well mostly the 16 and 18 models but it doesnt really matter because im not really interested in those and there are still quite a few FXone races over here

Well, then, it's a no-brainer -- get an FX-One. And that is what you want anyway.

There don't seem to be many of them in the United States, but there was one at our April race-training seminar. It is a beautiful boat and very quick.

Well, I guess I'll be the lone voice for the FX-1. I have one and love it. It is easy to sail, easy to right and really kicks in after 10 knots or wind or so. The boat really likes to go and I've had it in up to 20-23 knots and it just tracks like a dream. I've been tinkering with it and have a neutral helm upwind and downwind with the chute up. Sailing with the chute is very easy as I have the snuffer. I can rig it by myself in about 40 mins, 25 or so with my wife.

The nice thing about the boat is that it is easily sailed by one or two, as are the F16 and I17. The wave piercing bows are very cool. Coming from sailing a TheMightyHobie18 to this is simply amazing. The bows slice through the water and the boat is very, very responsive. I now feel comfortable tacking on shifts (as do monos), something I have never felt worthwhile on a cat. As far as speed, I have plenty of it. I'm surprised to read that others in the UK are struggling, as I am doing a horizon job on others. Granted, there aren't huge fleets here, but speed is certainly not an issue.

Having said all of that, I am actually selling the boat. Why? It's too fast. I never thought I'd say a boat was too fast, but I'm so far ahead of the others out there on the race course, it is taking a lot of the fun out. No tactics, no covering.....they are too far behind. Once I'm in clear air, I'm gone. We have a few boats that rate faster than me, but I'm still way ahead of them, sometimes as far as an entire leg ahead. So, I hate to sell the boat, as it is everything I wanted, but I am probably going to get something slower to enjoy the racing a little more.

I highly recommend the FX-1 as an all around boat for one or two. Good luck with the quest for your boat!

Kip
Boise, ID
FX-1

too fast?
now that sounds like the perfect cat for me

hrm well im not sure yet but im still siding towards the FXone a little more than the rest ... i know that it sounds like an easy decision .. well at least it was until i read the posts on the forum and all the bad reviews ppl had about the FXone, now im just not sure

the problem is that the opinions ppl have about the FX one are just sooo different from each other .. i mean one person says its the perfect cat and that its a good choice but then some1 comes along and says that its practically the worst they have ever tried

Sarah,

Most of what has been stated here is good advice. Many of the posters are biased (as I am) for obvious reasons to many of us, however, you are new to this forum so I thought a little information might be of some use to you. Each of the posters that advocate the F16 are actively involved in growing this relatively new class, like Wouter, who came up with the class rules. I think each of them is telling you the truth as they see it and propose the F16 for those reasons. The drawback I see to the F16 is that trying to learn how to make it perform to its potential is difficult because each one is different. This differs from the Formula 18 because the majority of those are either Hobie or Nacra, and so you have identical boats to tune with. I don't mean that there aren't many things that apply to all catamarans (sailboats?), just that one design fleets help all those boats sail closer to their potential. Wouter's view that one design is a thing of the past is not a view shared by many on this forum, but in his defence, many of us like to tinker with our boats, which one design discourages for good reason.

The best advice is to sail each of your choices prior to purchase and make up your own mind.

I agree that sailing what others in your area sail is good advice, both for your own pleasure and for resale.

Lastly, I think you should try to pick a dealer that you like and feel you can trust. I have dealt with good and bad dealers, and the good ones deserve your business!

Sarah,

If you have FXone's locally then you probably should go that route, BUT the FX one is not the most forgiving boat (I have been told) in the bigger winds - I considered one to replace my Inter 17 that is currently for sale. I've removed the FXone from my list (Currently an A class or something line it, a Shadow (UK Based 16 footer) or another Inter 17). as it just does not appear to perform to the handicap it has.

Good luck with what ever you decide

Cheers

Simon

If there are other FX-ones racing out there around you then FX-one it is.

Oh and btw,

I'm Tad

I have had my FX for 3 years and have enjoyed it very much...it may be havier than the A-cats but in the caribbean its not a hinderance..I have no problem righting it...then Im 99kg(220lbs)..it sails very well in 15-20kts wind and 3-5ft seas...and tacking is very easy for a uni-rig...I recomend it very highly...

<****. As if the A-cats are all identical. Hell, you'll be hard pressed to find identical F18's even when only looking at Hobie Tiger F18's. First thing F18 sailors do when buying a Tiger is spend an additional 3000 Euro's on modifying the boat to full F18 competitiveness. With respect to F16's, the bulk of the class is Taipan 4.9 based, a design that has been raced hard for over 15 years now and ample tuning help is available. I'm sure that are differences between the classes in this respect but you make it sound like we are a freak class without history or past development in tuning.

Now I agree that sailing what others are sailing is a good policy, but I don't agree that this is preferable to all cost. I value sailing enjoyment and first in wins with F18's in equal amounts. That is my personal pattern of values but fully normal as well.





