| Re: beams
[Re: mousetrap]
#272757 05/25/14 03:19 AM 05/25/14 03:19 AM | thricebitten
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Unregistered | Hi Dave,
Nothing in the building restrictions that I can see regarding grade of alloy. The following is the only applicable part I can see that effects beam materials.
"The main beam and rear beam shall each be of straight aluminium alloy of constant section along its length. Holes may be drilled in the beams for fastenings only. Holes remaining after the removal of redundant fittings are permitted. 6.2 The main and rear beam shall be; a rectangular hollow section 50 mm plus or minus 1 mm by 39 mm plus or minus 1 mm by minimum 3 mm wall. Beam edges may be rounded to a maximum of 2 mm radius."
From my experience this size only leaves Mossies with a choice of a standard section from Capral, available at most alloy fabricators/sellers around the country. Though it does come in a choice? of internal corners rounded or not, rounded internal corners is preferrable, in particular if you are not bolting beams right through.
Have you found a alternative in this size?
| | | Re: beams
[Re: mousetrap]
#272760 05/25/14 07:00 AM 05/25/14 07:00 AM |
Joined: May 2007 Posts: 416 Matt_Stone
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Posts: 416 | I have just bought beams for myself from capral and cost $72 for a 6.5M lenght 50.8 x 39.2 x 3mm untreated and pick up. it has internal radius.
Matt
Last edited by Matt_Stone; 05/25/14 07:01 AM.
| | | Re: beams
[Re: Matt_Stone]
#272763 05/25/14 07:12 AM 05/25/14 07:12 AM |
Joined: Apr 2013 Posts: 858 Victoria Australia Pirate
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Posts: 858 Victoria Australia | Good price Matt, I expected it to be more than that for a full length Does the association carry the beams ? (Reason I ask is I need 2new beams for 1740 and I also want a new mast aswell, killing two birds here ) Yar, & this ere post be done without a sin'le drop o' rum passin' me lips
Kingy started with Impara Cadet #3 / Mosquito #245 & now Mosquitos #1182 & #1740 | | | Re: beams
[Re: Matt_Stone]
#272768 05/25/14 10:03 AM 05/25/14 10:03 AM |
Joined: Apr 2012 Posts: 11 Warners bay , nsw , Australia mousetrap OP
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Posts: 11 Warners bay , nsw , Australia | Was not sure if there were different grades of alloy as there is with stainless steel. Good tip on the internal round, I would not have thought of that. At that price I will be re-beaming next weekend. Thanks for the replies.
Cheers,Dave. CHA-CHING 922 BITE ME 1749
| | | Re: beams
[Re: mousetrap]
#272785 05/26/14 02:36 AM 05/26/14 02:36 AM | thricebitten
Unregistered
| thricebitten
Unregistered | Hi Dave,
What boat are you re beaming? I thought we did all 3 Mossies I got from Port Lincoln 1747,1749 & 1760, remember buying a number of lengths of beam section from local alloy supplier, even had some left over, in fact sold the last left over beam to Matt a while back. | | | Re: beams
[Re: ]
#272833 05/28/14 08:01 AM 05/28/14 08:01 AM |
Joined: Apr 2012 Posts: 11 Warners bay , nsw , Australia mousetrap OP
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Posts: 11 Warners bay , nsw , Australia | Hi Gary Re-beaming 1749 "BITE ME". Found a small hairline crack 5mm inboard side of where the tie bolts to the main beam. Small amount of corrosion looks like the cause.
Cheers,Dave. CHA-CHING 922 BITE ME 1749
| | | Re: beams
[Re: mousetrap]
#272863 05/29/14 02:37 AM 05/29/14 02:37 AM | thricebitten
Unregistered
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Unregistered | The joy of getting older can't remember stuff , obviously didn't re beam 1749 | | | Re: beams
[Re: Matt_Stone]
#273442 06/25/14 12:49 AM 06/25/14 12:49 AM |
Joined: Jun 2014 Posts: 1 California aparkfind
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Posts: 1 California | hmmm thats where daniels cracked too, put a 20x40x3mm plate/ washer on the strap when bolting on to the cross beam . Matt Agree with the mate about aluminium cross beams .
Last edited by aparkfind; 06/25/14 12:50 AM.
| | | Re: beams
[Re: aparkfind]
#273695 07/04/14 02:10 AM 07/04/14 02:10 AM |
Joined: Jun 2009 Posts: 76 Got Wood
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Posts: 76 | Just out of interest in regard to the mast sections from the association, are they anodised? or natural?
