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Re: A-Class Worlds -- More on Competitors-WOW! [Re: Tony_F18] #121887
11/14/07 06:53 AM
11/14/07 06:53 AM
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fin. Offline
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FANTASTIC!

-- Have You Seen This? --
Re: A-Class Worlds -- More on Competitors-WOW! [Re: fin.] #121888
11/14/07 09:15 AM
11/14/07 09:15 AM
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 2,584
+31NL
Tony_F18 Offline
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Here's a report from a Dutch (non-pro) sailor (the translation is web-automated, so read over the grammar mistakes):
A-Cat Worlds Report

Re: A-Class Worlds -- More on Competitors-WOW! [Re: Tony_F18] #121889
11/14/07 09:30 AM
11/14/07 09:30 AM
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 1,187
38.912, -95.37
_flatlander_ Offline
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38.912, -95.37
Quote
read over the grammar mistakes)
Quote
Ashby is the ongekroonde king
<img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />


John H16, H14
Re: A-Class Worlds -- More on Competitors-WOW! [Re: _flatlander_] #121890
11/14/07 12:10 PM
11/14/07 12:10 PM
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 5,558
Key Largo, FL & Put-in-Bay, OH...
Mary Offline
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Mary  Offline
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Key Largo, FL & Put-in-Bay, OH...
Wednesday, Day 3:

Winds light, 6-7 knots, occasionally dipping down close to the 5 knot minmum, out of the North-Northeast.

1st race of the day, positions 1st time around the weather mark:

1. Ashby
2. Booth
3. Guck
4. Pease Glaser
5. Daniel
6. Melvin
7. Pieter Saarberg, NED
8. Ogletree
9. Ian Lindahl, USA
10. Callabria
11. Kinder
12. Thomas Persson, SWE
13. Tracy Oliver, USA
14. Cope

(NOTE: Not sure what happened, but the first race was started for the first time, it was abandoned when the boats were halfway up the weather leg. Powerboats went and rounded them up and sent them back to the starting line. When they tried the start again, there was a general recall, and the third try was under black flag. That third start was successful.)

Re: A-Class Worlds -- More on Competitors-WOW! [Re: Mary] #121891
11/14/07 12:30 PM
11/14/07 12:30 PM
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 5,558
Key Largo, FL & Put-in-Bay, OH...
Mary Offline
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Key Largo, FL & Put-in-Bay, OH...
Second time around the weather mark:

1. Ashby
2. Melvin
3. Booth
4. P. Glaser
5. Guck
6. Ogletree
7. Saarberg
8. Kinder
9. Callabria
10. Daniel
11. Persson
12. Cope
13. Philpott

(NOTE: Wind is down around 5 knots now.)

Re: A-Class Worlds -- More on Competitors-WOW! [Re: Mary] #121892
11/14/07 12:41 PM
11/14/07 12:41 PM
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 902
Norman,OK
gree2056 Offline
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Thanks Mary, I will look forward to wonderful updates throughout the whole regatta


Once you go cat you never go back! Nacra 5.2 (Elsies)#1499, running an inter17 spin!
Re: A-Class Worlds -- More on Competitors-WOW! [Re: Mary] #121893
11/14/07 01:18 PM
11/14/07 01:18 PM
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 5,558
Key Largo, FL & Put-in-Bay, OH...
Mary Offline
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Key Largo, FL & Put-in-Bay, OH...
Here's the wrapup on the first race Wednesday, which is the 5th race overall for the regatta:

Positions rounding the weather mark for the third and last time:
1. Pease Glaser
2. Booth
3. Melvin
4. Ashby
5. Guck
6. Ogletree

And Rick's boat went to the finish, because anything could, and did, happen in the light air. Here are the finish positions:
1. Pease Glaser
2. Guck
3. Melvin
4. Ashby
5. Booth
6. Ogletree
7. Daniel
8. Saarberg
9. Cope
10. Kinder
11. Marstrom
12. Randy Smyth
13. Persson
14. Hoekstra
15. Atkins

Rick has done a rough calculation of the overall positions after the five races, taking out a throwout:

1. Guck, 6 points
2. Ashby, 8 points
3. Melvin, 10 points
4. Booth, 25 points
5. Ogletree, 27 points
6. Kinder, 46 points
7. Daniel, 56 points
8. Pease Glaser, 65 points
8. Atkins, 65 points
9. Cope, 71 points

The wind is now down to about 3 knots, and they are going to hold off for a while to see if the wind comes up enough to start another race.

Re: A-Class Worlds -- More on Competitors-WOW! [Re: Mary] #121894
11/14/07 07:58 PM
11/14/07 07:58 PM
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 613
New Hampshire, USA
windswept Offline
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New Hampshire, USA
The happenings at the beginning of the race is that they posted they postponement flag. If they posted a general recall, then the next start would be under the black flag. There is much more to this story then just that, but I will let somebody else lay that part of the story out.


