Interesting points Mike.

And with respect to :




Certainly over the later years I have become convinced that the H16 class and F16 class are alot less competitors then we figured they would be initially. I'm now pretty experience on both, having taught cat lessons on H16's for several year around 2000 etc. After owning my own F16 since early 2004 I have no packed a similar numbers of year on that design as well.

The two classes don't compare in feel at all. The H16 has got a very strong setup centred on the simplicity of the design. I mean, this is a boat you can pull of the trailer and have ready for sailing in less then 15 minutes. The H16 mast is very practical in transpart and stepping as it is just a straight tube with no diamond wires, spreaders and rotation mechanism that requires attention if damage is to be avoided. Once the mast is up you throw up the sails and you are ready to go.

The F16 (and the iCat) is nothing like that. With experience and skill you can rig it up from the trailer quickly enough but you'll need at least 30 minutes and probably more. There is just too much to hook on wrong if you are too much in a haste. On the water the difference are just as large. H16 is basically a simple boat to sail after you set the correct jib fore stay tension. Tuning like downhaul and outhaul is either non-existant or to limited to be of much use beyond setting it right once. The F16 requires alot more skill to race and asks for constant adjustments. Team work goes alot further as well. And when you do it right the boat can become a little bit scary. There is power everywhere, not only on the beam reaches, and you're aproaching boats and marks at absolutely full speed. I never experience sailing at high octane like that on the H16. Or at least not because of the design, very big fleets at their own adrennaline.

Basically the only similarity between the H16's and F16's is the range of crew weights they target. But the mindset of the target group is not comparable in my opinion. Over the years I have told stories of P16 and H16/H14 sailors we took along on I-20's, F18's and F16's at my club. Typically, all instances of such projects run to a familiar script. On the beach before going out the "old school" sailors were pretty confident and felt like embarking on a "lets dunk this one" ride. Once on the race course, we saw outright mutanies, faked heart attacks, excusses of forgotten promises to get home early and grown men kissing the beach upon return under exclamations of "never doing it again !"

Modern spi boats like the I-20, F18, F16 and I suspect the iCat are nowhere near the world as experienced by current actively engaged Hobie 16 sailors. As a result I don't feel these classes will ever impact on eachother in any meaningful sense.

And like you say the young generation is simply not very interested in the H16's. That is my experience as well. Overhere they have only experienced a cat sailing scene dominated by the F18's and want to do what they "real sailors" are doing. When you propose a H16 to them they look at you like a kid that expects a bicycle and gets a tricycle. Yes, I know there are exceptions ! But the general rule seems to be unaffected by those. So maybe in the way of new blood the named classes are in direct competition. I say maybe, because I feel that race has already been run. I really don't see large numbers of young people jumping on the H16 class overhere unless maybe reluctantly as a stepping stone to get up to F18.


So what is my point.

I feel the the H16 will survive on the concept they champion so well and have always championed. A simple boat, with modest performance, in a strickt One-Design class with a large "don't worry, lets party" component for sailors that are looking for racing with such a boat.

The F16's and iCat will be nothing like that. These are/will be complex boats, with state of art performance, in an open class structure where fitting-out, tuning and small personal modifications are integral parts of the whole racing game. They cater for sailors that also like to tweak their boats, build parts up themselves or find the optimal combinations out of a wide range of 3rd party supplier aftermarket components.

I really don't see the H16 crowd ever growing into the second group of sailors. That is expecting them to make a 180 degree turn in the way they see the world. I do believe H16 sailors will see threats everywhere and would like to shoot down every single one of them but in my opinion their concept is becoming unique in the cat sailing world that there really no meaningful threat to their class anyway. That is other then the threats they will have even without any direct competitor. Afterall, it is a problem that alot of young really don't get hot when looking at a H16. And that problem will remain (at least in EU I think) no matter whethet an F16 or iCat exist or not.


So I really hope the iCat doesn't get vetoed on grounds that really don't exist in reality anyway.

But of course my biggest hope would be to see the iCat becoming a F16 compliant design in time. Your comments certaintly convinced me that such a development would also be beneficial to the class I favor ! Something I didn't see that way up till now. Then I couldn't care less whether Nacra and Hobie would ever join. But your comments convinced me that there are still attractive regions that are almost totally dominated by Hobie Corp.


Here some more reading about the experience of a crew very comparable to you and your daughter Mike :

http://www.catsailor.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=170845#Post170845



Forgive me my long post !


Wouter