5.7 134
Mosquito 404
Arrow 1576
#199232 - 12/20/09 06:21 AM Re: F14 home-built plans available? [Re: JeffS]  
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 432
Gato Offline
addict
Gato  Offline
addict

Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 432
Finland
There is another funny thing about the costs: the hull/sail+ rig costs on a F12 cat is about 50/50, on a F16 cat 20/80.
It would be time for some pics of your DS12

Last edited by Gato; 12/20/09 06:25 AM.
#199240 - 12/20/09 04:17 PM Re: F14 home-built plans available? [Re: Gato]  
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 1,323
JeffS Offline
veteran
JeffS  Offline
veteran

Joined: May 2006
Posts: 1,323
Kingston SE South Australia
I don't want to hijack the thread but I'm building it slowly whenever my 9yo lad want's to build it, there's no point me doing it in a rush on my own. It's fun to do it with him and I've got 6 other junior cats. I've just finished painting one of the Arrows pink with my daughter.
Has anyone asked Darryl or Bernie if they can make the shells without bulkheads and send them as a part finished kit inside each other for the new owner to put the bulkheads and decks on?


Jeff Southall
Nacra 5.8 1667 Ram Raider
Nacra 18 Square
Taipan 5.7 134
Mosquito 404
Arrow 1576
#199263 - 12/21/09 02:05 AM Re: F14 home-built plans available? [Re: JeffS]  
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 432
Gato Offline
addict
Gato  Offline
addict

Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 432
Finland
What I would need is a set of drawings for the frames with a spacing of 100mm to set up a foam strip projekt.

#199265 - 12/21/09 06:32 AM Re: F14 home-built plans available? [Re: Gato]  
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 4,451
Rolf_Nilsen Offline
Rolf_Nilsen  Offline

Carpal Tunnel

Joined: May 2003
Posts: 4,451
West coast of Norway
Originally Posted By: Gato
There is another funny thing about the costs: the hull/sail+ rig costs on a F12 cat is about 50/50, on a F16 cat 20/80.
It would be time for some pics of your DS12


I think that number changes a bit if you take the DIY approach to the rig and sails as well?

#199331 - 12/22/09 12:53 AM Re: F14 home-built plans available? [Re: Rolf_Nilsen]  
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 432
Gato Offline
addict
Gato  Offline
addict

Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 432
Finland
You will be surprised wink Btw, you can get a declassed Tornado carbon spar from Marstroms, and they give you a good price. Valtteri vent to bring one for his Blade.

#199337 - 12/22/09 08:01 AM Re: F14 home-built plans available? [Re: Gato]  
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 4,451
Rolf_Nilsen Offline
Rolf_Nilsen  Offline

Carpal Tunnel

Joined: May 2003
Posts: 4,451
West coast of Norway
MarstrÝm and good price in the same sentence.. laugh

We have three used Tornado alu masts in storage already which cost next to nothing. Thanks for the tip though!

#199347 - 12/22/09 10:15 AM Re: F14 home-built plans available? [Re: Rolf_Nilsen]  
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 432
Gato Offline
addict
Gato  Offline
addict

Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 432
Finland
Toro alu, far to heavy.

#199475 - 12/24/09 03:44 AM Re: F14 home-built plans available? [Re: Rolf_Nilsen]  
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 120
valtteri Offline
member
valtteri  Offline
member

Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 120
Finland
Originally Posted By: Rolf_Nilsen
MarstrÝm and good price in the same sentence.. laugh

We have three used Tornado alu masts in storage already which cost next to nothing. Thanks for the tip though!


Big part of costs is shipping, I got fairly decent price about ferry to Stockholm, so I picked the carbon mast myself from Všstervik. All in all total price was less than what I payed from fully fitted superwing. The T mast chopped to 8.5 m was about 13.7 kg's while superwing was 21.8 kg's, so the clear winner is carbon (no righting aids needed ;)). It would be interesting to know what the chopped down fitted alu T-mast weights... Please note that price was low because that mast has been floating around their workshop (it didn't measure into T-rule), also currency exchange rate favored me a bit.

Only drawback is that my Blade is not F16 class legal anymore, the mast foot is about 1 cm's too high (7.5 cm allowed from beam to mast, my mast sits at 8.5 cm from beam). I could of course make new mast foot fairly easy if I would participate to a F16 event, but I probably would try to change the rule first (I'm not member though, so I don't have that option). Anyway I don't think that there is going to be any F16 class action happening near me next summer, so I probably wont bother.


Valtteri Blade F16
Page 1 of 2 1 2

Moderated by  Damon Linkous 

Search

Who's Online Now
3 registered members (Greg/Debra, DVL, David_Melcon), 33 guests, and 95 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
catmancan, Gbr400, JeffB, Ben_Brown, Marcup
7592 Registered Users
Top Posters(30 Days)
brucat 25
Jake 21
Timbo 20
Forum Statistics
Forums25
Topics22,169
Posts264,773
Members7,592
Most Online422
Mar 17th, 2017
Forum Index |  Albums |  Classifieds |  Catamarans For Sale |  Coming Events |  Submit Events
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.0
Page Time: 0.015s Queries: 16 (0.003s) Memory: 0.9297 MB (Peak: 1.1858 MB) Zlib enabled. Server Time: 2017-03-27 02:45:46 UTC