Cheers
Taipan AUS329 'Got Wood' Mosquito 752 'Sticky Finger' HARDWOOD RACING TEAM
| | | Re: beams
[Re: mousetrap]
#273711 07/04/14 05:36 PM 07/04/14 05:36 PM |
Joined: May 2007 Posts: 416 Matt_Stone
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Posts: 416 | | | | Re: beams
[Re: SFJF 1747]
#274067 07/22/14 04:37 AM 07/22/14 04:37 AM | thricebitten
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Unregistered | Hi Doug, No need to rub it in, I thought we had established the fact I don't have a memory . The Capral section doesn't have a radius on outside corners. Phil WS does this himself before he gets them anodised, to supply on the boats he sells (which are not sold by the association). On the beams I did replace, 1760 and . I did the radius myself, it's not that difficult, I did a lot of it with sandpaper, before anodising. Getting them anodised is not difficult in the Eastern Suburbs (mine where done around Cheltenham Road I think?) as long as you are not in a rush and can wait till they have enough for a bath lot. Contact Phillip WS direct to check if VMCA has any beams For Sale and if they are anodised. | | | Re: beams
[Re: mousetrap]
#274093 07/22/14 10:54 PM 07/22/14 10:54 PM |
Joined: Apr 2013 Posts: 858 Victoria Australia Pirate
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Posts: 858 Victoria Australia | 2 questions ..... 1/ Is it within the rules to "radius" the beams ? I know there's a limit on the deck/hull radius, so logic would suggest ... 2/ Wouldn't it be best to actually fit the beams to the boat and also the associated hardware (IE: trampoline, traveler bar, dolphin striker etc etc) And then strip it all off and THEN get it anadosied ???? Cant see the sense in drilling holes and exposing raw alloy after the anadosing Reason I ask is..... 1182 has an anodised rear beam and a 'painted' front beam, the rear looks a treat until you remove a component (in my case the traveler bar), the corrosion around the holes that were obviously drilled post anodising is a concern, and yet the corrosion on the pained front beam is probably less in comparision (more on this comming to Shy's thread soon).......
Last edited by PIRATE; 07/22/14 11:00 PM. Reason: Cause the "smart-phone" aint !!!
Yar, & this ere post be done without a sin'le drop o' rum passin' me lips
Kingy started with Impara Cadet #3 / Mosquito #245 & now Mosquitos #1182 & #1740 | | | Re: beams
[Re: mousetrap]
#274105 07/23/14 04:55 PM 07/23/14 04:55 PM |
Joined: Jan 2007 Posts: 81 To windward of you! Sixth Element
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Posts: 81 To windward of you! | Yes there is a rule on radius of the beams. Rule 6.2. I would suggest it is a good idea for everyone to read through the rules at some stage. If you read the rules and check your own boat it saves the embarrasment when it doesnt measure at a regatta. http://www.theracingcat.com/uploads/Mosquito_BRR.pdf
"Sixth Element" 1782 MK2 w/spinnaker. Lake Bonney Y.C. National Sec. / S.A President / S.A Measurer / Commodore LBYC
| | | Re: beams
[Re: mousetrap]
#274110 07/23/14 06:21 PM 07/23/14 06:21 PM |
Joined: May 2006 Posts: 1,383 Kingston SE South Australia JeffS
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Posts: 1,383 Kingston SE South Australia | Make sure you measure the boat for maximum width before drilling holes. Don't drill any holes in the beam until you check out the hull where it will be mounted, you may prefer to plug the holes and put bolts in a new area
Jeff Southall Current boats Nacra 5.8 1703 Animal Scanning Services Nacra 5.8 1667 Ram Raider Nacra 18 Square Arrow 1576
| | | Re: beams
[Re: Matt_Stone]
#274126 07/24/14 06:07 AM 07/24/14 06:07 AM |
Joined: Apr 2013 Posts: 858 Victoria Australia Pirate
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Posts: 858 Victoria Australia | seeing I'm going to replace both the beams on Karp I may as well 'radius' the beams while I'm at it..... YAY .... no more scun skin How would a router go at making the radius edge over a flapper disc I have heaps of bits that would make a very nice curve and several that I'm not fussed in loosing ... Other than that does it have to be a curve, could I for example simply bevel the edge with a plane ??? Yar, & this ere post be done without a sin'le drop o' rum passin' me lips
Kingy started with Impara Cadet #3 / Mosquito #245 & now Mosquitos #1182 & #1740 | | | Re: beams
[Re: mousetrap]
#274129 07/24/14 06:36 AM 07/24/14 06:36 AM |
Joined: Oct 2010 Posts: 92 South Oz Phillip
