Chris, instead of waiting for someone to bring it to you, you have to get involved. I bet you would probably even get some activity by just asking for it too. There are shockingly few people making these things move forward and they can't cover every inch of the entire country.

Secondly, it's not like there is some big alternative organization running races in the US. Chances are that you live an area where the HCA is pretty dominant.

Chris is VERY involved in the sport, and promoting the sport. You can blame him, and the rag tag group he hangs around with for bringing many people in. He's one of the people making things move forward, and covering his few inches of the country. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

I can't wait.

I'll finally get a chance to spend all the [sentence enhancer] Canadian change I get stuck with. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />

Global warming is a fad. We will all be alive and well and everyone will be sailing F16s in a decade.

That is not what I am talking about. Obviously, regattas should be inclusive to kids from other countries. And I am not talking about the Hobie Class Association of North America, because that is a regional organization under ISAF and they hold Continental Championships rather than National Championships.

I am just not clear about the interrelationships among:
1. Art's program, which he says is specifically targeted to U.S. youth sailors; and
2. NAYMA, which by its name, implies it covers all of North America (whatever that means, and it should be defined); and
3. The SL16 Class Association; and
4. Performance Catamarans, manufacturer of the SL16.

Caleb, you said Canada has strong youth programs. Well, the United States has never had a cohesive, ongoing developmental and training program for its youth multihull sailors. That is what Art is trying to implement.

If Canada wants to have a similar program to get SL16's distributed around the country to provide training on that boat for its youth sailors, I am sure somebody in Canada could work out a similar arrangement with Performance Catamarans. That would be great, because then the U.S. kids could race and train with and against the Canadian kids on the SL16's, which have already been anointed by ISAF to eventually totally replace the Hobie 16 as the youth catamaran, as soon as there are enough of them around the world.

As far as the Hobie 16, right now there are no places I am aware of in the United States that have Hobie 16's equipped with spinnakers for our youth sailors to train on. This has been a major problem for our youth sailors when they go to the ISAF Youth Worlds.

Thanks to Art's program, and with the help from Performance Catamarans, hopefully there soon WILL be places around the United States with spinnaker-equipped catamarans for our youth sailors to train on.

If Hobie Cat Company wants to get involved in the same way by providing Hobie 16's with spinnakers, at a discount to the same places that are going to buy one or more SL16's, that would be great, because then the kids would get a chance to learn both boats while both are still in play for the international events.

All I am saying is that I would like the above relationships clarified so if I donate to the cause, I know my money is going ONLY to develop this program for ONLY U.S. sailors, to help get boats accessible to them, and to help them to be able to go events in Europe.

It is very important that we create what US Sailing refers to as a "pipeline" to the Olympics for youth multihull sailors, so that we will have some credibility with US Sailing and get invited to JO festivals. We need to show that we are making a concerted effort to produce viable Olympic candidates for the Olympic multihull event so US Sailing doesn't think they have to bump the multihull event off their list for the Olympics.

Second that...the boats Art is pimping have two hulls, that's a good thing and is all that should matter. Whatever works in your geographic area is a very good thing.

Organizations bringing boats to venues or sponsoring getting kids to events is fantastic, period

The fact that boats with three sails aren't a fad and the lack of a youth catamaran in some geographic areas is another totally different subject. If the way to the Olymipic ranks through a local Hobie fleet is 16, Tiger, then Tornado, so be it. Why poo-poo another "way"?

Jake,
I am really not a 'sit on the sidelines' kind of guy. I have my hand in EVERYTHING to do with the sport in the midwest. I am just saying, that we never hear of jack squat out here in the midwest about youth multihull stuff, and I guess I am saying, that there is a ton of people that are being over looked and not sought out by those organizers. I think you'd find the numbers to be higher if they just started looking for sailors that already exist.....get what I mean? But as far as my lack on involvement, thats not the case.

