I was watching my Catamaran DVD by George Tillard - absolutely fantastic – (http://www.catamaran-sailing-dvd.com/) and many of the F18 sailors use compasses to accurately monitor wind shifts. Do any of you use compasses if so what type and where do you put it? I would have thought it would be difficult to read from the tramp unless you had a large digital display and I'm sure that would cost. Then the question is it really worth the cost I'm sure most like myself just use intuition and surrounding geography to gage a shift in wind.

Yes, absolutely, always have done since I started sailing cats in 1970's. This is the current set-up that I have on my Stealth:




I have found though that compasses are only really useful on the sea as it is quicker on a lake to use the scenery. My current compass is a Plastimo - cheap, but effective. I tried digital but couldn't get on with it and it was expensive anyway.

John,

how can you read the numbers on the compass, while out on the trapeze? We tried an analog compass, but it was unusable as the distance from the trapeze to the centerline was to large. It got even worse when covered in spray.

Hi Rolf,

That's never been a problem! The numbers are quite large and because it's a tactical compass, you're not reading bearings. Instead you're only looking for say, Green 4 or Red 3 or Red 2 etc.

What spray?

Oh yeah, I remember my Tornado days now! Actually spray is not really a problem on the Stealth - flat bottomed hulls you see?

Seriously though, I had similar setups on all my Tornados except one which had twin compasses just behind the mainbeam (fitted on the deckhatches). If it was really honking, spray could sometimes be a problem but that was more from the fact that I was hiking the b***dy boat! Now you're out on the wire as well surely life is easier, isn't it?

Life sure is better on the T now John, the double trapeeze is a good thing. You dont even have to be fit as a skipper anymore, as the crew does all the work while the skipper "skippers"
The hardest thing I do these days, is crossing the boat while tacking in a blow. Need to be fast..

We also had a tactical compass, but were unable to read the headings. It was the standard "Silva" compass, which I guess you have years of experience with. Perhaps we should check our eyes again..
We mostly tried to use it to judge the starting line, and shifts on the course, but as we usually are able to see lots of distinctive landmarks we dont need it while practicing (those mountains and peaks are good for one thing at least). When we travel to new places, where the land is flat or non-distinctive, we feel the need for a compass really bad.. Especially if the course is so long that we dont see the top mark from the starting line, which is not uncommon with the T's.

I like the electronic compasses, as they have certain memory functions that tell you about headers/lifts and other useful stuff. They are also far lighter than the magnetic compasses and have better readability (in my opinion). Too bad that they are really expensive!



Spray.. Well, it is part of the experience..

This is good $hit

Tacktick Micro Compass part number T060

http://www.tacktick.com



Spinnaker boats without self tacking jibs use the spin pole bracket. part number T008



For all others use the deck braket. Just drill some holes in the corners of the bracket and cable tie it through the tramp just on the port side of the mast base and just behind the front beam. part number T004

Steve,

Are you going to tell us how much it costs as well ?

Still waiting for this baby to get cheaper then a new jib.

Wouter

Oops! Sorry to have misled everyone. I really thought that my compass was a Plastimo.

Just checked and it's a SUUNTO - really good for the price. This is it:



Yes Rolf, I've used a Silva in the past but (and this may be your problem) I found the numbers weren't particularly clear!!!!! Interestingly enough the newer Silva 103P compasses are much more readable than the ones I used to have.

I do like this Suunto though, notice how nice and large the numbers are above?

The Suunto unit looks much better than the Silva we have.



The price for the Tactick units are horrendous. About EUR850 for the advanced one, and EUR400 for the little one.

Loved the music collection in the background of your photo. I guess most of the users here dont know T-Rex, Alison Moyet or Foreigner (very 80's). The digital photography book should really have a chapter on background selection

About $600 Australian I believe. I needed a compass for the F-18 and also needed a new countdown watch. This has both incorperated in one and is very visual.

Rolf, is that a late model Silva? I thought that the numbers were much clearer than that! It doesn't look much different to the one I had (and didn't get along with).

So are you using the Silva or have you splashed out on a Tacktick?

You're right about photo backgrounds! Lucky I didn't have my Scandinavian Thrash Metal collection in the shot!!

Chaps I use the same model, But a really old one as the numbers are white on black and easier to read.

I also made a custom (Balsa / Glass / Epoxy) mount for it so I have mine on my SPi pole about 5cm infront of the mast.

Love them to bits, but as you say, the Silva unit is heavy. Might go double digital on the next boat (wehnI've saved up for it)

The picture shows an old model Silva, it came with the boat when we bought it. But they still build them, and they are quite expensive. about EUR200? I think they use them in Lasers and Europe's?

If I could afford it, I would have gone for a Tacktick! We dont use it, as it is too hard to read. Especially so when on the trapeze, the numbers are just to small. We make do with the GPS unit for now, but it's not allowed when class racing.
I just checked prices on magnetic compasses, and they are really ridicully expensive! Might as well fork out for a digital compass!

Scandinavian Trash Metal? I knew scandinavian Death Metal was well known (Gorgoroth and others), but Trash Metal???

The countdown timer on the tacktick is great. It has improved my starts as there is no asking what time your crew has or looking at your own watch. You are able to visualize your starts to a higher level. They are a great warranty and repair/replacement program as well.

Watching the countdown is something I definately give my crew responsibility for (it's different if one-up of course). I can keep my head out of the boat, and play the traveller to control speed while he can tell me the time left when asked. He also have time to watch the other boats further on down/up the line and the course for significant changes.
Our timer gives a sound signal at 4min, 1min, 30sec and every second from 10 seconds down to the start.

Ok Rolf, you caught me out!!


BTW I think that Suunto compass that I use (B-95 SAIL) is only £99 - about 145Euro. The only problem is mounting it. As you can see I have it angled on a mount on the main beam just below the mast.

For all I know, there might very well be some well-known trash metal bands here. Should I look and send you some samples if I find something?


£99 for a compass is still more than I would want to pay for 1600 years old technology. Call me cheap, but yet..
Hmm, looking at the old Silva, the gradients seem to be just printed on some kind of paper.. Time to go looking on the internet and check if someone has done any surgery on these. If I could replace the gradients/print with something larger, it would do very well..


Followup:

Found this: http://home.swipnet.se/ansar/c24.html

Now, I have to decide if I want to risk screwing up the old, but still expensive, compass.

Reading the blurb on the Ansar site, it looks as though the Suunto B-95 uses the same principal and numbering as the Ansar 1.

But $220US seems a lot to pay for a modification, even after reading the description of what needs to be done.
I guess Swedish labour rates must be VERY high

I do like the way the Ansar system works though, it reads as though it would be easy and intuitive to use. Surely there must be someone else doing something similar?

Used the compass on my watch once when the haar rolled in one evening....

Ugh! Marstrøm -> pre-preg everything -> autoclave -> Sweden == $$$$$ => Tornado == insanely amounts of $$$$$
My only comfort in thinking about the cost of goods made in Sweden, is that it would be even more expensive if made in Norway (except for salmon)

I did not find anything else about compass modification. I also wonder how the ansar system really works. How many "dots" does Ansar put on the compass card to make it usable? The 'sliding lines' should be easy to make.
He says that he has worked with Silva for 25 years, and the compass house sometimes cracks for him while modifying it
Looks like a really good system, wonder why no manufacturers have copied/bought/patented it?

This Ansar person seems to be quite a character, I just read his "super-light travelling" article, and found it amusing (if off-topic): Super light travelling

George, you surly are joking when you suggest using a wrist-compass?