Tom Siders
A-Cat USA-79
Tornado US775
Re: A-Class Worlds -- More on Competitors-WOW! [Re: windswept] #121895
11/14/07 08:56 PM
11/14/07 08:56 PM
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 196
Arkansas, USA
C
CaptainKirt Offline
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Posts: 196
Arkansas, USA
It's been a very interesting regatta- 100 boats here and some truly awesome sailors and legends. I'm just trying to learn a lot, not hurt myself or the boat, have a nice vacation with my wife, and stay out of the way of the rock stars- so far I've succeeded. This is a great venue in general- but the internet connection is terrible! It's been tough conditions every day IMO- First day the wind was good but gusty- I don't know the official numbers but the gusts were pretty intense to me with a very short choppy sea state and the occasional large (ie ~50' motoryachts) boat waves. Lots of pounding and boats going over (including me), boats and gear breaking (including Randy Smyth's mainsheet for instance, and I saw a mast come down right behind me). Second day was much lighter wind but the chop had only moderated slightly and the seaweed was all over the place! They are using a "number tag" system here to keep track of all the boats for safety reasons and if you forget to take your tag with you or forget to put it back on the board within a time limit that evening you get a 20% penalty (Nobody forget the safety issue on the first windy day but @ 8 people, including yours truly <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" />, did on the second light air day). On the last race yesterday (race 4) the wind was dying, the chop was still up and the weed was same or worse- I'm talking clumps the size of basketballs! THAT will slow anybody down! I ended up worrying more about dodging weed than trying to keep the optimum course and tacked and jibed "extra times" just to clear weed! It was a long day and apparently a fairly large number of people (NOT including me this time!) , having been lapped by the likes of Glenn and Lars, etc. got confused and "finished" by sailing through the finish line and going in vs through the gates and back on around the course. I know I was surprised up the last upwind leg to suddenly have so few boats behind me <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />!!!
The RC did not penalize these boats, only the ones who "confessed".
Today the weed was gone, the sea was less choppy but the air was light and dying all the way around the course. The RC got the timing wrong on the first start, then a bunch of boats jumped the gun so general recall and finally got it right the third time. Wind ended up dying to practically nothing- they sent us to the beach to wait- At 3:00 they finally decided to cancel the second race (the A Cat World Championship sailing instructions are very specific- you cannot start a race after 4PM for instance. You cannot shorten a course and you cannot make up a race.). So, at most we will have 3 more races- 2 tomorrow (and weather here is supposed to be @ 10 knots so should happen) and then 1 Friday (but the forecast is for 20-25 knots then and class rules won't allow a race to start in winds over 22 knots OR to continue if the average wind is over 22 knots for 15 minutes before the first boat finishes- so that may not happen). Five races constitute a championship so if we have no more races there will be a champion for this regatta!
Ben's wing is, of course, very cool but has not proven to be the "killer" yet.
Well, off to bed!

Kirt


Kirt Simmons
Taipan, Flyer
Re: A-Class Worlds -- More on Competitors-WOW! [Re: windswept] #121896
11/14/07 10:16 PM
11/14/07 10:16 PM
Joined: Aug 2007
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brucat Offline
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Quote
If they posted a general recall, then the next start would be under the black flag.


Why Tom? Was there a black flag up for the first try, or is it automatically required after a general for this event (per the SIs or class rules)?

Quote
The RC did not penalize these boats, only the ones who "confessed".


The joys of managing a 100 boat fleet (on a 3-lap course with a wide variance of talent between the "haves" and the "have-nots"). The RC correctly scored boats that finished (you don’t have to sail the course correctly to be scored as finished). If the competitors aren’t willing to protest one another, it’s up to the RC and jury to decide if they want to do anything. About the only thing the RC can do is check the mark rounding sheets and protest the boats. Most likely, at an event such as this with an on-water jury, they would leave that to the discretion of the jury to file the protests.

Thanks for the report, Kirt, it's great to hear from those on the water!

Mike

Last edited by brucat; 11/14/07 10:17 PM.
Re: A-Class Worlds -- More on Competitors-WOW! [Re: CaptainKirt] #121897
11/14/07 10:16 PM
11/14/07 10:16 PM
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 182
Coopersburg, PA
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Vinny_M Offline
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Vinny_M  Offline
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Posts: 182
Coopersburg, PA
I have a question for everyone here. I was looking through thebeachcats.com at the A-class worlds photos and stumbled upon this picture. Just out of sheer curiosity, can anyone shed any light on the make of the boat and the significance of having hulls shaped like that? thanks

Attached Files

~vinny~
Re: A-Class Worlds -- More on Competitors-WOW! [Re: Vinny_M] #121898
11/15/07 12:38 AM
11/15/07 12:38 AM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 749
Santa Cruz, CA
SurfCityRacing Offline
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Santa Cruz, CA

Re: A-Class Worlds -- More on Competitors-WOW! [Re: Vinny_M] #121899
11/15/07 03:35 AM
11/15/07 03:35 AM
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 951
Brisbane, Queensland, Australi...
ncik Offline
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That looks like the boomless one too.