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Posts: 92 South Oz | To support Peter’s suggestion and with no malice directed to Matt, if you decide to remove the corner/arris of the beams, BRR states a maximum radius of 2mm. BRR 6.2 The main and rear beam shall be; a rectangular hollow section 50 mm plus or minus 1 mm by 39 mm plus or minus 1 mm by minimum 3 mm wall. Beam edges may be rounded to a maximum of 2 mm radius. From the Building Instructions: A 2mm radius arris can be removed from the cross beams. This is a restricted measurement! Make a radius guide by drilling a 4mm hole through a piece of sheetmetal. Remove the corner along the tangent lines. See Diag. 8.2. Remove the beam arris. Plane off the bulk with a woodwork hand plane, a No.4 or No.5 is ideal. Draw file with a mill 2nd cut file to final shape. Smooth with emery cloth.I have heard of using a router with a radius cutter. This would also work but ensure the correct size cutter is selected and it is tungsten tipped as a HSS will dull before completion. Removing too much material from the corners will compromise the strength of the beam and it is a fact that mozzie beams are notoriously under engineered.
Tortured ply is clearly beautiful. Mozzie Aldebaran VI 1827
| | | Re: beams
[Re: mousetrap]
#274130 07/24/14 06:51 AM 07/24/14 06:51 AM |
Joined: Aug 2011 Posts: 182 Grafton, NSW Greg/Debra
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Posts: 182 Grafton, NSW | I find this all very interesting but I am moved to ask, why put an external radius on the beams? Is it for appearance, comfort of the sailor(s) or weight reduction?
1140 Gadfly 1434 J.I.B.E. 1727 Atreus
| | | Re: beams
[Re: mousetrap]
#274156 07/24/14 05:06 PM 07/24/14 05:06 PM |
Joined: Jan 2007 Posts: 81 To windward of you! Sixth Element
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Posts: 81 To windward of you! | hi Greg,
The main reason is for the comfort of the sailor. The new beams have a sharp square edge and they can cut if you slide into them etc.
"Sixth Element" 1782 MK2 w/spinnaker. Lake Bonney Y.C. National Sec. / S.A President / S.A Measurer / Commodore LBYC
| | | Re: beams
[Re: Sixth Element]
#274167 07/24/14 10:04 PM 07/24/14 10:04 PM |
Joined: Apr 2013 Posts: 858 Victoria Australia Pirate
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Posts: 858 Victoria Australia | Whilst Karp's & Shy's front beams arent radiused I certainly intend to do the new beams on Karp prior to anodising, and Shy will get the router treatment after all the burrs have been sanded off Shy's front beams edge is nasty, years & years of mast raising/lowering and other unknown gear being dragged over it have left a serated edge specifically around the mast base ...... The marks on the boom would suggest it was loosely tied there during transporting.... I think that the removal of the edge other for human skin would be to stop such flaring of the square edge...... I dont hold much hope but I'll try for a pic of the nasty edge on Shy. Is there any advantage in cutting a radius on the rear beam ??? There's a great big traveler beam sitting on them !!!!! Yar, & this ere post be done without a sin'le drop o' rum passin' me lips
Kingy started with Impara Cadet #3 / Mosquito #245 & now Mosquitos #1182 & #1740 | | | Re: beams
[Re: Matt_Stone]
#274872 08/20/14 08:33 PM 08/20/14 08:33 PM |
Joined: Apr 2014 Posts: 3 SFJF 1747
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Posts: 3 | So a quick update: Got internal radius beam sections from Capral as per Matt's notes and used a Tungsten Carbide 2mm rad router bit on a hand router which worked a treat to produce a consistent 2mm external radius. In disassembling the old front beam and jumper strap assembly I noticed a fair bit of corrosion on the dolphin striker tube module so will have to replace this also. It also didn't have a great amount of tension on it which is a bit of a concern which leads me to the question... I am a little perplexed why Mozzie setups don't have any tension adjustment in the design of this part. On my previous cat (a Paper Tiger) it was essential to have a bit of pre-tension on the front beam assembly to ensure no sag of the beam when under full load, and when new it allowed the jumper strap to settle and then be rechecked/tensioned as required. Is this something the Mozzie doesn't need or is not allowed in the plans? To me it would seem like a good idea with the high loads on the rig with spinakers/double traps etc?? I was thinking I might replace it with this type of assembly.. Dolphin Striker PT Be interested in anyone's thoughts and latest setups. Cheers Doug | | | Re: beams
[Re: SFJF 1747]
#274873 08/20/14 10:38 PM 08/20/14 10:38 PM |
Joined: Apr 2013 Posts: 858 Victoria Australia Pirate
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Posts: 858 Victoria Australia | I've seen a few that have had a non-adjustable striker setup, they are however pre-loaded during the build..... these boats have been in the 1650 numbers and up
Both my mozzies do have an adjustable striker as does the plan set I have which specifies a 5/16th stainless bolt with locknut & adjuster nut being tig welded to the down tube under the mast step.