I don't know what you mean about "if they just started looking for sailors." If you belong to HCA and get the Hobie Hotline, you know about all the Hobie events. If you subscribe to "Catamaran Sailor," you hear about pretty much all of the events in the country (and the event list is free for everybody to view on our website.) And you don't even have to belong to US Sailing to go to their web site and find out about all the youth events offered through them, including the U.S. Youth Multihull Championship.

I'm sorry if you feel overlooked and left out, but what more can people do to let you know what is going on? <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

It is interesting to look at what the Canadian Yachting Association does in terms of youth sailors, and the fact that their program includes "Multihull." Check it out.
http://www.sailing.ca/youth/initiatives/index.asp

That is not the case in the United States. I hope it can happen as a result of Art's program.

Mary:

When Arthur sent me this, he said nothing about the other organization. I only saw it in other thread. I think he is basically try to help youth sailors. Yes I agree that all links should be on that site and not just Nacra and SL-16 organization. Hopefully we can all band together.

Doug

Here is what he sent:

Hi Doug:
I didn't see your response because it was at the end of the message, sorry. Anyway you wrote:
So how many boats? What kind? When will they be in our area? I need more
info
1. We have 5 new Sl16's in the tractor trailer for your event.
2. We are open to schedule events to what ever is the best sailing weather in your area. Your decision and coordination is necessary with other clubs in
the area.
3. Our plan is to have you invite as many sailors as possible that sail catamarans, laser, 420's, 29er etc.
We will have round robin racing for two days with a clinic maybe Friday evening/Sat morning. Get kids familiar
with the new boat and then race as much as we can through Sun afternoon.
4. You might have to house and feed kids. Kids don't have cars and can't stay by themselves in a hotel. You can expect kids to come from other areas
so airport runs might happen as well. Dallas comes to mind as an example. When kids find out this is in Texas you will see them flying in.
5. You should collect a $250 damage deposit just like they all do now for their 420 Vanguard regattas.
6. Charge an entry fee and we propose $100 each kid. That breaks down to $50 per day each for use of the supplied boats. Kids/parants are used to paying these kids of fees and more.
7. Get sponsors to help offset the regatta costs.
8. We will supply round robin computer scoring unless you already have that.
9. We need to offset the cost of fuel for our tractor trailer so we are asking for your committee to plan for maybe 20 kids/10 teams.
This would bring in $2,000 which we should get $1,500 to pay for our cost to get to Huston. We would hope for more becaue that doesn't really cover it so if
sponsors are interested , that makes it better. We are trying to be cost neutral but don't expect that to happen for several years.
As the program grows we will have more interest therefore more revenue and more venues.
10. We are getting regatta insurance to cover liability which is a must for a kid program.

So you need to figure out a venue, time to hold the regatta, supply kids, PRO,judges, marks, chase/safety boats and all the stuff associated with having
a great time sailing .I know it all sounds like a big deal and it is but the fun and exposure is well worth the effort.

Best regards,
AJS
310-245-0614

You already posted that earlier in this thread. It's not really relevant to what I am talking about. He is just telling you the details for hosting one of his events.

Mary, thanks for posting the CYA link. CYA is the counter part to our US SAILING. We do have similar programs see http://www.ussailing.org/multihull/ and http://www.ussailing.org/championships/youth/multihull/ What we seem to lack is direct participation in US SAILING from our multihull sailors. The turn out at the US SAILING AGM's and participation is really quite limited. Getting the local sailors to attend has even been a problem. Just look at the Multihull Council link on your forum to see the action. When you review the 2012 decision and even the support for Youth Multihull programs you see the results. I still think it is the Pogo Syndrome, "We have found the Enemy, and He is Us". Unless people step up, take part, and participate, change will not occur.

Caleb Tarleton

Caleb is absolutely correct here. The enemy is ourselves

How about this idea.

Perhaps we could boot strap a coherent program using the resources of 4 or 5 clubs around the USA.

Forget about the equipment issue. What if we identified a club on each of the three coasts and great lakes. These clubs would run a 3 or 4 day program twice a year where a training camp with coaching occured followed by a junior regatta. Qaulified Junior sailors and teams would get to the club for the training and coaching and use boats provided by the club. (If a junior team had their own boat and could bring it... great.. the program would get bigger.)

