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F12 weight #148615
07/06/08 12:57 AM
07/06/08 12:57 AM


I would have set a weight below 60kg (probably 50-55kg), but this wasn't popular. With this in mind we said in the past that we would pencil in 60kg and firm up later.

I'd like to propose the following.

Minimum weight ready to sail 60kg*.

*This weight to be revisited after 10 boats have been launched with owners of the boats being only people allowed to vote. Where families own multiple boats they shall have one vote per boat.

Is this acceptable.
single choice
75%, 6 Votes
25%, 2 Votes
Total Votes: 8
Voting on this poll ends: 07/13/08 12:57 AM
Re: F12 weight [Re: ] #148616
07/06/08 06:20 AM
07/06/08 06:20 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 9,582
North-West Europe
Wouter Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Wouter  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 9,582
North-West Europe
I voted no because of the voting procedure that is piggy-backed to ballot.

I agree to 60 kg but not with establishing a revote by only the handful of owners at a later time.

I'm a firm believer that we have to plan out a growth path that will allow this class to be build i an economically viable way and be promoted effectively. This may well limit some class rules to specs that are above what it technical possible.

In the way of techniques, cheap production methodes are very important.

In the way of promotion, getting these boats at resorts and rental places is also very important. Were they try out these boats and buy them later at the dealor. The Hobie Bravo and Hobie wave method of promotion.

We can build the F12 as light as a Moth but that won't really help us building the class or get it generally accepted.

My appologies if I start to sound like a broken record. But I really want to underscore that we can't risk falling out on these points again simply because each one of us would like to have a 30 kg rocket and then expects others to build the class and grow it against all odds.

I too would love to have a 30 kg F12 personally, that is not the point, but I really don't see how we can build it into a large, well established class like the lasers and opties that way.

I hate to say it but we could have agreed to make the F16's at 90 kg, as that is technically possible, but the fact we settled on 107 kg was a major good call in the way of economical viability and thus growth of the class. As it turns out 107 kg is already a pretty challenging weight commercially speaking. I feel we must really look it our F12 in a similar way. 17 kg difference won't make that much difference in performance, but it can make a difference between a 14.500 Euro F16 and a 18.500 Euro F16. The first one sells, the second one most likely wouldn't have. We're finding that customers will go up to 15.000 Euro's and then move away. For certain such a limit will also be found for the F12's, the question is where. I think it is at 4000 Euro's/dollars, the latter requiring local production to achieve.

Rant off.


Last edited by Wouter; 07/06/08 06:24 AM.

Wouter Hijink
Formula 16 NED 243 (one-off; homebuild)
The Netherlands
Re: F12 weight [Re: Wouter] #148617
07/10/08 02:40 AM
07/10/08 02:40 AM


Please refer to other weight poll for a better question.

Last edited by Scarecrow; 07/10/08 02:40 AM.

Moderated by  Damon Linkous 


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