| Re: 35th America's Cup
[Re: David Parker]
#287288 06/16/17 06:04 AM 06/16/17 06:04 AM |
Joined: Dec 2006 Posts: 2,490 On the Water P.M.
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
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Posts: 2,490 On the Water | NBC to air documentary on Ted Turner’s successful 1977 Americascup Defense on Saturday, June 17 2:30pm ET. This will be after the Match races.
Philip USA #1006 | | | Re: 35th America's Cup
[Re: waterbug_wpb]
#287289 06/16/17 07:01 AM 06/16/17 07:01 AM |
Joined: Jun 2001 Posts: 12,310 South Carolina Jake
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Posts: 12,310 South Carolina | I thought Paul Cayard made some really great calls on the water regarding wind shifts and potential strategies. Keep that guy!
...
The agonizing discussion of how VMG works was hard to listen to, but the graphics were very well done and should explain to the non-sailor how it works... The leader bar and separation distance were easy enough for my 11 year old to figure out. The football yardage lines kind of helped, as did the boat tracks.
...
I remember thinking, "Jesus Ken, do you even know what VMG is?"...and then back to one of my favorite Einstein quotes (which is a very introvert type thing) ... something along the lines of, "if you can't explain it in simple terms, you don't understand it well enough". When I was on the steeper end of the learning to sail curve, I kept hearing that VMG is not a very useful data point for some reason - I'm not sure if it was the guys that were just not happy with, or didn't understand, the up and coming GPS tech at the time. Thanks to that, I rarely ever sailed with a VMG number on display anywhere (somewhat regrettably because I think it might have shortened my learning curve a little) but I do race with a running VMG estimate in my head and balance that against where I am on the course and what's happening around me.
Jake Kohl | | | Re: 35th America's Cup
[Re: P.M.]
#287290 06/16/17 07:06 AM 06/16/17 07:06 AM |
Joined: Jun 2001 Posts: 12,310 South Carolina Jake
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Posts: 12,310 South Carolina | herring probably - unless they are making the boat shorter or with less windage - but I thought the hulls were one design. How much of the hulls was one-design, though? Can they change the bow? I also think that everything leading up to this point has shown that the relative bow buoyancy has been pretty important...unless you are going to replace it with a ski, lol.
Jake Kohl | | | Re: 35th America's Cup
[Re: brucat]
#287291 06/16/17 07:10 AM 06/16/17 07:10 AM |
Joined: Jun 2001 Posts: 12,310 South Carolina Jake
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Posts: 12,310 South Carolina | Again, I think it needs to be a sliding scale (if it's light wind, they won't be foiling anyway). They just need something that can quickly be communicated, measured and observed. The blue idiot light takes the concept a bit too far, and takes away from the viewing experience.
Mike I'm coming to agree that the answer is a penalty time adder - they can display it right below the race time on the TV for each team somehow - kind of like penalty time in soccer. A boat that gets dinged with an infraction just occurs a finish time penalty. They get a 10 second penalty time (or whatever, for each infraction). If your opponent also makes an infraction, one infraction cancels the other out and you are back to zero. When the boat with a penalty crosses the finish line, you see their penalty timer start counting down and if the other team isn't across when it hits zero - they win. I think the time adder would be pretty insignificant relative to wind conditions. This would also give them the option to assess different size penalties for different infractions too - something that isn't done, or certainly would be decipherable, with the current system....say, in the case where Artemis went outside the boundary and got a second penalty for being out there too long...10 seconds for the first and then 5 seconds for each 10 seconds you spend outside the boundary. You could take out a few of the arbitrary judgement calls this way too and let the computer do the computing and assigning the penalty.
Jake Kohl | | | Re: 35th America's Cup
[Re: Jake]
#287292 06/16/17 07:19 AM 06/16/17 07:19 AM |
Joined: Dec 2006 Posts: 2,490 On the Water P.M.
Pooh-Bah
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Posts: 2,490 On the Water | but I thought the hulls were one design. How much of the hulls was one-design, though?. they are, the rules require only a small percentage of a team’s bow section to be constructed in the country of origin. The thinking here is put the Oracle bows on the JPN boat and Oracle will two boat test.
Philip USA #1006 | | | Re: 35th America's Cup
[Re: David Parker]
#287294 06/16/17 10:06 AM 06/16/17 10:06 AM |
Joined: Aug 2007 Posts: 3,969 brucat
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Posts: 3,969 | Don't think for half a second that Ken doesn't understand VMG. He grew up racing on Narragansett Bay (shifty and puffy like a lake, with extremely variable currents), and has done a few stints in the VOR.
Unless you're on a piece of water with no current or wind shifts; VMG, like boatspeed, is something to consider, but may not always be the priority. There are times when you may prioritize one of these over the other, or sacrifice both for another goal, like placement vs your competition, or preparation for an expected shift in wind or current, etc.
Wind forecast for tomorrow says low teens, should be fun!
Mike | | | Re: 35th America's Cup
[Re: David Parker]
#287297 06/16/17 10:59 AM 06/16/17 10:59 AM |
Joined: Aug 2007 Posts: 3,969 brucat
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Posts: 3,969 | Thought that was a Hobie Bob. Burling could use one... Mike
Last edited by brucat; 06/16/17 11:01 AM.
| | | Re: 35th America's Cup
[Re: P.M.]
#287298 06/16/17 11:42 AM 06/16/17 11:42 AM |
Joined: Dec 2006 Posts: 2,490 On the Water P.M.
Pooh-Bah
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Posts: 2,490 On the Water | but I thought the hulls were one design. How much of the hulls was one-design, though?. they are, the rules require only a small percentage of a team’s bow section to be constructed in the country of origin. The thinking here is put the Oracle bows on the JPN boat and Oracle will two boat test. If you want to hear JS's answer, listen to today's presser. JS response was perfect and I found it quite entertaining. . . . . and to get the whole picture, yesterday NZ stated while posting the same picture, and I quote, "Closing the circle. OracleTeamUSA spare bows heading over to SoftBankTeamJPN to create Oracle Boat 2- surprised?"
Philip USA #1006 | | | Re: 35th America's Cup
[Re: David Parker]
#287300 06/16/17 03:36 PM 06/16/17 03:36 PM |
Joined: Aug 2007 Posts: 3,969 brucat
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Posts: 3,969 | You're welcome. I'm not loving the schedule, they loaded the front end (first 8 races) onto two weekends, and will then run into weekdays. So unless Oracle wins 6 before losing 3, we're going to have to see it end while at work!?!? Mike Wait a minute... The SB article referenced with that red bow picture says that the score is currently USA 0, NZL -1. So, USA needs to win 7, NZL need to win 8. How did I miss that? Mike | | | Re: 35th America's Cup
[Re: P.M.]
#287302 06/17/17 07:54 AM 06/17/17 07:54 AM |
Joined: Aug 2007 Posts: 3,969 brucat
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Posts: 3,969 | They forgot to pitchpole? Mike | | | Re: 35th America's Cup
[Re: David Parker]
#287303 06/17/17 09:40 AM 06/17/17 09:40 AM |
Joined: Dec 2006 Posts: 2,490 On the Water P.M.
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
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Posts: 2,490 On the Water | Wind forecast is 8-12 knots out of the east. Very shifty. Playing the shifts and boat set up should be prevalent today.
Two races today and two races tomorrow.
First race start 14:12 Bermuda.
Philip USA #1006 | | |
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