Well, I'm very influenced by the European catamaran scene. One-design is pretty much the much smaller brother to formula racing overhere. Anybody who is anybody sails a formula type boat. (F18, F20, A-cat, Tornado). If you want to develop your skills than you have to sail a formula boat as well, simply because the competition is there and not in any OD fleet. My point, sailing in a OD class is not always best to reach your potential. I can learn alot more in a 30 boat formula fleet than in a 6 boat OD fleet.

I feel that sailors in my own larger area have made a choice; Formula. Especially F18. So my situation dictated a choice between racing in a OD class with 2 others or racing in a much larger F18 fleet. I didn;t want an F18 and so I went for the next best thing. A boat that allows me to singlehand and doublehand and still race first in win in a much larger F18 fleet. Funny thing is that the active FX-one sailors overhere are doing the exact same thing, simply because they don't have the numbers to OD race. My question to those with "different opinions" is : :"what is the advantage of an OD boat when you still race open class against other NON-OD boats ?" My answer to that question was :"None" so we created another open rules class (formula) that suited our wished and needs in a way F18, F20 and A-cats couldn't.




I fully agree to that. To bad there aren't any Taipans or F16's In Kuwait. But then again there weren;t any FX-one overthere a few years ago as well.

Things do chance sometimes.


One question though, why does F16 always need to be "contexted". I don't see many people doing the same with the other brands ? Surely these have interesting contexts as well ?

Wouter

If the FX-one is too fast than forget about all the other option named, except the EU I-17, because they are all faster still. I think the difference between an A-cat and the FX-one is 8 points under Texel handicap system = 5 minutes per hour faster.





I think we all are keeping it positive and try not to put down any "other" design. Which is good. Also none of these boats are bad choices. There are no bad choices anymore when looking at these modern cats. In basis they are all good boats. So the decision on which to choose need to be made on what your personally prefer, or rather what (small ?)difference between boats you regard as attractive. I don't think that there is a perfect choice out there. One-size doesn't fit all.

Now I can tell you what I disliked about the FX-one but I won't as that would be unethical to the sailors who are very happy with their FX-one as well as the Hobie company. Also none of us want to be caught in an embarrashing situation. Example : only a few weeks ago an FX-one sailor was explaining to me how my F16 was difficult to sail through the surf; the guy really didn't know what he was talking about. He never sailed any F16 while I sailed both of these boats in many conditions and found that there is really NO significant difference in how they handle the surf. So I think most of us stick to stating what we like best about our own boats and hope that that will help you. This will indeed make the "help" confusing.

I trust that you did a search on past posts on the type of boats that are being discussed. A search on this forum. You will find alot of past comments that may help you.

One other option might be to start asking clearly defined questions. Example :

How heavy are you and could you right boat X ? With enough answers you will be able to establish the min weight required to right a particular design. People will answer these questions as answering these is different from stating :"I dislike boat X because I couldn't right it at such and such weight while I can right boat Y.

Also the way somebody views a particular type and how he values it will always be strongly influenced by his or her prefered use. Example ; people may love the handling of boat X but I may personally don't care much for it as all my club races are dominate by F18 and F20's (much much faster boats). So I will think badly of boat X mostly because I want to be sailing among the regular fleet at my club and not feel comfortable because of the superior handling but come in 15 minutes later. In another post a good example of such balancing of conflicting desires was given. By the guy selling his FX-one because he didn't enjoy being way in front all the time. So he may prefer boat X while I, who does sail often in a very High performance fleet, would dislike boat X and much more prefer a FX-one (in this example then, because F16 is really the at for me)

So my advice would be to specify what you really want and expect of your new boat and then see which one suits that wishlist the best.

Wouter

Sarah, I can only support what Mary has written - get an FX One.
If this is the more popular boat, then go for it.
As most people in this forum are from the US they are more knowledgeable about the Inter 17, which is not so popular outside the US. Also as the FX One is still pretty new in the US, not so many know about that boat.
Both boats are reliable and of reasonable quality. I like the rudder system of the FX One better as well as the rudder performance, but again subjective.

You may want to consider as well, if you have sufficient access to spare parts. If there are more Hobies around, it is obvious that you have better access to spare parts wiht the Hobies.
So let´s see you with your boat soon.

Fritz

Be sure to test first if you can manage to drag a hobie FX-one trough the (hot and loose ?) sand on your own.

Hi Sarah,

If there are other FX-ones in the area, get a FX-one. That way, when you decide the boat is too big for you, you can sell it easier.

I sail an F16HP by myself sometime and it is almost too big a boat for me at 65 Kg however with crew (130 Kg total), the boat is perfect.

Jennifer
Taipan 4.9 #262
Tiger #870

Sarah,

The minimum crew weight for the FX-one is 72 Kg so if you plan to race the boat legally, you will need to carry additional weight on board if you weigh less than that.