I recall breaking a bolt on my first mozzie (245) way back when.... Yar, & this ere post be done without a sin'le drop o' rum passin' me lips
Kingy started with Impara Cadet #3 / Mosquito #245 & now Mosquitos #1182 & #1740 | | | Re: beams
[Re: mousetrap]
#274874 08/20/14 11:52 PM 08/20/14 11:52 PM |
Joined: May 2006 Posts: 1,383 Kingston SE South Australia JeffS
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Posts: 1,383 Kingston SE South Australia | With the non adjustable they were preloaded but the strap was also riveted so the strap didn't slop around and elongate the bolt holes thereby undoing the pretension, if the rivets are snapped off more than likely there's not much pretension. Bit hard to check as you need to take the main beam off. Can be scary to see how much corrosion there is between the stainless strap and aluminium beam
Jeff Southall Current boats Nacra 5.8 1703 Animal Scanning Services Nacra 5.8 1667 Ram Raider Nacra 18 Square Arrow 1576
| | | Re: beams
[Re: mousetrap]
#274906 08/22/14 12:57 AM 08/22/14 12:57 AM |
Joined: May 2007 Posts: 416 Matt_Stone
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Posts: 416 | The strap is pre tention but after a while the beams settle in and the strap stretches. With no load on mast step the beam should have 3mm rise tension so when boat is loaded up the beam should be 1mm rise or straight. im adding a tension device to mine tho. cos I can
Last edited by Matt_Stone; 08/22/14 12:59 AM.
| | | Re: beams
[Re: mousetrap]
#274907 08/22/14 04:54 AM 08/22/14 04:54 AM |
Joined: Sep 2006 Posts: 586 Hobart, Tasmania, Oz. Dazz
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Posts: 586 Hobart, Tasmania, Oz. | Is 3mm enough? most cats i have worked with require 10mm. 3mm would be pretty easy to compress under sailing loads, especially sloop rigged.
C2 AUS 222 by Goodall design "Darph Bobo"
| | | Re: beams
[Re: SFJF 1747]
#274928 08/23/14 06:16 PM 08/23/14 06:16 PM |
Joined: Apr 2013 Posts: 858 Victoria Australia Pirate
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Posts: 858 Victoria Australia | ..... I am a little perplexed why Mozzie setups don't have any tension adjustment in the design of this part ..... does this help ????? Scorpian's setup..... TwiceShy's setup..... Yar, & this ere post be done without a sin'le drop o' rum passin' me lips
Kingy started with Impara Cadet #3 / Mosquito #245 & now Mosquitos #1182 & #1740 | | | Re: beams
[Re: Matt_Stone]
#274929 08/23/14 06:35 PM 08/23/14 06:35 PM |
Joined: Apr 2013 Posts: 858 Victoria Australia Pirate
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Posts: 858 Victoria Australia | i stand to be corrected, i looked on the plans and the building rules and says nothing about tension, so personaly i would tension the beam so when the rig tension is on it has a positive bend of 1mm old trick from former state tittle holders.... hang the boat from a solid beam / rafter etc so that only the transom is resting on the ground that hanging point is the centre tube / front beam connection point, use the TUBE and NOT the beam as the tie point adjust the striker tension until it is FIRM but not overly tight..... lockup the locking nut .... done This is a BASELINE set point.... a starting point for the fine tuners to play from, add slightly more tension for heavier weather and slightly less tension for light weather sailors. The amount you'd adjust would be (pending on the thread's per inch of the adjuster bolt) would be at most 3/4 of a turn, fine threaded bolts would obviously require more. Final check is to rig the boat fully and reef in the main (and jib if fitted) to a high pointing position, sighting along the beam the beam should be dead straight .... if its not you need to make further adjustments. Yar, & this ere post be done without a sin'le drop o' rum passin' me lips
Kingy started with Impara Cadet #3 / Mosquito #245 & now Mosquitos #1182 & #1740 | | | Re: beams
[Re: mousetrap]
#274936 08/24/14 03:10 AM 08/24/14 03:10 AM |
Joined: May 2007 Posts: 416 Matt_Stone
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Posts: 416 | In the photos you have there, those bolts are a little small and have known to fail, I'm putting in a 1\2 inch Unc thread as the striker post has to 19mm, so I will lathe up a nylon bush to keep the adjuster center of the 19mm tube
Last edited by Matt_Stone; 08/24/14 03:15 AM.
