Thinking about future growth, I found the following table interesting. It is the quotas for the F-18 class worlds in Spain:

QUOTAS
Allocation of the quotas per country/region are as displayed in the table below. The International Formula 18 Association reserves the right to re-allocate quotas.
2007 World Champion 1
Australia 8
Belgium 9
France 22
Germany 25
The Netherlands 22
Italy 16
North American 4
Sweden 9
United Kingdom 13
Wild Cards (Host Country) 20
Wild Cards (Host Association) 2
Wild Cards (International F18 Association) 9
Ref: http://f18.es/nigran2008/index.php?...ask=view&id=12&Itemid=29

In total 160 boats, but looking at the distribution it is indicative for where the cat racing communites are? These are all pretty serious racers and the F-16 class can offer a boat targeting a wider selection of sailors. We should be able to expand a bit more than this both in numbers and locations. Getting translations of our website in french, german, italian and spanish is a given, but we need someone to break the ice and spread the word in these countries (and other contries of course). Suggestions in addition to the Carnac event?

That makes quite interesting reading Rolf. If Spain weren't hosting I take it they'd have an allocation similar to one of the other Euro countries such as UK? Do you know whether the allocations are adjusted each year based on the liklihood or otherwise of nations attending? Or do they base the quotas on registered boats in each country with a NA, and that quota pretty much stands from year to year?

As to other events other than Carnac - I guess it'd be good if we can get some F16s to Texel.

John,

I think these are usually dealt out based on National membership or attendance at National Champs in each country and/or other qualification rules. No doubt it is in the F18 class rules somewhere <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

I dont know about the F18s, but for the Tornado class it is membership fees paid to ITA.




I was hoping for something more than "just" attending events. It takes a lot of effort to be represented at events (those of you going to Carnac, remember to bring flyers for handing out!) so I was thinking what more can we do. How do we kickstart the class in France, Italy, Spain, Germany and recruit the sparkplugs who can take this to the next level. I was also thinking how much more than racing versatile boat like the F-16s have to offer. How do we make inroads into the large potential we have.

Not very elegantly formulated, but I am a bit busy just now..

Rolf,

I agree to am extent.

Other classes which are big enough to have to limit entrants use qialification for the slots they have available, I guess the slots are allocated based on membership of the national authority.

Another French regatta: http://www.mancheaventure.com/presentation/presentation.php?anne=2008

En Formule 18 : Emmanuel Boulogne (Champion du monde 2003) mais d'autres
coureurs examinent leur planning comme par exemple Yvan Bourgnon...
En classe 1.04 : Le team Sangiardi (6ème Français en 2006) gagnant de
l'édition précédente,...

Maybe not to far for the English, since they have a ferry to Le Havre...

Gill

I believe slots at the F18 worlds are based around membership numbers of the NA, also the UK allocation looks wrong as I think it is 20. The numbers can be a bit misleading because it is paid up class members which can include crews.
With regard to F16 numbers I would say that in the UK there is a perception that F16's are not competitive in respect of their handicap. The Spitfire guys certainly seem to think the Spit is quicker yet gains a good deal of time as well against the F16. Likewise with the F18 that sails off the same number (I think). I've not raced (F18) in light airs against an F16; but a couple of times in reasonable wind at the Mumbles last year to my mind the F16's didn't appear as quick as the F18 (also looked overpowered one up - sorry Mark <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />). I would suggest that maybe a JP type figure needs to sail the boat at opens and get some top results and then people would be more interested, certainly in the racing sphere.

No need to apologise and I totally agree that I for one don't sail to the F16 Rating. Unfortunately, neither do my fellow Club competitors to theirs. So it makes it more difficult to improve ones personal performance. However, as for being overpowered that should now be a thing of the past. As we speak Grant Piggott is hopefully re-cutting the luff to flatten the mainsail. Watch out!!!

Aha, so there is a percetion in the UK that the F-16 rating is too high.. Should drop with time if that is correct, but getting some really good sailors (read: really proven fast and well known) on the boat has been a goal for some time now without much success.

I must confess, I dont have many realistic ideas on how to spread the word to the rest of our target group, the non or rarely racing group.

