What’s the best performing cat that can also handle the surf ??
My neighbor has an old prindle 16, which handles the surf good, but does not perform well in our light to moderate wind conditions of 10-15 knts.
We live on this part of the coast, mainland pacific mexico, for the surf.
It’s light and offshore in the morning, but by 2pm its gone onshore and by late afternoon it can build up to 17nkts, usually it’s 10-12knts.
The beach we sail off shelfs out slowly with breakers out to 300m. On average there are a 3 sections of steep breakers you have to get through running 4-6’. When the surf is up, the breakers are running 6-10’ with deep water 400’m out.

The Hobie 16 has a great reputation for surf sailing. The curved hulls, relable kickup rudder, and no daggerboards are a great combination; however, like the P16 it will not perform so nice in 10 knots. Modern ultralights (18HT, A-class, etc) perform great in 10-15 knots, but are usually a bit tender when it comes to hitting a beach. Probibly a good compromise would be a Worrell1000 boat. These have proven records going in and out of the surf, can witstand repeated beach landings, and are reasonably good performers. A nacra 6.0 or even a Nacra 5.8 would be my first choice. Since you are not class racing, you could put a more powerful squaretop main on it (Calvert sails used to make some great models) to give you some more power. Watch some W1000 or Tybee500 videos to see the technique for getting out through surf with this type of boat. It involves putting a man far forward on the leeward side and is not exactly intuitive but it is proven. Second choices might be an Inter20 or a Hobie Fox or Tiger. Third choice would be Hobie21, Hobie Miricle, or Prindle 19. You probibly want to avoid Mysteers, Tornados, A-class, Bimarre, etc.

dang!!!! i see the supercats didn't make the grade.... <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />
ohh well... i love my super cat 17 and 19... the bows are tall and slender and cut right thru the waves.... also it is a very strong design.... just my 2 sense lol

Dart 16 would work well. Add a spin/hooter and it would work nicely in 10-15k, especially with one up. Its a rotomolded boat, no daggers, kickup rudders, so its going to take the beach landings without any fuss.

The boat was fun on a reach in 15knots, its a bit slow downwind, a hooter if just what that boats needs.

Bill

Hey Guys,

Have you ever punched out through a surfbreak with a H-18mag trapping from the wings??? WOOF.. WOOF ..WOOF When she goes airborn and hangs there for that brief second ....
The best beach/racing cat is the tried and true H-18, strong and durable, takes a beating and brings you home ever time. If you need extra buoyency for big surf just furl the jib, and ride the back of a wave in. One night at the finish of "The Down the Bay" with wind gusts of 42+knots we hit the beach with my H-18mag and proceeded to do a "Hobie Landing", sailing 20 or 30 meters up the beach before enough people could grab the boat to spin her into the wind (it was a Keystone Cops moment).

I have launched from ocean beachs through the surf (and returned) from Cape Cod to Cape Hatterass. I own also a P-19mx, my friends have owned Mysteres, Tornadoes, I-20s, Prindles, NACRAs (5.0,5.2s,5.5s,5.8s,6.0s...),Supercats,A-Cats and all are good boats but for punching through surfbreaks its a Hobie. The H-18 can carry more crew weight and has larger performance window/envelope and with Magnum Wings it has a "****" feeling to the boat.

The Daggerboards ??? Just make sure you have a good piece of bungie cord to keep them "up" position. No problem

Harry

Hey Harry, howya doin? It's been awhile. Great to see you here, I've seen a few of your posts recently. After being one of the early Catsailor members, I've made my way back after a long hiatus. As you know, I'm a long time Hobie 16 sailor (also have a 14). I recently picked up a Nacra 5.0 that needs a set of sails and some work, can't wait for Spring to try it out.
I agree with you that the TheMightyHobie18 is a great surf boat (see the old Dean Froome video - "Share the Wind"?) As for surfin in the conditions described here, it's the H16 for me. The Hobie 16 and 14 were made to surf, by a surfer (Hobie Alter). As mentioned, the banana hull shapes are great for surfing, they ride the waves well, they don't slice or fall through as much as narrow fine hulls. The kick-up rudders are essential. And the lack of a daggerboard makes it so easy. Plus the large roach in the main makes it such a great reacher, you can power up so easily in an onshore breeze when you need speed for control to catch (or bail) on a wave. Don't get me wrong, the TheMightyHobie18 is great as well, and I would favor it in larger waves and with combined crew weights above 330 or so. The temp here in Annapolis is going down into the teens tonight, wish I were on the Mexican Pacific coast right now.

Hi You'all

Thanks for the great feedback.
I kind of figured the hobies would be the best in the surf, but would love to have something that performs better in the 8-12knts range. i guess you can't have your cake and east it.
half the time i will be sailing solo, so would a TheMightyHobie18 prove to be too powerfull if i am caught out in 18knts on my own ??
can you just furl the jib ?