| | | Re: beams
[Re: mousetrap]
#275804 10/13/14 06:29 AM 10/13/14 06:29 AM |
Joined: Nov 2012 Posts: 70 Port Vincent, SA Hack
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Posts: 70 Port Vincent, SA | Hi all,
I will be doing a fairly urgent re-beam on the front of #1769 in the next week, due to a crack through both sides at the dolphin striker strap bolt. Following the advice of several experienced campaigners at the Meningie Nats, I added more tension to my beam by using washers as spacers between the mast post and strap. I think a tensioning bolt would be essential, and I'll try to incorporate one into the new setup. With our state titles in 3 weeks, I need to get this done fairly quickly. Have read all info pertaining to rounding the beam arris, but is there a regulation/recommendation regarding the angle to cut the beam ends??
Hack
'Goodnight Nurse' #1769 & #1636
| | | Re: beams
[Re: Hack]
#275811 10/13/14 08:02 AM 10/13/14 08:02 AM |
Joined: Apr 2013 Posts: 858 Victoria Australia Pirate
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Posts: 858 Victoria Australia | Page 22 BUILDING INSTRUCTIONS FOR THE MOSQUITO CATAMARAN (rewritten November 1995) Yar, & this ere post be done without a sin'le drop o' rum passin' me lips
Kingy started with Impara Cadet #3 / Mosquito #245 & now Mosquitos #1182 & #1740 | | | Re: beams
[Re: mousetrap]
#275840 10/15/14 02:28 AM 10/15/14 02:28 AM |
Joined: Oct 2010 Posts: 92 South Oz Phillip
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Posts: 92 South Oz | Hi Hack, Thanks to Kingy for posting the suggested design from the Bldg Inst. The cut-off angle suggested is the 25mm off-set. There is no regulation. This angle is for aesthetics. Any greater off-set may interfere with the location of the outer beam bolt. The tension bolt (15 x 8 ss) is required as it removes the load from the inwale, it will be compressed if you don't have it. Study the lower diagram; it illustrates fitting 5/4.8mm(3/16") monel or SS rivets. These rivets will reduce the sheer loads from the strap-to-beam attachment. Do not rely on just the tension and beam bolts to resist this sheer force. The over-all length may vary but measure your existing beam for an indication. 2147mm was lifted off #1765 which has moderate hull width, wider than some, narrower than others. It has a maximum overall width of 2185mm. I assume you will recycle major components. Contact me direct through the MCASA if you need more info as the diagram is my production. Phillip P
Last edited by Phillip; 10/15/14 02:30 AM.
Tortured ply is clearly beautiful. Mozzie Aldebaran VI 1827
| | | Re: beams
[Re: Phillip]
#275841 10/15/14 02:36 AM 10/15/14 02:36 AM |
Joined: Apr 2013 Posts: 858 Victoria Australia Pirate
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Posts: 858 Victoria Australia | ...Study the lower diagram .... yeah sorry about that bit being in the shade of my hands and iPhone but it wasn't what I was after for hack at the time if you click on the pic it should take you straight to photobucket for a larger version
Last edited by Pirate; 10/15/14 02:37 AM. Reason: someone's been eating crisps and the 's' key is jaming
Yar, & this ere post be done without a sin'le drop o' rum passin' me lips
Kingy started with Impara Cadet #3 / Mosquito #245 & now Mosquitos #1182 & #1740 | | | Re: beams
[Re: mousetrap]
#275842 10/15/14 02:44 AM 10/15/14 02:44 AM |
Joined: Nov 2012 Posts: 70 Port Vincent, SA Hack
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Posts: 70 Port Vincent, SA | Cheers Kingy and Phil,
I had a feeling the answer would be the one you provided, but I thought I should check. Thanks for the useful diagram.