Re: A-Class Worlds -- More on Competitors-WOW! [Re: ncik] #121900
11/15/07 04:45 AM
11/15/07 04:45 AM
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 43
NZ
A
Aerynt Offline
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Aerynt  Offline
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Posts: 43
NZ
a better pic of the rig, sort of looks nice
Aerynt

Attached Files
124717-19533.jpg (155 downloads)
Re: A-Class Worlds -- More on Competitors-WOW! [Re: Vinny_M] #121901
11/15/07 09:37 AM
11/15/07 09:37 AM
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,226
Atlanta
bvining Offline
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bvining  Offline
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Posts: 1,226
Atlanta
Thats the LR2, sailed by Randy Smythe, designed by Richard Roarke, built by John Lindhal. Ian Lindhad is sailing the same hulls and Fred Smith (Canada) has one also. Boomless main is Randy's creation, I believe.

I cant answer the "why is it shaped like that" part of the question. You could do a search on LR2, I think it was discussed here and on one of the design sites.

Bill

Re: A-Class Worlds -- More on Competitors-WOW! [Re: bvining] #121902
11/15/07 10:47 AM
11/15/07 10:47 AM
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 613
New Hampshire, USA
windswept Offline
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This is probably a better thread to read concerning the hull shape and design.
http://www.boatdesign.net/forums/showthread.php?t=18037


Tom Siders
A-Cat USA-79
Tornado US775
Re: A-Class Worlds -- More on Competitors-WOW! [Re: brucat] #121903
11/15/07 10:50 AM
11/15/07 10:50 AM
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 3,969
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brucat Offline
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Quote
Quote
If they posted a general recall, then the next start would be under the black flag.


Why Tom? Was there a black flag up for the first try, or is it automatically required after a general for this event (per the SIs or class rules)?

Quote
The RC did not penalize these boats, only the ones who "confessed".


The joys of managing a 100 boat fleet (on a 3-lap course with a wide variance of talent between the "haves" and the "have-nots"). The RC correctly scored boats that finished (you don’t have to sail the course correctly to be scored as finished). If the competitors aren’t willing to protest one another, it’s up to the RC and jury to decide if they want to do anything. About the only thing the RC can do is check the mark rounding sheets and protest the boats. Most likely, at an event such as this with an on-water jury, they would leave that to the discretion of the jury to file the protests.

Thanks for the report, Kirt, it's great to hear from those on the water!

Mike


By the way Kirt, do you know anything about the scoring codes? I'm not familiar with "TLE" (it's not in the RRS).

Also, how did they "penalize" the boats that didn't sail the course correctly? I don't see any RAFs or DSQs for Race 4.

Mike

Re: A-Class Worlds -- More on Competitors-WOW! [Re: bvining] #121904
11/15/07 11:10 AM
11/15/07 11:10 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 9,582
North-West Europe
Wouter Offline
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North-West Europe
Smyth is the best performer on the LR2 at 21st position overall.

If anything the light winds and heavy chop should have favoured the LR2 if its mythical longitudal stability is true. Smyth is a very good sailor (Olympic medalist and many other prizes) and 21st is not a placing normally associated with Smyth.

If anything the results so far don't point to a significant improvement in performance due to the new hulls c.q. sail.

Wouter

Last edited by Wouter; 11/15/07 11:15 AM.

Wouter Hijink
Formula 16 NED 243 (one-off; homebuild)
The Netherlands
Re: A-Class Worlds -- More on Competitors-WOW! [Re: Wouter] #121905
11/15/07 11:49 AM
11/15/07 11:49 AM
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 613
New Hampshire, USA
windswept Offline
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New Hampshire, USA
I think jumping into the class with very little practice, competitive regattas and so-on is a difficult thing to do. the level of sailors and competitors at this regatta is at the top level of this sport. So I believe a 21st position is very good for having jumped right in, new class, new boat, new sail. doe anything ever please you. And you are correct on the observations of hull speed, right now it is not a break-through that leaves others in its wake. What we are seeing is that the 2 currently dominant platforms are dominating the event with the top A-cat sailors doing the dominating. You have the Morreli & Melvin A3 and the Ashy Sailcraft-Geltek Flyer MKII dominating this regatta. The sails that are winning are also the same ones. The newest Glaser Main from Jay & Pease along with the Ashby Main from Glen. Lars, Pete and Glen remain dominant. Pease has begun to climb back up, Charlie Ogletree is having a great regatta, Matt Struble is doing well, but the ones on top are the ones who have been on top for the last couple of years.


Tom Siders
A-Cat USA-79
Tornado US775
Re: A-Class Worlds -- More on Competitors-WOW! [Re: windswept] #121906
11/15/07 12:39 PM
11/15/07 12:39 PM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 887
Crofton, MD
Chris9 Offline
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Crofton, MD
I thought there was going to be a new Marstrom design in this thingy. Anybody seen it? Picture?


Chris Allen
Nacra 20 Gertie
www.wrcra.org
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