Despite Wouter’s critique of the Supercat/ARC website, the fact remains that the Supercat 17 is a Sweet all around boat that outperforms most, if not all, the other board less beach cats in its class. It achieves its performance with no bells and whistles. For someone that wants a true “off the beach” cat that gives good performance, robust construction and is simple to dial in…. go for a SC17 you won’t be disappointed.

As for whether Bill knows what he is talking about or not….he seem to do his “taking” out on the water…his race record speaks for itself. We should all be so talented.

Regards,
Bob

Wouter, tell us what you really think. BTW, how much salt peter *do* you put in your corn flakes every morning?

I think the following quote is a true statement.

Harry - No, he does not recommend leaving the mainsheet cleated when righting. You need to spill any water that it is holding. I think the goal is to get the both the tramp and the sails working for you to lift the mast.
Impressive that you could right the P19 solo.

Without taking any sides, ( or a patent on any shape),

the phrase :the SuperCat 17 even up with the Nacra 5.2, a "beach boat" pitted against what was considered to be an excellent "board boat."

I have sailed both boats, several times.

I think that with equal sailors and conditions, the 5.2 would outpoint the SC17- which is to me a no brainer looking at those daggerboards.

The SC17 is a great all around boat, bar none.

This probably wont answer anything on this thread but I had a picture I thought you might want to see:

I have been on a SuperCat 19 a few times... I have helped right it 2 times… (not my fault - <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" /> and I have even skippered it for a midnight run. It sailed very well.

That being said, we had a SuperCat 17 had a transom rip out recently... I don’t recall the specifics but I think he simply hit bottom with stuck rudders. He has repaired it and seems fine (except he showed me the other hull is gonna do the same soon).

A few weeks ago there was a MONSTER Supercat sailing at our causeway. It had 12’ beams (I think), 3 sets of spreaders, and what seemed to be a crew of 7 or 8. Well they had a bad day…. as the picture shows.. they also lost their transom. When they hit the beach, rudder (still attached to transom) in hand the guy said to me, the whole butt-end ripped off the pontoon. Then threw me overboard and then ran over me…. I started to correct his terms and figured he didn’t need pointers at that time…

Dave,

I was alittle heavier then @ 180-185lbs, now that I'm below 170lbs I think I may have "issues". Believe it or not the P-19 is "slightly" easier to right then the H-18. I think the comtip is the reason. But it is harder to climb back on the P-19 then the H-18 with the taller bows.

Check out my post in "Catsailors Invade Annapolis: A legend Begins", you will know the individual mentioned ... Thats from 87' ... Fleet 54 ol'crew ... when we were young and crazy(stu--d ....)

Sail Flat, Sail Fast
HarryMurphey
H-18mag/#9458, Fleet 54
P-19mx/ #86, CRAC

Lock up the rudders on any brand new cat (so they can’t kick up) and run it onto the beach and the same thing will happen. What is showing in the picture is not a construction issue...it is a maintenance issue. If the owner had maintained his boat properly he most likely would never have lost his transom (in both cases). Also keep in mind that a lot of the Supercats in use were built by
Boston Whaler 27+ years ago.

Regards,
Bob

hi,
about cat surfing, it's mostly all been written here, but the Hobie 14 wasn't mentioned. it's going to ride the small kine waves the best. getting out with onshore breeze is ajob tho. it's a job in any cat. the cats with a jib make getting out easier. the H14 was specificly designed the ride waves. the H16 and 18 were also designed for conditions like in Hobie's home surf breaks.
when it comes to a wave cat or board for that mater, extra rocker is what allows you to handle a wave. look at the TheMightyHobie18. it has more tail rocker than other 18's with boards and is really pretty slow. it handels surf and is really hard to pitchpole instead of being particularly fast. the TheMightyHobie18 is comparatively fast in force 5-6 tho. the other 17-18 footers are getting worked whilst the TheMightyHobie18 is handling. at least that is my experience racing in the SF bay area. the TheMightyHobie18 rides big waves well. we rode third reef steamer lane with both a 16 and 18. everyone on the cliff enjoyed the rides we got. for wave jumping it's important to have a line for the crew to hold on to, and footstraps. the skipper needs a seatbelt like a kayak has. the boat falls like a rock off the back of the wave and the people keep flying up for a second. the people slam into the deck if not connected to the boat. on a H14 or !6 you can dig your foot into the lacings, cleat the main and get a death grip on the side bar.


super cats by aquarious are well made no doubt. the eliptical hull is propaganda in my opinion. we did always win the races that i sailed the supercats in on corrected time and mostly boat for boat. the S17, TheMightyHobie18, Gcat5.0, and nacra 5.2 are pretty close in speed. the G5.7 is faster than all 4 above. also when i raced supercats for the factory there was a problem with people falling off the boat because of the eliptical decks.
the only real injury on a cat i've been sailing on was on a S17. we burried the bows right to the mainbeam so fast that when the mainbeam hit the water we came to a stop and the passenger with nothing to hold on to hit the mast. supercats are fast. you can make ways to stay on the boat. The trac 16 was designed after the Gcats and super17 and those designers did a great job. it burries the bow less than the gcat or supercat and is the most user friendly for newcomers. that was prolly the best boardless 16. they ended amf cats right after it came out so we don't know the speed in the hands of a top racer, but i'm sure it would compare with the competion.
i've sailed the H16 for countless hours in force 5 and 6 without pithpoling. granted the H16 will pitchpole easily in a newbie's hands, but look at the worlds videos from Hawaii. none of those guys in the top are pitchpoling compared to the Prindle16 nats. in the same location, same year where even the winner(Randy Smyth) pitchpoled multiple times. even the H14 can be kept from pitchpoling in the big stuff. the H14 worlds were almost exclusively held in winds that many classes would not start in. the top guys in those worlds weren't pithpoling. the large amout of tail rocker allows you to pull the bows up besides giving you control on a wave.

your question was loaded because there isn't a "best". whatever you can get your hands on and get out on the water is the best. if you have a choice get a strong one that can be easily repaired, and does your kind of sailing the best.

Jollyrodgers the propensity for pitch polling you described is quite the opposite experience I have had when comparing Supercats and Hobies…funny how two people can sail and/or sail with the same boat and come away with such different impressions.

Regards,
Bob