If I feature in this weeks race report, then you'll know the job was successful on Saturday.
Cheerio
Hack
'Goodnight Nurse' #1769 & #1636
| | | Re: beams
[Re: mousetrap]
#280593 09/24/15 05:42 AM 09/24/15 05:42 AM |
Joined: Apr 2009 Posts: 88 Matthew Dawson
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Posts: 88 | Some more questions on beams. What are the pros and cons of painting vs anodising vs powder coating? Does anyone have any experience with non-anodised aluminium coated with Nyalic? http://www.thesailboatshop.com.au/category-s/103.htm
Last edited by Matthew Dawson; 09/24/15 11:49 PM.
Currently between boats Previously … Cobra 570 Cobra 581 Mosquito 126 Arafura Cadet 738 | | | Re: beams
[Re: Matthew Dawson]
#280604 09/24/15 04:27 PM 09/24/15 04:27 PM |
Joined: Apr 2013 Posts: 858 Victoria Australia Pirate
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Posts: 858 Victoria Australia | as said..... anodising is full coverage protection whereas paint doesn't give that level of protection. Another big disadvantage is that the paint chips quite easily, right in the area where the mast lays while you are attaching the shrouds prior to standing the mast or de-rigging the boat. and one I hadn't figure on, the painted beam is slippery as heck when wet and that makes it a lot harder to clamber back on deck after a capsize..... ofcourse this isn't an issue if you don't get the boat wet or capsize it Yar, & this ere post be done without a sin'le drop o' rum passin' me lips
Kingy started with Impara Cadet #3 / Mosquito #245 & now Mosquitos #1182 & #1740 | | | Re: beams
[Re: mousetrap]
#280606 09/24/15 11:51 PM 09/24/15 11:51 PM |
Joined: Apr 2009 Posts: 88 Matthew Dawson
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Posts: 88 | Thanks for the responses.
Is it true that anodised is slightly 'weaker'?
Currently between boats Previously … Cobra 570 Cobra 581 Mosquito 126 Arafura Cadet 738 | | | Re: beams
[Re: Matthew Dawson]
#280609 09/25/15 06:28 AM 09/25/15 06:28 AM |
Joined: Apr 2013 Posts: 858 Victoria Australia Pirate
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Posts: 858 Victoria Australia | no not at all... quite the opposite actually Anodising is (simplest explanation) an electrical coating of the alloy much the same as chrome plating is, in the case of alloy, the anodising process forms a layer of aluminium oxide - Al203 (corundum), which is very hard, relatively inert, electrically insulating (which is why its suitable for salt water use ), and can absorb dyes to colour the alloy. there are 3 main types of anodising..... Sulphuric Acid Anodising -> used mainly for hard working areas where heavy use and wear n tear would normally cut down the protective surface in a short period of time, EG outdoor furniture, window frames etc etc Hard Anodising -> significantly harder, thicker, denser films with a higher resistance to wear, corrosion, temperature effects etc.... your cars engine-bay will have components treated at this level Chromic Acid Anodising -> These coatings are thin, and relatively soft and generally only used in specialised applications, the name plate on the trophies in your cabinet are chromic acid anodised.... good for looks and not much else for beams on a boat, then the SULPHURIC ACID ANODISING is the best, its also the most commonly used form of anodising https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O0GQPHh3Szk Yar, & this ere post be done without a sin'le drop o' rum passin' me lips
Kingy started with Impara Cadet #3 / Mosquito #245 & now Mosquitos #1182 & #1740 | | | Re: beams
[Re: mousetrap]
#280612 09/25/15 07:56 AM 09/25/15 07:56 AM |
Joined: Apr 2009 Posts: 88 Matthew Dawson
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Posts: 88 | Thanks Kingy.
Last edited by Matthew Dawson; 09/25/15 07:57 AM.
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