Jennifer
Taipan 4.9 #262
Tiger #870

Hi Sarah,
Being a light skipper means you have to choose a boat you can sail easily, since you`re looking at single-handers, just a few points :
-You must be able to get the boat on & off a trailer, rig and de-rig, and get it to the water and back again, sometimes alone if there is no-one else to help.
- You MUST be able to right the boat alone, and preferably without the use of any aide other than a righting line. Why ? I don`t think a righting pole, bag or any other device that adds a step to righting the boat can be safely used when it really counts - all the demonstrations of these devices are done in calm water in light wind, when you are unlikely to capsize anyway. Try using a righting bag in strong wind in big swell, when you are doing your best just to keep your feet on the boat, now fill a bag with water and sling it over your shoulder (I have, on the Dart 18, it doesn`t work). Now capsize close to rocks or the surf line, or in a shipping lane just for interest. Or try standing on a pole in the same conditions. You have to be able to right a boat QUICKLY at all times.
- You must be at or near the competitive weight range of the boat in most conditions. Why ? You might win a few light-wind races but it`s no fun struggling to depower the boat while your opposition sails past you in over 10knots.
- You must be able to comfortably handle the loads on mainsheet, downhaul, spinnaker etc, or you will just exhaust yourself rapidly trying to keep up with the rest, and your performance will drop off toward the end of a regatta, unless you are very strong and fit for your weight.

I don`t know the FX or Inter 17, so can`t comment, but I believe they are both the same weight (roughly) as a Dart 18. Unless their masts are much lighter than the Dart, you won`t right these boats alone. I also believe both these boats have fairly stiff masts which will increase the loads on mainsheet & downhaul, and you might struggle to depower the rig a bit more than you would on a boat with a more flexible, lighter mast.
You do need to choose a boat that you can race in a class, though. It won`t help to sail a boat that no-one else has unless you are ok with sailing in an open class if your club supports one. If you choose F16 you will be the first one, but others might follow and a class could grow, but it`s always easier to go with the current and join an existing class. I did that for two years, and sailed a boat that was totally unsuitable for my style of sailing (I like adjustable, tunable rigs), so I really wasn`t enjoying myself. I then switched to a boat that allows fully adjustable everything, and I won`t look back.
What I`m saying is that if you enjoy sailing the boat, you will enjoy racing it, but if you don`t enjoy sailing it, chances are you will struggle to do well, and will hate racing it.
Just my opinion.

Steve

Sarah,

I sail with Harper out here in the Caribbean. I have a I-17 Euro, and we just have fun going at each other.

Have you sailed the FX-1's down there? Is so, and it was good, ta da.....that is a good sign!

Whatever you choose, you won't lose...you will have fun.

Here is the REAL question,.....all of us want to come down and sail in a race in Kuwait!......can you all get a sponser to provide shipping for our boats and we will all come !...heck, we can sleep on the beach in tents if we had to!

It would be a great event for the cat racers and for the World to see!

..just an idea and welcome to the sport!...bring your friends!

regards,

Bruce
St. Croix
US Virgin Island
I-17 euro

ps, by the way, your FX will be the Euro vesion, with the really cool one piece aluminum mast,..not the combo/job the USA gets,..I looked at Harpers mast and it is real nice..

****. As if the A-cats are all identical. Hell, you'll be hard pressed to find identical F18's even when only looking at Hobie Tiger F18's. First thing F18 sailors do when buying a Tiger is spend an additional 3000 Euro's on modifying the boat to full F18 competitiveness. With respect to F16's, the bulk of the class is Taipan 4.9 based, a design that has been raced hard for over 15 years now and ample tuning help is available. I'm sure that are differences between the classes in this respect but you make it sound like we are a freak class without history or past development in tuning.

well i have to say ur advice has been unbelievably helpful and i really appreciate you guys taking the time to help me.

as for the comments about being able to drag the cat on the hot sand alone and being able to rig and de-rig alone and the whole issue about getting the cat on and off the trailer .. thats not really a problem though because we have a dock and our house is right next to the ocean so i wont have to transport it

there would always be help around too so thats not a problem either

brobru: that would be great!! ya im sure i could find a sponsor .. lol and i doubt you would have to sleep in a tent haha.

oh and btw i thought id show you guys some pics of kuwait for if you r interested in visiting one day .. here are some pics taken by a friend of mine ...

this is a pic of the kuwait towers

and another of one of the malls here (almost all malls have docks right in front of them for those who wish to sail over there).

and if you are interested there are more pics at this gallery http://al-7ussaini.deviantart.com/gallery/ most of those pictures were taken in kuwait.

Sailing in Kuwait! now wouldnt that be a kickass statement.

Anyway, was the FX-1 built to compete vs the A-Cat? sure has an A-cat resemblence.

No I think the FX-1 is more a modern interpretation of the H17 - A solo sailor with spin capability. The FX is about 140lbs heavier than an A-cat.

Sarah - Here in the Tampabay area Jennifer (who posted above) pretty much kicks everyone's butts with her Taipan 4.9. I think important factors to look at are the ability to right the boat yourself and how well you can depower the boat when the wind picks up. If you can't depower the boat enough when it's windy you just can't go fast enough to be competative. The best thing to do is try and test sail as many different boats as you can and see which one your most comfortable on. Most cat sailors are willing to take you out on their boats to try them out.
Good Luck,