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Help Value a boat #153186
08/22/08 02:54 PM
08/22/08 02:54 PM
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 21
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Breakwater Offline OP
stranger
Breakwater  Offline OP
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I could use some help valuing a boat. The owner is asking too much, but doesn't want to tell me what they would take for it.
They haven't had many bites, so they say price is negotiable if I can pick it up in August.

So, Im stuck in the "game" A value would be very helpful.

Here's the deal:

Late 1970's (not sure) Tornado FIBERGLASS.
No Trailer
Has soft spots on the hull where you sit. Apparently no other soft spots.
Has Hobie cat wooden rudders (not original)
Aluminum Mast.
Has 2 mainsails, One Jib, And spinnaker (no spin pole, loose footed.)

It will cost me $150 to drive and pick it up.


I am attracted to the boat because I am pretty good at repairs and refurbishing, And I'd like to do an overhaul to make it beautiful again.

A few pictures attached. THANKS!!!

Attached Files
155999-SD532705_2.jpg (311 downloads)
Last edited by Breakwater; 08/22/08 03:06 PM.
-- Have You Seen This? --
Re: Help Value a boat [Re: Breakwater] #153187
08/22/08 03:09 PM
08/22/08 03:09 PM
Joined: Aug 2008
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Breakwater Offline OP
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Just another picture of the soft spot repair.

This hull was fixed, the other hull has the same problem in the same place and needs to be fixed.

Attached Files
156001-SD532686.jpg (220 downloads)
Re: Help Value a boat [Re: Breakwater] #153188
08/23/08 08:55 AM
08/23/08 08:55 AM
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 613
New Hampshire, USA
windswept Offline
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windswept  Offline
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 613
New Hampshire, USA
This looks like the boat posted on Craigslist for $1,500 in Maine. I also think this boat was one that I looked at in MA. If it is it went for @$300-400 from that owner. Personally, looking at the shape of the boat, rig, rudders, mast and cb's, it will take a lot of work to get it back into shape. I would value it at under $500. Good luck with it.


Tom Siders
A-Cat USA-79
Tornado US775
Re: Help Value a boat [Re: windswept] #153189
08/23/08 10:05 AM
08/23/08 10:05 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,291
Long Beach, California
John Williams Offline
Carpal Tunnel
John Williams  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,291
Long Beach, California
Have to agree with Tom - it looks like the mast has come down before. Is that a bent rotator arm at the bottom? The mast looks bent, too. LOTS of work. This boat needs a dedicated restorationist who doesn't care about money, or more permanent retirement.


John Williams

- The harder you practice, the luckier you get -
Gary Player, pro golfer

After watching Lionel Messi play, I realize I need to sail harder.
Re: Help Value a boat [Re: John Williams] #153190
08/23/08 11:22 AM
08/23/08 11:22 AM
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 4,451
West coast of Norway
Rolf_Nilsen Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Rolf_Nilsen  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: May 2003
Posts: 4,451
West coast of Norway
I have had a similar boat. Every time we went out in a decent breeze we broke something. Everything from beams ripped out of the hull to delamination, deck and hull coming apart, ripped out forestay fittings, broken rudders and centerboards.. Fixing up an old Tornado is doable, but taking it apart and checking the inside is a good move in my opinion. Old Tornados are great movers, but they did have a reputation for beeing fragile back then.

There will be a lot of work to make that boat nice again. The question is always if you want to work on the boat or sail..

Re: Help Value a boat [Re: Rolf_Nilsen] #153191
08/23/08 12:14 PM
08/23/08 12:14 PM
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 3,528
Looking for a Job, I got credi...
scooby_simon Offline
Hull Flying, Snow Sliding....
scooby_simon  Offline
Hull Flying, Snow Sliding....
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 3,528
Looking for a Job, I got credi...
Quote
I have had a similar boat. Every time we went out in a decent breeze we broke something. Everything from beams ripped out of the hull to delamination, deck and hull coming apart, ripped out forestay fittings, broken rudders and centerboards.. Fixing up an old Tornado is doable, but taking it apart and checking the inside is a good move in my opinion. Old Tornados are great movers, but they did have a reputation for beeing fragile back then.

