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Internal hayards #140950
04/22/08 11:57 AM
04/22/08 11:57 AM
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waynemarlow Offline OP
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Has anyone considered a way of making the spinnaker halyard internal and yet prevent water ingress when you inevitably go swimming ie have an internal pully system for raising the spinnaker and yet have some kind of valve / tube system to prevent water getting inside the mast. I want to try and clean up the mast a little ie internal downhaul, main uphaul in the luff track and spinnaker uphaul internal as well. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

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Re: Internal hayards [Re: waynemarlow] #140951
04/22/08 12:11 PM
04/22/08 12:11 PM
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scooby_simon Offline
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Quote
Has anyone considered a way of making the spinnaker halyard internal and yet prevent water ingress when you inevitably go swimming ie have an internal pully system for raising the spinnaker and yet have some kind of valve / tube system to prevent water getting inside the mast. I want to try and clean up the mast a little ie internal downhaul, main uphaul in the luff track and spinnaker uphaul internal as well. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />


Hans Runs his Spi halyard down the forestay that makes the mast a bit cleaner; but you have a block up there.

I considered an extra tube up the front of the mast (on the inside) to carry the Spi halyard get decied it might cause more problems than is solves.


F16 - GBR 553 - SOLD

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Re: Internal hayards [Re: scooby_simon] #140952
04/22/08 12:25 PM
04/22/08 12:25 PM
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waynemarlow Offline OP
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A tube doesn't quite get were I want to go that of a 2:1 fast pull system, it needs to be some sort of seal perhaps, even just to slow the water ingress

Re: Internal hayards [Re: waynemarlow] #140953
04/22/08 12:38 PM
04/22/08 12:38 PM
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That seal would have to have some tremendous resistance to abrasion, chaffing with that textured halyard buzzing across it.

GARY


Santa Monica Bay
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Re: Internal hayards [Re: waynemarlow] #140954
04/22/08 05:48 PM
04/22/08 05:48 PM
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ncik Offline
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A small exit block with a rope in it would leak very little.

Re: Internal hayards [Re: waynemarlow] #140955
04/22/08 07:20 PM
04/22/08 07:20 PM
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Atlanta
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I've often thought that if there were some sheaves in your mast cap, you could run the spinnaker halyard over the top of your mast and into the luff track on the back of the mast. There would still be a bit of exposed halyard, but far less than we currently have. There would probably be too much friction (because mainsail bolt rope, mainsail halyard, and spinnaker halyard would all be in the same track).

Re: Internal hayards [Re: waynemarlow] #140956
04/22/08 08:53 PM
04/22/08 08:53 PM
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Western Australia
Stewart Offline
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For those who have "Stealth" rigs..

I would think many times before drilling a largish hole into a carbon mast.

Re: Internal hayards [Re: Stewart] #140957
04/23/08 12:53 AM
04/23/08 12:53 AM
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Hamburg
Smiths_Cat Offline
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Hi,

Quote
I would think many times before drilling a largish hole into a carbon mast.

As an engineer I would be more concerned about drilling holes in an alumium mast than CFRP (fatigue, crack propagation, wall thickness). On a CFRP mast you can also apply an extra layer of CFRP to locally reinforce it. That's not possible on an extruded mast.
However, a single hole for a spi halyard should not be a problem for any mast.
From all these ideas I like most the halyard back to the spi pole solution.

Cheers,

Klaus

Re: Internal hayards [Re: Smiths_Cat] #140958
04/23/08 03:49 AM
04/23/08 03:49 AM
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North-West Europe
Wouter Offline
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I would worry about the mast not being watertight and creating problems when righting ?

If an additiona tube is fitted inside the mast then the bending of the mast will be altered.

Wouter


Wouter Hijink
Formula 16 NED 243 (one-off; homebuild)
The Netherlands
Re: Internal hayards [Re: GeoffS] #140959
04/23/08 05:59 AM
04/23/08 05:59 AM
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waynemarlow Offline OP
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Yes had already considered running down the luff track but I think the bend in the mast would create too many problems with drag on the rope etc.

The sort of next best solution I have considered is an exit steel pipe ( no pulley just rely on an easy bend )at the top down to an exit sheave at the base with a soft flexiable plastic pipe in between so that even if the exit hole is underwater the air pressure at the highest point should keep any water coming up the pipe. But this won't allow me an internal 2:1 uphaul

Wayne <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Re: Internal hayards [Re: waynemarlow] #140960
04/23/08 06:25 AM
04/23/08 06:25 AM
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 199
Constanta, Romania
isvflorin Offline
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You may want to use something like this
http://ro.rs-online.com/web/search/...thod=getProduct&R=2118743#header
or some type of ring type seal. Cheap in the auto shops.


Florin
Re: Internal hayards [Re: waynemarlow] #140961
04/23/08 12:02 PM
04/23/08 12:02 PM
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CA
Glenn_Brown Offline
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Quote
Has anyone considered a way of making the spinnaker halyard internal and yet prevent water ingress


My ~1971 IYE Tornado mast has a AL oval box welded through the middle of the mast for the jib halyard. There are 2 sheaves in the box to redirect the jib halyard down the luff track. The same could be done for the spinny. I've run a spinny many times on this old mast, and it hasn't folded, so the idea is structurally sound, but it would be a poor idea for a spinny halyard, IMHO, due to mast bend causing the halyard to chafe against the main sail bolt rope.

Randy Smyth addressed this on one of his boats (an 18HT, I think) by simply running the spinny halyard down to a block 12-18" forward of the main beam on the spinnaker pole. It was more exposed, simple, and it avoids creating turbulence on the low pressure side of the mast, where it is more costly.

And then there is the 'down the forestay' approach. That's extra friction/wear and slow hoists/douses on a sloop rig. I'd only consider that on a unirig, and then there is the issue of extra hardware/distance/stretch/weight. It's not exactly KISS.

--Glenn

Re: Internal hayards [Re: ncik] #140962
04/24/08 07:32 PM
04/24/08 07:32 PM
Joined: Aug 2005
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Michigan
PTP Offline
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Michigan
Quote
A small exit block with a rope in it would leak very little.


It would leak enough to make a difference though if you are lightweight and need every ounce of help to get it back up sometimes. I think any water entry into the mast- esp through an opening as high as the spin halyard needs to be ... meaning it will be under water a lot fo the time when you are on your side- would have made me turtle a couple times.


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