YOu can furl the jib on most H-18's. I would re-think solo sailing a H-18 in the ocean. You won't be able to right it solo. Maybe with a righting bag or pole system but I would be skeptical.

Either one is a good choice. I have a 16 and 18.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0jhOi5_Ue88

If Prindle 16 is a good design in your eyes but a tad underpowered then the Prindle 18 is your ticket.

I actually prefer this boat over the Hobie 18 is simplicity is a consideration. The Prindle 18 is exactly like the Prindle 16 boat just entlarged a bit in length, mast height, sailarea and speed. It is still a boardless design.

Wouter

Hi Guys,

I've been able to right my H-18mag singlehanding in the 180lbs range. You need to get the boat just right (mast into the wind), stand on the daggerboard and hook the righting line to your harness and be patient. You'll usually get one shot at righting the boat, the more wind the better. If you miss it take the time too set it up correctly, then try again. And yes, usually the H-18 comes with a jib furler (unless someone has removed it).

The H-18 is bigger and is alot more stable the H-16, add the much larger performance envelope (crew wieght) makes the H-18 is a better choice. In defense of the H-16, there are alot of them outthere for cheap $$$$, they are almost indestuctable and they are very simple (only two lines too pull on). Either one is built for the surf.

Did I tell you the story about how John McLaughlin and I single-handed our Hobies through Diamond Shoals, after dark .... one night. I was sailing my H-18mag and John was on his H-16. Not the smartest thing to do, but we suvived OK; we had maybe too much faith in our boats.

Note the Coast Guard was so concerned that they called the house every hour to check whether we had arrived safely yet. They were no doubt prepared to come and recue our sorry butts, GOD BLESS THEM !!! So guys keep in mind the people who will risk their lives to save us when we take risks and lose the bet.

There is a DVD of some real dudes sailing the H16 and 14 in big surf. But they are sailing in the waves. Surfing the face fully loaded.
The boats are awesome, the sailors are awesome. Cartwheels a plenty and just get back on and do it again.
If I had those sort of gonads I don't think I would ever leave the surf.

Hey,
I have never seen any of these videos, where can i find them ??

I am not sure. I was in the local Hobie dealer about two years ago and the had it playing on the screen. It was one of those jaw dropping moments when you look at other people doing something with such abandon that you just think "I am so half-arsed compared to that. I'll google it and see what I can find

"Share the Wind" has hobie 18 wave jumping and also a TheMightyHobie18 crossing a sand penninsula (under sail). Check your local libraries.

This awesome TV ad was just posted on another thread:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=74JyDmAu9Zw

YEEEEE Haw!

GARY

We have "Sharing the Wind" and "A Moment's Glory" in our store. Click on "OnLine Store" at the top of this page.

Woof ... Woof ... Woof , I'm going to get me a SUNKIST!!!

You just got to love a H-18 in the surf, daggerboards and all!!!! (Thanks Gary you made my day!)

Harry

All the boats mentioned will perform OK in the 8-12 range (obviously the more wind the better). To get better performance you'll generally need something lighter and/or larger, both of which I see as potential liabilities working in surf. I want quick maneuverability and strength. The Hobies come alive at around 11- 12knts, and for me you just can't beat their simplicity and durability.
As for singlehanding, I've never single handed the 18. The ability to furl a jib is a big plus. Any of these boats will be awesome and potentially bordering on being a handful single handed in 18knts. How much do you weigh? Righting singlehanded is also an issue. There are water bags, shroud extenders, and Power Righters ( I have not used Ricks, which looks pretty cool), all of which have pros & cons. I love to single hand, but I rarely do it without some kind of backup, either on the water or onshore. Singlehanding on the ocean with an offshore breeze is not advisable. It sounds like you get an onshore sea breeze most afternoons which should be great.
The temp here was in the teens last week, but should be kissing 70 today and tomorrow. Think I'll go work on my boat.

Hey Harry - congrats on being able to right your 18 by yourself. I don't think I've ever gotten my 16 up without assistance, but I haven't had to try solo in years. I should go out & try this summer. I'm curious, you mention pointing the mast into the wind, which is the way we all learned many years ago and the way I've always done it. With two on board, I've always had plenty of weight. In recent years Rick has been preaching positioning the boat 45 degrees into the wind to "power right" it. Any experience yourself with that? I have heard that it has enabled some solo sailors to right unassisted.

Rick may have a good idea there, but I haven't tried it. I know that as you right the boat it has a tendence to spin slightly. I think Rick is using the sail as a wing and generating "lift" and using this to right the boat. My secret is that by hooking into the harness with the righting line, as low as possible, you can slowly .... raise the mast. Each time in bounces on a wave you gain a little bit, and with the H-18 you have a nice flat daggerboard to stand on, it helps!!! One day single-handing off of "Leo's" I managed to right my P-19mx, of course another time the local crabbers on their "crab boat" had to come help me ...

I'll have to try Ricks idea, does he still have the main sheeted???

Harry Murphey