There will be a lot of work to make that boat nice again. The question is always if you want to work on the boat or sail..


Agreed and do you want to put more money into it than it will ever be worth?


F16 - GBR 553 - SOLD

I also talk sport here
Re: Help Value a boat [Re: scooby_simon] #153192
08/23/08 01:52 PM
08/23/08 01:52 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 1,382
Essex, UK
Jalani Offline
veteran
Jalani  Offline
veteran

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 1,382
Essex, UK
I have previously rebuilt a 70's T that was in similar condition. I would NEVER do it again!

I subsequently built a new wood T from plans, and that was (and is) far easier (and possibly cheaper in the long term) than trying to get an old, soft, disintegrating boat right. If it was in the UK, that boat would be for scrap only - if you could find a buyer though, it'd be a rip-off at anything over a couple of hundred pounds. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />


John Alani
___________
Stealth F16s GBR527 and GBR538
Re: Help Value a boat [Re: Jalani] #153193
08/23/08 04:11 PM
08/23/08 04:11 PM
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 613
New Hampshire, USA
windswept Offline
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windswept  Offline
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Posts: 613
New Hampshire, USA
I looked at a damaged Sailcraft Tornado where the decks had come loose and walked away from it. I then built my own Tornado using 4mm marine plywood. It is as stiff today as it was when it was built. Again, I would look to pay under $500 for the boat but think that $200-$300 is far more likely for the boat. You will end up putting in $1500-$2500 to restore it at a minumum. I built my Tornado including purchasing mast, beams, rudders & heads and centerboards from Geoff Dobbs of Sailcraft of Canada for a total of $4873 finished. You could not build one for that today, but with the Olympics over, you will find boats and parts beginning to go on the market. Go to tornado.org and you will see some posted. There are 2 older T's for sale on thebeachcats.com for $2500 and $3200 right now including trailers. Both of these are much more modern and in relatively good shape considering their ages. Take a look at those before purchasing this one.


Tom Siders
A-Cat USA-79
Tornado US775
Re: Help Value a boat [Re: Breakwater] #153194
08/24/08 07:39 PM
08/24/08 07:39 PM
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 55
Los Angeles, CA
chrisun Offline
journeyman
chrisun  Offline
journeyman

Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 55
Los Angeles, CA
This boat is worth nothing. If you ask around enough you can find individual Tornado parts in better shape than anything you see here - for free. I'm not saying that you could assemble an entire boat for free from mixed parts, but you could get to a better starting point from which to throw away your money on a boat.

The seller of that boat should be paying you to haul it off.

If you really want to torture yourself, offer twice the value of the scrap aluminum in the beam and mast.

Re: Help Value a boat [Re: chrisun] #153195
08/24/08 09:12 PM
08/24/08 09:12 PM

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I think you're over-estimating the price.

Re: Help Value a boat [Re: ] #153196
08/25/08 02:32 AM
08/25/08 02:32 AM
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 3,528
Looking for a Job, I got credi...
scooby_simon Offline
Hull Flying, Snow Sliding....
scooby_simon  Offline
Hull Flying, Snow Sliding....
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 3,528
Looking for a Job, I got credi...
Agee with most of the above. Walk away unless you can get it for less than the scrap value of the Alu, and then scrap it.


F16 - GBR 553 - SOLD

I also talk sport here
Re: Help Value a boat [Re: scooby_simon] #153197
08/25/08 08:34 AM
08/25/08 08:34 AM
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 613
New Hampshire, USA
windswept Offline
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windswept  Offline
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Posts: 613
New Hampshire, USA
Like I said above, there are two in pretty good shape on thebeachcats.com and for the other $200-$300 if you pay anything at all. http://www.thebeachcats.com/classifieds/showcat.php?cat=1

Last edited by windswept; 08/25/08 09:19 AM.

Tom Siders
A-Cat USA-79
Tornado US775
Re: Help Value a boat [Re: windswept] #153198
08/25/08 12:37 PM
08/25/08 12:37 PM
Joined: Aug 2008
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Breakwater Offline OP
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Thanks for the responses.
Everything is pretty much right on par with what I was expecting.