I'm not convinced the rating is too high, just the level of competence in the current fleet is slightly lower than other classes. It is taking a bit of time for people from other Classes to see the benefits of the F16 concept but with only one major shop window (being Datchet) where there are approx 5 F16's it is obviously going to take some time. However, hosting the Global Challenge in the UK I'm sure will help matters.

We're gaining some competitive depth here. Tim is ready to give Matt & Gina some competition, though IMO he needs steady crew. Terry and Tina did well at Tradewinds. They are improving with each regatta. So we now have three solid competitors. A year ago it was just Matt & Gina.

Oley and Joanna are very good, too. They beat me as badly as Matt and Gina do - from what I can remember. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />

All these forces shall be present at Gulfport. Should be fun to watch....... ugh.

IMO the rating of the F16 is ok and that is in any condition.
I'm sure in lighter winds/flat water the F16 is even in favour.
If you saw the REM race results (last year in Holland) the F16 did very well in heavy seas and quite heavy winds.

If I compare the results of Kathleen and I, I must say we end up in open regatta's were we ended up with the Nacra 5.0 the year before. The Nacra I sailed for 12 years, the Blade the first....
F16 have a lot op potential.

As for what you are saying about how to promote the class to non-competitive sailors Rolf, I think the platform has many advantages:

light
1 and 2 up
looks good
cheaper then an F18 (because a lot of F18 at our club are sailing by non-competitive sailors but it looks/sounds good).

Regards,
Gill

Guys !




What Gill is not telling you guys is that he was pretty sceptical when we took along on a F16 demo ride some 18 months ago. The fact that he has come around really says something. In my view he only allowed himself to be convinced by real results and personal experiences.

It seems that now that has happened.

And it put a smile on my face.

There is part of me that actually enjoys the situation where many are very sceptical to the F16 idea and performance only to come about after having sailed these boats themselves at demo's, Alter Cup like events and such.

You know you have a good thing when people step onto the boat absolutely wanting to see their believes confirmed (and poke Wouter in the eye!) and then having to change their opinions. And it guess it is enjoyable to them as well as a new world of possibilities has just opened up to them. How many times in life are you really being surprised or discovering something new or unbelievable ?

I also think of Gary Maskiel in this respect. He sailed all kinds of boats for decades and pretty much had seen it all. Then he steps onto an F16 and singlehanding the spinnaker make him fall in love again with sailing. Isn't that a thing of beauty ?

Same with mr DUH, see his recent posting here. I know what feeling he is talking about. When I raced with Geert on his Alter Cup Blade on the second day of the NAM-REM race I discovered the same thing. That there is a groove in big wind where the Alter Cup Blade suddenly "clicks" and start hunting to windward; then it just skims across the water. We were a tad over 160 kg together and racing several 1-year old F18's sailed by comparable and lighter crews. We kept our place and in some cases extended the distance on them.

That was a WOW ! moment for me. For me that was the moment where the result that I'd found in the mathematics 6 years ago merged into a single feeling, merging into a proof of concept.

Now only tad more development work is need to get the downwind ride in big wind fully up to specs and then we're there.


Wouter

Coming back at the original topic.

I think that one part of the promo and growth program should be to keep giving as many demo rides to interested parties as we can.

That has always been our strong point.

Most sailors will simply not believe any F16 claims until they have actually experienced some F16 sailing themselves.

In my view any promo must be geared towards getting them interested sufficiently to put in the effort to get a demo ride. After that you can almost sit back and watch the newly gained experience slowly eating its way through the most strongly constructed sceptism and preconceptions.

I also believe that the general class feel expressed by these demo rides is what attracts alot of people to the class. We are no an industrial class with a big dealor yet. We are what we are. A bunch of enthousiasts that really like our boats and are happy to take anybody along for a demo ride without any strings attached.

I want to propose to maintain this part of the F16 promo package. Maybe even make is a key part.

Wouter

Wouter,

You're correct. I had my doubts about the concept and certainly speed/rating. After the demo I was convinced.

I think you're correct that demo-sails are very important.

Regards,
Gill