This development program would underlie the Hobie 16 Junior Nationals and the SL16 Junior nationals and any other class which could support a junior event.

(I bet if the F18 class made 5 boats available for an F18 Junior nationals... it would be VERY popular!)

The layer above these natinoal events would be US Sailing sanctioned feeder events for the ISAF worlds.

We already have some of the peices... we simply need to give up what holds us back and build and promote the programs locally and regionally.

This is not a LEARN TO SAIL or Introduce catamarans to junior sailors... This should be a serious focus on training to race performance boats.

If a 29ner team wants to commit to a muiltihull for a camp.. Perfect... trust the dark side to win out! We want sailors and their families who will commit time and money to the sport... They will only do this when we get our crap together and build a legit program at all of the levels we need.

Caleb,
I don't know about the "pogo syndrome," but it is definitely a "chicken-and-egg syndrome." When people have something tangible to support, they step up and support it and get involved. But in the past 20+ years since the Multihull Council was formed, there has been nothing but talk, because the Multihull Council is not empowered to actually DO anything. So why go to meetings?

Art Stevens is the only person who has actually managed to DO anything. The Fast-and-Fun program introduced thousands of children to catamarans all over the country. I know at some stops he had a hard time getting local cat sailors to show up to help him out with the program.

Now he is taking it up a big notch, and it will be interesting to see how much support he gets from the catamaran community.

I assume he is going to concentrate on bringing his program to yacht clubs, where the members are accustomed to the kinds of costs and logistics it takes to put on an event like he is talking about. And he needs to concentrate on places that can afford to buy one or more SL16's to provide ongoing training on multihulls.

If we can get cats into youth programs at yacht clubs, it will be a major breakthrough. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

what is cost comparison:
putting kids into soccer or other school-sponsored sports
putting kids into sailing programs (incl buying boat)

What is return on same? I can't think of any sailing scholarships out there, but there are certainly plenty of football/soccer/etc scholarships...

Consider, and you might answer your own questions regarding lack of interest...

There is no problem with lack of interest. There is an abundance of interest. Everybody agrees that youth sailing is important and we have to do something to increase it. Every time there is a thread on this forum about youth sailing, everybody is all excited about it. "Yay, rah, let's do it!"

The problem comes with the "doing" part.

Obviously, most people can't afford to go out and buy an SL16 or even a Hobie 16 just for their kids to sail.

That's why it is important to have places around the country that have these boats available for kids to practice on at reasonable prices -- or at yacht clubs where multihulls are part of the junior programs.

Pogo was one of the all time best comic strips. see http://www.pogopossum.com/books3.htm BTW, the correct quote was "We have met the enemy and he is us" Walt Kelly was a great writer and political commentator, scan the webpage, and you will find it interesting.

As mentioned before, Fast and Fun, see http://www.ussailing.org/multihull/fast&fun.htm continues to be an important program for us locally. Our next one is May 5 in Kirkland. Many of our volunteer sailors that help run this event are our Youth Sailors from Sail Sand Point, including sailors that participated in the US Youth Multihull Championship this year. How many local Sailing Centers are continuing this free outreach program? Another great way to encourage and develop Youth Multihull sailors.

Caleb

Since the Alter Cup this year is on SL16, why not alert the youth community that they will be for sale after the event(s), and perhaps the builder will discount them if they are to be used for the youth racing fleet?

And all those dudes who bought them to train on could do the same?

I sold my N20 at a reasonably affordable price to build the racing fleet. I think most others would do the same.

It's incredible sometimes the frugality of the cat sailor. We may gasp at the thought of paying something like $400 a year to trailer in to a yacht club and race once a week for the season. But this is where we, cat sailors, need to be. Can a person make a season of bowling on $400?

And with the kids, what if the kid was a really good baseball player? Then there'd be trips to tournaments all over the country.

Remember the comment here said of one Yacht club, "This is a nice place...you guys (meaning the cat sailors) should take it over"

The Alter Cup is not on the SL16, but rather the F16 (Blade). They are different boats.