Yes, windswept this is the T that was on the Maine Craigslist.

I enjoy fixing just as much as sailing, plus the winter will arrive at some point, so buying the boat will be a next-season splash.

That is, so long as the boat is refurbishable?
I've included another picture of the sag on the other hull.

Although the boat does not have a trailer, a friend does have a cedar planked Tornado, and I can borrow his to pick it up/ move it around the neighborhood.

It would stay on the beach during the summer.

Attached Files
156147-SD532696.jpg (70 downloads)
Last edited by Breakwater; 08/25/08 12:38 PM.
Re: Help Value a boat [Re: Breakwater] #153199
08/25/08 01:01 PM
08/25/08 01:01 PM
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 613
New Hampshire, USA
windswept Offline
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windswept  Offline
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Posts: 613
New Hampshire, USA
IT may be fixable, just do not pay anywhere near what is being asked. I again think this is the boat I looked at in MA in June. You would have 2 different hulls, one panthercraft and one sailcraft. Looking at the last picture though I am not sure anymore because I do not remember the decks being light blue. Nonetheless, this boat is in really tired shape for the money and look at the link that I showed you. If you decide to buy this, then good luck with the project. I can help you sort it out if needed. Do your self a favor and do not overpay for what will become an expensive project even if you paid $0 for it.


Tom Siders
A-Cat USA-79
Tornado US775
Re: Help Value a boat [Re: Breakwater] #153200
08/25/08 01:51 PM
08/25/08 01:51 PM

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Quote

I enjoy fixing just as much as sailing, plus the winter will arrive at some point


Heck, i got some parts i can send you that need alot of fixin' <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Re: Help Value a boat [Re: windswept] #153201
08/25/08 01:52 PM
08/25/08 01:52 PM
Joined: Aug 2008
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Breakwater Offline OP
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Breakwater  Offline OP
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Thanks Windswept.

Can I grab your email? I'd like to forward the full set of pictures to you (it's not a huge file), and see if perhaps this is the boat you looked at. Any additional information would be very helpful.

I recognize the cost of refurbishing. Fortunately I work in the marine field, and I have the majority of parts and equipment to make the boat sound (including a vacuum bagging system, and tons of epoxy/fiberglass)

The "trim" stuff I can get at a good rate (such as blocks/ lines, etc) as I have a wholesaler account.

i'm far more interested in refurbishing to sail, rather than refurbishing to sell.

Besides, I think those Tornados on Beachcats are over-priced.
I know he got a gift, but my nieghbor got his immaculate cedar planked T, with Aluminum Mast for $1,800

Re: Help Value a boat [Re: Breakwater] #153202
08/25/08 01:56 PM
08/25/08 01:56 PM

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one thing that isn't clear...
Are you an experienced cat sailor? those T's are very serious machines that are not for the "faint of heart". They get very powerful, very quick and are probably not ideal as a first, or even second catamaran...

If you are a seasoned cat sailor.. then its all good.. if you are not ... you may want to concider a different model to refurb... just my .02

Re: Help Value a boat [Re: ] #153203
08/25/08 02:03 PM
08/25/08 02:03 PM
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Posts: 21
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Breakwater Offline OP
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Breakwater  Offline OP
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I'm currently sailing a Solcat, while Lars Guck puts his hands on one of the windy day.........

Um yeah. I know they're fast <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Re: Help Value a boat [Re: Breakwater] #153204
08/29/08 07:39 PM
08/29/08 07:39 PM
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 21
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Breakwater Offline OP
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Going to see about the boat.... It's mine @ $300, so long as my eyes say it's worthwhile.

Thanks everyone

Re: Help Value a boat [Re: Breakwater] #153205
08/30/08 01:05 PM
08/30/08 01:05 PM
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 21
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Breakwater Offline OP
stranger
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& Oh Boy, a shipment from Guck just in time for the weekend. (picture)

Attached Files
156601-IMG_2491.jpg (65 downloads)
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